Alright, so, overall, I definitely like the more themed lists for psychic phenomena.

I also like that it is significantly more difficult to completely mitigate psychic phenomena.

That said, I dislike that its easier to manifest a psychic power when a psyker "holds back" on their psy rating (it is +10 per point of PR the psyker gives up when determining the PL of a psychic power). This seems inconsistent with the setting. Using "more power" should increase the chance of something happening.

Furthermore, it appears that Pushing has been sent so far back into uselessness/danger levels that its just a bad idea. Increasting PL by 2, suffering a -20 to the test, and turning a 10% chance of phenomena into a 90% chance is just not worth it. Given that you add PL to the 2d10 on the phenomena roll, you're just increasing your chances of popping while at the same time decreasing your chances to do anything useful, all to gain something that might be equal to +2 damage, +10 more on a bonus, +20m more on range.

I would like to see something more where

-Push is a temptation. Its powerful, and a legitimately difficult call to make. Something where you think you might survive it, but in actuality, probably won't. But to have that voice in the back of your head screaming to use it.

-Lowering the power is significantly safer, but less likely to yield results (i.e. manifest). In other words, reducing power greatly increases control (but shouldn't remove risk like what fettered did)

-Increasing PL (or rather, sticking with PR as your PL) Increases chance to manifest, increases yield of the effect, but does also slightly increase chance for phenomena (or at least affect its magnitude)

I think it might be worth going back to the +5 to the test per PR (or well, PL would be the term now). But instead of having a fettered/unfettered terminoligy, just keep having PL add to the 2d10 roll on phenomena.

I do like that Phenomena is on doubles. Its simple and easy to detect. But part of me says it should scale up somehow too.

Agree, my sentiments exactly. Psychic powers have never been about how difficult they are to cast, but how dangerous they are. Casting something should be easier the more power you use, but more dangerous.

Maybe the push should do something other than adding +2 to PL, which often has only a minor effect. Something unique to each spell. This needs to be something, as you say, tempting. e.g.

Smite

"If you push this power the attack gains the tearing and melta qualities."

Morph's idea is very good- an overbleed effect for pushing. A direct and tangible reward for a direct and tangible

consequence.

Keeping in mind that the "Fettered" mechanic should not come into play, in my personal opinion- we should only want to mess with the pushing

I actually quite like that idea, making Pushing do something special to the power at the cost of being more difficult and dangerous. I'd agree that that might work better than just adding to power level, though it should also increase the severity of phenomena, as well.

I really liked the idea of have a special quality for pushing. This makes more and more appealing for the psyker, and makes its far nore seducing than just pump Psy Rating

Seconded (or rather, fourthed - does this even exist?) FFG, please take this into consideration, as it is really a very good and novel idea!

To continue the idea, I went over the Biomancy powers thinking of some “push” effects. Nothing too complex, just the first things that came to mind. Note though that sometimes just +2 PL was actually pretty powerful.

The rule would be if you push you must use your max power level. You get the push effect of the power (instead of +2 PL), but the focus test triggers psychic phenomenon on any roll that is not a double.

Biomancy

Enfeeble

Push – The target gains d5 levels of fatigue for as long as the power is sustained.

Endurance

Push – The psyker may choose any number of targets. Each target excluding the psyker himself also heals a level of fatigue in addition to the normal effects.

Haemorraghe

Push – Each target suffers a -10 penalty to their Toughness test. The energy effect is increased to d10.

Influence

Push – The psyker counts as having the Charm, Command, Decieve and Intimidate skills at rank 5 (Amazing) for the duration of the encounter.

Iron Arm

Push – Unarmed attacks made by the psyker gain the Concussive (3) quality and deal d10+SB damage.

Life Leech

The target gains d5 levels of fatigue and the psyker loses fatigue equal to that amount. In addition for as long as the power is maintained the psyker ignores the effects of any Characteristic Decay or Weakened condition they have.

Shape Flesh

Push – The character can gain a number of the following traits equal to half the PL used; Amorphous, Amphibious, Burrower, Crawler, Flyer (2), Reform

Smite

Push – The attack gains the Melta and Sapping (2) quality.

Warp Speed

Push – For as long as the power is sustained the psyker does not spend AP to make dodge tests against enemy attacks. Enemies are at -10 to any parry or dodge checks against attacks made by the psyker.

Smite

"If you push this power the attack gains the tearing and melta qualities."

I was going to say that maybe giving melta AND tearing might be going a little overboard, the the idea is definitely great!

I believe we all agree this would be the best way to go, both in terms of game balance and making Psy even more interesting.

Alright, so, overall, I definitely like the more themed lists for psychic phenomena.

I also like that it is significantly more difficult to completely mitigate psychic phenomena.

That said, I dislike that its easier to manifest a psychic power when a psyker "holds back" on their psy rating (it is +10 per point of PR the psyker gives up when determining the PL of a psychic power). This seems inconsistent with the setting. Using "more power" should increase the chance of something happening.

This may make sense from the fluff perspective (I don't care to delve into that discussion at the moment), but it's absolutely bonkers from the perspective of game balance. It creates a ridiculous situation where it's easier to achieve greater effect - say, easier to lift a boulder than to lift a pebble, or easier to burn someone to ashes with conjured flame than to just singe him.

As long as power effect is tied to effective psy rating, slapping bonuses to roll based on the same thing creates a situation where putting as much raw power as you safely can into the roll is a no-brainer. I think we've all seen that happen in the previous systems - ever since the fettered/unfettered/push power levels were introduced, how often did any psyker choose to manifest at less than maximum PR available to him at given level? In my experience, never.

The 2e system seems to assume that the roll isn't so much about how much power you can channel, but how much control you can gain over it - from this perspective, it makes perfect sense that the less you channel, the easier it is for you to shape the desired effect. Again, an experienced telekine can probably lift a pebble without much effort, but lifting a heavy boulder will not be a walk in the park.

What happens to the excess power when you fail a roll, then? I guess it just dissipates. Unless the roll didn't trigger the phenomena, you lucked out and managed to dissipate the channeled power harmlessly. Probably not a perfect solution from the fluff's standpoint, but again, it also has to be playable.

As a workable (but admittedly clunky) alternative, if someone wants to keep the "higher psy rating, easier manifestations" relation, one could decouple actual power effects from effective psy rating - instead of the firebolt dealing d10 + PR damage, it'd deal a set amount. Then, either we would have a lot of powers with increasing difficulty and greater effects (the very clunky way) or the set effect of the power could be increased linearly by taking increasing penalties to the use power test (the preferred, somewhat less clunky way). So, a hypothetical firebolt power would start at, say, d10+3 damage, and the psyker could add, say, +1 damage per -10 penalty taken to the test. This way, we could have it both ways, with putting more raw power into it making it easier to do anything at all, but achieving greater effects being harder than minor ones.

Morangias, in my time ruling DH, RT, DW, BC and OW multiple times the PR was not that importante. Many times the effect is a good way to create a shrotcut, and so the PR in a Wall Walk, or Invisibility. Many times using the fettered option was a shortcut to reduce the literally "perils of the warp"