Hi all, a challenege here.

I've got four TIE Advanced fighters. It may have been foolish to purchase that many, but I'm looking at them and trying to come up with some fun and flyable lists that use TIE ADx1s as a major component in the list. Anyone have any thoughts, ideas on the matter?

Obvious 1st squad

Tempest Squadron Pilot - Concussion Missles - 25 points

Tempest Squadron Pilot - Concussion Missles - 25 points

Tempest Squadron Pilot - Concussion Missles - 25 points

Tempest Squadron Pilot - Concussion Missles - 25 points

What other x-pansions do you have…would help with upgrades available.

Four of every other fighter (eight TIEs total), two Slave-Is, a Falcon. For the purposes of this analysis, let's just say sky's the limit.

Maarek - Concussion Missiles- PTL - Stealth

Storm Squadron Pilot - Concussion Missiles - Stealth

Storm Squadron Pilot - Concussion Missiles - Stealth

Only 3 but looks fun lol.

It's really quite a challenge, Let's breakdown the Advanced shall we? Let's assume for this post - that while we can almost always trade in one advanced for two regular ties - that we want to keep the largest number of Advanceds possible to keep the focus on them. Please feel free to look through the theorycraft lists below - and chime in on ones you think I've understated, missed, or have useful feedback for!

We've got 2 common pilots and 2 elite pilots.

Tempest ps2 (21).

Storm ps 4 (23)

Maarek ps7 (27)

Vader ps 9 (29) ^{(huh, that totals 100….funny)}

It's a tie fighter with 2 shields, and a missile slot, target lock and it's a slight less maneuverable. That's interesting, because if we assume two shield modifications (8 points) on a tie, we're at pretty much the advanced cost for a simmilar pilot skill. Unfortunately only the two named pilots have space for elite talents. also, in comparison with an X-wing, less attack power and no droid socket.

So what can we do with the common Tie AD at 100 points? If we're looking at 100 points - Not much - we saw the obvious example above - 21x4 = 84 points, leaving us 16 points in total. That's 4 poitns per ship. Without access to elite talents, that means missiles, modifications and pilot upgrades. The problem, is that missiles and modifications are 3-4 points each - doesn't give us alot of room.

When we start going the all missile route, we end up with low pilot skill, making target lock + focus a dream, and there's not enough points to even run assault or homing missiles without dropping something. So what can we do that's unusual with 4 Tie AD? The real question - is like the Y-wing, is it worth running these without a secondary weapon ?Let's look at some non missile options - and keep the assumption that there's something better we can do without missiles and 4 advanceds.

Option 1

4x Tie Advanced lists….

- Symmetrical Builds-

A: Tempest + shield modification X4

B: Tempest + engine upgrade X4

C: Tempest + stealth x 4

A - hard to kill, hearty ties, run these together and take out one thing at a time - not bad, until you end up fighting a-wings and mirror matches where your firepower is too low to matter - still, this list could be fun to fly and has some potential.

B - Maneuverable ties, but you have to use that boost action, why didn't we invest in interceptors with shield upgrades - for something with more firepower, more maneuverability, and slightly less health for one point more cost than a tempest? I don't see any reason to go here with a squad.

C - Now we've got 4 points to spend on one of them - add a shield upgrade, or stealth + intiative chance, or add a missile back into the mix. - Probably not worth upgrading two of them to storm squad for the pilot skill boost. We now have resilliant ties that will be tough to hit - if the stealths save you from one hit - they're as good as list A - and you have enough room for a missile…

All in all - if we're going for an even squad - there's not alot of options - maybe we should look at other options for those 16 points - still ignoring the major missile options…

-Assymatrical Builds-

D: Darth + Squad leader , Maarek, Tempest x2.

E: Tempest X4 + a tie fighter

F: Darth + 3x tempest

G: Maarek +3x tempest

D - An interesting mixup - we've got some high pilot abilities, and the ability to capitalize on the squad leader talent, or drop the squad leader for any other interesting 2 points worth of talent upgrades) By itself, were not gonna see Maarek's ability come into play much without any kind of support. Still - something that could be fun to fly in a casual scrimmage.

E - 5 ties is better than four, and now we have room for some customization black squad and a cheap elite talent, backstabber or an academy pilot and modification or missile. Not enough for howlrunner though - and the regular tie is probably going to be targetted first, or last. There's also no way to keep all of your ships at the same pilot skill if you wanted to do that type of thing. - I expect that both Lists A, C and D will eat this list for breakfast.

F/G - here we've got 8/10 points worth of upgrades left- not enough for an additional ship. We've got alot more options available here - now that we have an elite slot available. We can capitalize on the elite pilot's skill and use missiles or modifications - boost and daredevil on vader? Cluster missiles, marksmanship and stealth device on Maarek? Lot's of customization here for how you like to fly. your list.

I think F/G and C are probably our strongest non "alpha strike" missile lists for 4x tie advanceds…

Option 2

3x Tie Advance lists.

I think when we move to 3x Tie advanced lists, much like rebel builds - we open up the possibilities for what can be done, and still keep the theme on the advanced. I suspect this is where we have a chance to build a squad that could be more competative in tournaments. We are now looking at a minimum of 63 points, leaving 37 points to play with… That's about 12 points per ship. This time, I'll break down the builds into Advanced and Multiship builds. (I'll build looser when it comes to multiship)

- Advanced Builds-

1: Tempest, concussion missiles and stealth x3

+Backstabber.

2: Storm, Assault Missiles, stealth x2

+Darth Vader, Concussion missiles, stealth and squad leader.

3: Storm, cluster missiles, shield x2

+ Maarek, cluster missiles, marksmanship + shield.

4: Vader, concussion missiles, Expose, stealth

+ Maarek, push the limit, concussion missiles, stealth

+ Storm Squadron pilot.

1 - Three tough to hit alpha striking advanceds and 16 points left over, enough for backstabber, or a tie and a 4 point modification somwhere - low pilot skill, but tricked out enough where they're likely to get those missiles off, but again, low firepower after the missiles are gone.

2 - This list has a little less firepower than 1, but now we've got pretty good pilot skill overall, and Vader can help with the missiles. Change out the missiles and modifications as you like - plenty of survivability. Possibly good at taking on a tie swarm with those assault missiles, and the stealth devices.

3 - This is simmilar to list 2, an elite pilot, every ship has missiles and modifications - here, we're looking at a list that should scare falcon lists…

4 - Final option - trick out both of the elite advanced pilots - and fit in a sincle advanced with whats left. We've got some strong offence possible from vader - as well as defense. Multiple actions each time - though we start to ask questions like - why don't we take Soontir instead…

These lists really showcase what the Advanced can do - but may not be so great on the competative scene - list 2 is alot of fun to play though - one of the few I've actually tried. The trouble, is in general all of the above lists from option one and two work like rebel builds, with few ships, suffering from high evade but low offense, and without the synergy that really makes the small rebel fighters hold together. Imperial lists really benefit from number of ships - so what if we take a core of 3 advanceds, and work from there?.

-Multiship Builds-

5: Tempest x3, Academy pilot x3 (99 points)

6: Tempest x3, Bountyhunter (96 points)

7: Tempest x3, alpha squad x2 (99 points)

5 - gets us up to 6 ships - we could drop an academy pilot and then field 13 points of upgrades - which could buy you vader, or missiles, modifications or better ties. Now we've got a low level swarm with the advanced to take the vanguard and let thier shields make it harder to down ties on the first pass…

6 - leaves us 4 points to play with - which is a missile, modification or now - crew or bombs. The firespray also gives us some stronger firepower and lets us keep a higher offense. We have some resilliance here.

7 - Like list 5, we have one point left, but there's no real way to spend it. The interceptors give us fragile, but maneuverable offense - we probably have to use them on the flanks. Dropping 1 interceptor doesn't really help us - because whatever it bought with the 19 points we would then have available, likely won't save the solitary interceptor from being targetted first. We could upgrade our tie advanced pilots, or get ourselves Soonti fel, PTL and stealth as our solo interceptor..

(note, other elite pilot and tempest squad combinations are possible - but when you start looking at upgraded vader and soontir fel, it really stops being about the Tie AD and becomes soontir and Vader + random ships…)

So, there you have it, a ton of lists for advanceds - the question - is which of these is the best list? and then - is that "best list" good enough? I can say, alot of these look like fun to try. If I could attend tournaments - I'd like to show up with these lists just because they're mostly pretty far outside of the current meta… I could just imagine the looks on others faces. Not sure i'd win, but they'd be alot of fun to play.

Wow excellently good wall of text post, so i won't go on showing up the possibilities of advanceds since you had them all pretty much.

As much as i want to like the Tie Advanced, whenever i try to make up a squad with a lot of them and eventually get stuck with a missile delivery squad like 4 Tempest plus concussion missiles, or with a tank squadron like A and C on your list pretty much. Or i divert from Advanceds and afterwards its a Tie-anything list with Vader (mostly) or Marek (rarely) with random other ships.

And worst of all is that when i want to make up a missile delivery list, i end up taking 4 Green Squadron A-wings with Homing missiles and Deadeye, and for tanky lists it is 4 Green Squadron with Stealth devices and PTL. Both lists are exactly 100 points and to me they offer somewhat more than the Advanced lists, sadly. It was a bad idea to make standard Ties that good and cheap and the Advanceds are compared to that (and to A-Wings) a tad overcosted if you ask me.

:nod: I tend to think all of the named pilots have a place, but it seems like not all fighters are meant to appear en masse. The basic Advanceds strike me (in the wave 2 environment) as something that fits a fliler slot in a list when you need a missile. Hopefully they'll get a boost in wave 3 - I don't think the tie-bomber can take the advanced's place. Really - the lack of elite talents hurts the advanced more. The interceptor coming in at 18 points, makes it so you'll never have 23 points left, and think - i wish I could put in two ties, oh well I could put in a tie fighter and an upgrade or a tie advanced -- now it's - oh, yeah, interceptor.

Somehow, it seems like the Storm squad really should have an elite talent - especially when placed next to the a-wing. factoring for the pilot skill, there's a 3 point difference between the a-wings and the advanceds - for a one hull difference, and the a-wing has an amazing dial…. Once you put a shield upgrade on an a-wing, you have a ship superior to an advanced for the same cost. Only thing missing is barrel roll. and slightly less pilot skill. go stealth and vet instincts on green sqd to come out ahead of storm squad with one less hull. Proton bombs wont oneshot an advanced though.

really can't think of any elite talent that would overpower the advanceds. I hope we'll get some kind of pilot modification card in the future that adds an elite talent slot - i'm not sure how much it would be worth, or if it would have to be made unique. (we can probably theory craft a cost of said card by saying - "how many points would you pay to have ptl on an x-wing? 4? 5? how many points would you pay to take deadeye on a y-wing? 3? - II think such a card would probably cost about 2-3 points (what we want, or just a bit more than what we want.) - though it really undermines the value of the unique pilots with "so-so" abilities.

I know this site has been mentioned in the past, but your question is great reason to bring it up again. It was an interesting thought since I have 4 Tie Ads. This site lets you enter in all of the core sets and expansions you own, giving you the opportunity to customize selections, and then randomly forms a Rebel and Imperial squad based onthe points level you desginate. As you enter all of your holdings, just deselect the pilot cards for the non Tie Adavnced ships, and go to town. With a couple of minutes of setup, you can get a whole mess of of different configurations and play with what you like from that.

Here's the link.

http://fabpsb.free.fr/#etiquette

It took me a couple of minutes to enter my ships list and to deselect the ships I didn't want to use. My collection is the following:

2 core sets

1 Tie fighter

4 x Tie Advanced

2 x Tie Interceptor

1 x X-Wing

3 x Y-Wing

4 x A-Wing

1 Millenium Falcon

I Slave One

After that, I just had to click the button and it gave me a random squad in a couple of seconds. Good luck!

I hope i'm not too late to join in but i was quite excited to see this subject as i only just started to try building some tie advanced squads.

I realised they had been sadly neglected amongst my ships.

Ravncat really did a good job of covering all the options but i would liike to add a couple. The first i had the chance to play last week, only one game unfortunately, the other is my attempt to improve it.

Vader + Concussion Missiles

Maarek + PTL + Concussion Missiles

Bounty Hunter

100pts

I played this against a Garven, Wedge, Lando squad and have to be honest i lost, but all he had left was Lando with one hull.

I made a couple of flying errors so think that next time i could win but also i rolled above average attack dice so give or take the flying errors.

The best thing for me was that my opponent was so thrown by seeing Tie Advanced flying at him it completely put him off while he tried desperatly to remember what moves they had on thier dial.

Next time i shall try this next squad just to try and cover a few more angles, will let you know haw it goes.

Vader + Concussion + Determination

Maarek + Veteran Instincts + Homing or Assault

Bounty Hunter

I know i am sacrificing the target lock focus Maarek had before but the shooting first all game may tip the balance.

Hope it is food for though

Ravncat said:

Yes, sadly that is exactly true, i have complained in the past about the wave 1's Y-Wing cost but in fact if you look at A-Wings and Advanceds, you have 3 points cost more for one hull and on Green squad you have an elite skill on top of it.

Bjorn Rockfist said:

I do this but with cluster missiles instead. Either obviously works. I tend to use 2 or 4 of these together as missile boats in a target driven scenario.

ive played this build and was surprised how competitive it was…

Vader + Engine Upgrade + assualt missiles + Determination (38)

Maarek + homing missiles + push the limit (36)

Turr + Vetern Instincts (26)

***************************************************************************

im currently testing this version…

Vader + Engine Upgrade + assualt missiles + Squad Leader (39)

Maarek + Engine Upgrade + homing missiles + push the limit (39)

Howlrunner + push the limit (21)

the plan with PTL on howlrunner is to use his double action to focus and evade boosting his defense

I am loving the look of both those squads Brown Bomber and so it is with great regret I point out the small error that Vader with upgrades adds up to 40 not 39. No biggie, squad still comes in at 100pts.

That over my respect to your ideas and comments on all posts I've read.

Looking forward to hearing how the second squad fares.

If I may make a suggestion would you consider down grading the homing missiles to concussion and drop squad leader to put a stealth on howlrunner to really make him annoying.

I have had near 95% success at getting 4 hits with concussion and Target lock + focus.

Also I would be interested to hear your first few turns strategy for flying this squad. In my mind I don't quite understand the need for squad leader.

How about this:

Darth Vader + Squad Leader + Assault Missles

Maarek Stele + Push the Limit + Assault Missles

Tempest Squad Pilot + Assault Missles

+ Stealth Device on one of them

Use Vader to give Tempest Squat Pilot target lock so all pilots can fire their missles with target lock + focus. You can always swap in your favourite missle, if you prefer something else.

I have subsequently flown both squads I wanted to try again and find they are just too fragile/risky. They can be fun squads don't get me wrong but they pay off early or not with no happy medium.

You need to fly an almost perfect game and have above average dice to make it work, once the missiles are gone this is even truer.

I find although lucky dice are a big part of the game i can live with, this these squads leave no margin of error.

I think once the Tie Bomber comes out we may see the death of all the advanced except Vader.

swampthing said:

opps, my bad, yes can downgrade vader to concussion missiles to make the 100pts.

squad leader is there to add to the versatility of the other ships by letting them perhaps barrel roll unexpectedly during vaders action step or throwing an evade on maarek or howlrunner when they do not have stress. its a experimental build so will see how it goes. its quite possible that squad leader will be better served on maarek.

Ravncat said:

I've actually been considering this. You get some relatively hard-to-kill TIEs. Half the firepower of an 8-TIE swarm but, with Stealth and 2 shields each, about twice the survivability. Plus, throw that missile in there and it's got a little more firepower.

On the other hand, four Tempest pilots with one missile each has the firepower of 8 TIEs for one turn at least.