Hannibal_pjv said:

A Spirit Pippin is already coming. They have never made a duplicate Hero in the same sphere so I don't know if they would start now. Pippin doesn't really fit in any other sphere though. And as said before none of the Hobbits in Fellowship fit in Tactics. Though these are likely the only hobbit heroes we will see in the entire saga expansions, with the exception of Frodo (too many other cool characters to do them over again) so we may be getting a Merry/Pippin from after their adventures.

Its surprising they will make a tactics hobbit considering how difficult it was for FFG to make a tactics dwarf period. Only one of the 13. Still a low threat, high questing hero with a good support ability is something tactics is missing.

richsabre said:

they'll probably just include them as a location card or two. the box is supposed to cover the journey from hobbiton to rivendell, so they must get included somewhere.

i suppose it would have been quite hard to make a whole quest out of the old forest because what is the story? they could fight a few trees and wolves, and bats i suppose, and the conclusion would be them safely reaching tom bombadil's house. but what else can they do with it… not much.

the barrowdowns would have been a bit easier, and they could have included some new treasure cards as well, because isn't that where they find their weapons? (im a bit rusty on the plot of the book!)

Cunir said:

well yes, i hope they do. i could probably think of some quest ideas, but it would mean that they would almost take up another saga pack themselves.

in fact i think that ffg have made less exciting areas of tolkien's work into quests - i think the old forest and barrows would translate rather nicely.

i mean who wouldnt want to face old man willow? it could be a great quest, with a wait for bombadil to come to the rescue. and yes the downs would make nice areas for the swords.

thats why im pretty dissapointed

rich

richsabre said:

They need material for all those Gencon packs. The next one will be the dead army, but maybe we will visit the barrow downs after this one.

muemakan said:

like osgilliath? feels a bit underwhelming to use them that way

I don't see why they can't include the barrow wights and the old forest either at the end of the first quest or beginning of the second… The first hobbit box did a nice job of combining separate parts of the adventures. The stone giants/goblin king…riddles in the dark/escape from goblin town/ escape via eagles. Hopefully they're just as creative with this expansion

richsabre said:

I agree completely. Personally I'm sick of FFG making these "recreation" quests where they take an adventure the Fellowship went on and copy it directly into one AP, especially when you can't actually play that quest with Frodo as the ring-bearer. It just takes all uniqueness of that adventure away for me. But who knows, maybe they'll do some sort of pack with the Barrow Downs or the Old Forest compatible as well with the One Ring card and Frodo. One can only hope…

I read Black Rider is a 'Saga Expansion' (whatever that means). Is it possible to play it as a stand-alone-game or do I need the basic Lord of the Rings: The Card Game to play this one?

Bjbu said:

like the previous saga expansions, it's stands likely you will only require the core set

Thanks for the answer!

i've just realised that they've dumped the baggins sphere. i was hoping we might be able to reuse all the baggins cards we got in the hobbit box in these ones (even though there were only a couple). they could have put the new frodo hero in the baggins sphere as well, and built it up as a proper sphere with lots of cards.

although i suppose frodo isn't really a burglar. but it would have been cool if we could have got some more use out of the hobbit box cards. they are kind of like dead cards now.

this is a long time in the future… but im guessing that secrecy will make a big comeback at some stage in these sagas. because lots of people are going to want to play with just 2 heroes -- frodo and sam -- as they trudge their way to mordor. (unless they make gollum into a hero too -- why not? they could fiddle with it a bit so he could still fight and quest, but have some bad side to him too). the last quest is just calling out for frodo and sam hiding and keeping secret as they climb mount doom, dodging all the enemies. it is perfect for secrecy. it wouldnt seem right taking anyone else along with us.

mm… gollum as a hero - i like that. i think he should be able to be a 4th hero in your deck, with obvious drawbacks

rich

richsabre said:

In prevoius Lotr card game from Decher Gollum was a shadow card and Smeagol was a free people card. So he can even fight with him self it was quite theamatic.

Here we can have some kind of flaws which i happen in the begin of the quest by random effect……..so ith can be quite funny.

starhawk77 said:

So, I just thought I would say to the Forum that I am EXTREEMLY happy with the direction this game appears to be taking…particularly regarding the new hiding mechanic showcased on some of the spoiled cards. It appears that I will be able to enjoy one of the experiences dear to my heart. I just love sneaking.

I was a Lord of the Rings fan before I knew how to tie my shoes. I love, love, LOVE this game. One thing that I found myself wishing I could experience was a sensation I had when reading the books of “narrowly” escaping detection. I wanted this so badly that, when I collected the Decipher CCG I tried in vain to build a sneaky hobbit deck from day one. This was unfortunate, as the hobbit race (each faction was its own little sphere, usually divided by race, but sometimes subdivided by country) was neglected time and again until the very end of the game. By then, however, all the other races were so powerful, only blind stupid incompetency in my opponents would allow my Sam, Bilbo, Frodo, Pip & M “Sting” deck win. I don’t learn very well, because as soon as I discovered that there was a secrecy mechanic coming out, I started organizing my game to accommodate the new cards. It goes without saying that my decks really stank. The Secrecy mechanic was (I assume) abandoned as cumbersome & my dream of sneaking slowly faded. Many times have I, when espying the tantalizing spoiler for an upcoming release, chatted my LoTR Captains Facebook page about how this time there is a chance for secrecy! This time, with the Twins! This time Elrond! This time the mother…er…Father of all Secrecy Hero’s, Glorfindel, will see it done! (Benhanses can attest)

Now…

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you FFG (& well done).

@ brownmantle: During the second year of the Decipher game there was a time when the Frodo/Sam Deck with 4x "A promise" was one of the best. I wouldn't say they neglected the hobbits.

Sorry for OT.

Smeagol… Yeash of cource my presioushh… He can even be the fourth hobbit as Smeagol is/was a hobbit in the beginning before the power of the ring corrupted it to that bizarre grazy character he ended to become… This is not likely thing to happen, but a Smeagol as an hero is allmost likely. But most propably he will be an object card like Arven was in Mirkwood cycle.

But definitely we will see Smeagol in one form or another: Ally, Objective - Ally, hero etc…

Rubinon said:

Yes this deck was one of the most powerful decks in the game in the latest time……

My two cents for the 4 hobbit heroes in the expansion are, a new Bilbo (especially since most people do not like the current lore Bilbo) , Sam, Merry and Bull Roarer Took !

Hastur360 said:

Ehhh no. Sorry, I don't think so, and here's why.

I've seen Rosie Cotton & Bilbo Baggins & Bullroarer Took mentioned in ths thread, but Bullroarer to my knowlegde is dead by this time. (so NO way he'll show up. Bilbo is already in rivendell as he left when he gave the ring to frodo; and these saga expensions really follow the books so Bilbo, I think is out. Then there's Rosie…nice idea..but I don't see her popping up as a hero until the scouring of the shire chapter, when she starts playing a role really.

here's my thoughts of the 4 hobbit heroes: (following saga i.e. the book)

1. Tactics: farmer maggot -> he stood firm (with 3 of his hounds) against a black rider. no other hobbit in this part of the book seems to fit taictics any better than maggot's deeds helping the hobbit's escape detection. And if they don't implant him here in the saga, where then?

2. Lore: samwise -> he loves elvish lore and in this part of the book he goes on about them. I believe later on in the saga we will see a spirit and tactics sam with high willpower in the mordor stage against shelob & on mount doom. (along with a gollum hero mind you)

3. Spirit: fatty bolger -> the only reason I add him here is of the simple fact that he won't be able to show up anywhere else in the saga. I know, he left early because of fear, which gives him low willpower, but not all spirit heroes need high willpower; maybe fatty will get a good abiltiy? Just a hunch…

4. Leadership : -> dead hard to determine. FFG said 4 HOBBIT heroes. none seem to fit but frodo; and he's taken. My best bet is Merry actually.

Just my reasoning.

I'm far from an expert on the story, but from a quick bit of research on the plot and characters my guesses are:

Sam (Spirit)

Merry (Tactics)

Farmer Maggot (Lore)

Bilbo (Leadership)

Fatty seems to be the other likely candidate. I'm assuming we won't get a second Pippin so soon after the first (I suspect we'll see him again later in the saga). I would've picked Gildor as a shoe-in if they hadn't announced 4 hobbits.

Does it says anywhere the ONLY heroes are going to be the 4 hobbits?

SiCK_Boy said:

No, only that we will see Frodo and 4 hobbits. So it is likely that we allso see other heroes in here. Early story heroes include Aragorn definitely.

After we get to the Rivendel, we will get Legolas, Gimli and Boromir again… Hard to say if we see others… It is possible though, but I would not bet on them… Gandalf would be one, but he seems somewhat hard to balance hero, unles his treath cost is something like 30-40… or his abilities has to be really weak, So Gandalf Ally is more likely, but it is not impossible to see Gandalf as an hero. Maybe we can run solo Frodo + Gandalf decks :-)

Glorfinder is possible, because he appears in the Road and saves the day in Bruinen (instead or Arven that was put in his shoes in the movies). Barliman is another, but same problem as with Fatty… not very active in books. Maybe as an lore character? Hmmm… Not so many characters in the beginning of the book. Tom and Coldberry, but better as an objectives or in event cards… And most propably we skip them again… It would be really nice to see some seriously sexy Goldberry as an card, but not likely to happen… Farmer Maggot was mentioned and he is a good candidate to an hobbit, maybe even better than Fatty. Maybe some unnamed ranger as an adjuntant to Aragorn. Later there are good candidates more. Like a hero version of Faramir in the Ithilien part and so on…

Because this expansion is a stand alone with core (Like Hobbit expansions vere), we will definitely see new Pippin, even one version is coming out in other expansion. Core set offers Aragorn, Gimli and Legolas (+ Gandalf) so what we most propably get are Pippin, Merry, Sam and Boromir, so that we will have the full Fellowship. The next best bet is a hero Version of Gandalf to this group… just interesting to see if he is a worth of putting in the deck as an hero… The ally version is so good!

Gandalf - a friend of Shire folk
threat cost 25
Willpower 4
Attack strengh 4
Defence Strength 4
Hit points 4
Istari
Gains one multisphere resource token in the beginning of each round. Can not gain resource tokens in any other way.

Gandalf - a grey emissary
threat cost 25
Willpower 4
Attack strengh 4
Defence Strength 4
Hit points 4
Istari
Does not belong to any sphere. Can use his resource tokens to play any event cards recardless of its sphere.

Gandalf - member of Gray counsil
threat cost 12
Willpower 4
Attack strengh 4
Defence Strength 4
Hit points 4
Istari
Does not belong to any sphere. Can use his resource tokens to play any ally cards recardless of its sphere. Increase your threat by 2 at the end of the round.

Hard character to balance… so maybe we don't get him anyway….

i think we shall certainly see gildor given he was in this area of the book. perhaps not as a hero though

rich

im guessing that this first box wont include people like boromir because it only covers the journey up to rivendell. the second box will be where the fellowship actually joins together and sets off, so we will probably get a few new fellowship heroes there (hopefully).

we've already got a strider version of aragorn and 2 boromirs, so i reckon it will be gimli and legolas and maybe a hero gandalf. maybe we'll get a new version of elrond too, because that will be his main scene in the story. i dont think he gets a bigger scene in any of the other books.

I just saw (on the "upcoming" page) that this one's due for "Q3 2013" so it may be released before AtS is wrapped up (also "Q3 2013"; October/November if they stay on schedule), or else right after.