There are a number of characters that can perform character abilities when they are not in play.

For example:

Catelyn Stark

Challenges: Put Catelyn Stark into play from your hand, knelt as a defender…

Bloodrider

Response: Kneel 2 Influence and put Bloodrider into play from your hand to cancel the effects of a character abilitiy just triggered.

My question revolves around when character abilities are legal targets for Death by Payne

Death by Payne

Response : After a character triggers its character ability, kneel Sir Ilyn Payne or a Noble character to kill that character.

I was told that when the character, say Bloodrider "triggers" its ability it is not yet in play, and thus cannot be killed. Is this correct? I could see how this would be correct, but it seems like it might be debatable.

Thanks for the answers!

-nihil

A card ability is an effect triggered on a card in play. That's the reason that effects on characters that are triggered from your hand are not considered to be character abilities. It's a subtle difference, but an important one.

…Thank…you.

?

Sorry, I don't understand. Are you saying that an ability like Bloodrider's isn't a character ability? Where is this sort of interaction explained in the rules? Could you more explicitly explain this difference or point me to where the rules or FAQ talk about it?

-nihil

(3.6) Triggered Effects

Any effect that a player chooses to execute is considered a "triggered effect." Thus any effect that begins with a "Phase:" or "Response:" is a triggered effect. Also note that playing an event card is thus considered a triggered effect. A "triggered ability" is a triggered effect printed on a card already in play.

So, since Death By Payne kicks in after a character "triggers its ability" (i.e., uses a "triggered ability"), and "triggered abilities" are, by definition, card abilities that are used by players when the card is already in play, the card has to be in play when the effect is initiated for the play restrictions on Death By Payne to be satisfied.

The thing that isn't making sense to you is what the word "triggers" does to the interpretation, not the word "ability."

nihilistiskism said:

This is probably the part most relevant to your question. I bolded the part that is pertinent to this thread.

" If I bring Meera Reed (Tourney for the Hand F2) out of Shadows by her Response effect, can she target The Red Viper (PotS F1) to blank him?

No. While Meera Reed's come into play effect when she is in Shadows is considered a card effect …"

This applies to all cards in an out of play state. All cards triggered effects are "card effects" (not character abilities) when the point of initiation is from out of play.

Well, all character abilities are card effects, so the part that Ktom posted is more relevent, as it explains what is required for the card effect to be considered an ability. Namely, it is an effect triggered on a card (character for a character ability, of course) in play.

J_Roel said:

True. I was more addressing the OP's question in the second post. Not sure we even cleanly answered the first question, though.

Bloodrider can not be killed by Death by Payne because it is considered a card effect, but not a character ability, as it was triggered from out of play.

Ktom can come in and fix this sentence if it's inaccurate, lol.