New FAQ and Shadows added to Timing Structure

By Bomb, in 2. AGoT Rules Discussion

Has anyone else noticed that FAQ v. 4.0 has added "Bring out of Shadows" as a FW event step 2 to each of the "Phase X Begins" framework actions?

The Shadows rules state:

"Each card that comes out of Shadows is treated as a separate action, and must be fully resolved (including all responses) before the next card is brought out of Shadows."

So, how does that work with Beginning of Phase passive effects and responses? I mean, should we treat it like FW Steps 1 - 2 happen for each player in order starting with the first, and that Step 2 is treated like an entire Player Action for Shadow cards?

The card effects that brought this to question is Jaime Lannister (LotR) being knelt by Alchemist's Guild Hall's response. Jaime Lannister stands at the beginning of each phase passively.

Thanks!

Edit: This also contradicts the moribund rules of the original "Bring out of Shadows" player action. Arya Stark originally could be killed and put into the Shadows. She could then potentially be brought back out of the Shadows by that player if they still had a chance to bring out a shadow card at the beginning of the phase.

Bomb said:

So, how does that work with Beginning of Phase passive effects and responses? I mean, should we treat it like FW Steps 1 - 2 happen for each player in order starting with the first, and that Step 2 is treated like an entire Player Action for Shadow cards?

So follow the rules text. Each card that comes out of Shadows is treated as a separate action . The fact that it is represented as a framework event on the flow chart does not make it behave like other framework events because the rules text specifically tells you that it is not a framework event (by telling you it is an action).

And, as the rules say, all passives and responses to the card coming out of Shadows are resolved completely before you move on - and that cards come out of Shadows before any other passive/response effects to "at the beginning of the phase" take place.

So it's the same as it always was. All the addition to the flow charts really does is reiterate the fact that all cards come out of Shadows (which the rules tell us includes passives/responses to them coming out of Shadows) after Steps 1-3, but before Steps 4-6, of the "begin phase" framework window.

Bomb said:

The card effects that brought this to question is Jaime Lannister (LotR) being knelt by Alchemist's Guild Hall's response. Jaime Lannister stands at the beginning of each phase passively.
before

Bomb said:

Edit: This also contradicts the moribund rules of the original "Bring out of Shadows" player action. Arya Stark originally could be killed and put into the Shadows. She could then potentially be brought back out of the Shadows by that player if they still had a chance to bring out a shadow card at the beginning of the phase.
action

Thank you for your reply ktom. :-)