In the German version of the game, the "sweep"-ability of Giants and Trolls says that all figures within two spaces are affected. This would mean that monsters are affected as well.
Is this wording of the sweep-ability translated correct? Or does the english version say that only enemies/heroes within two spaces are affected?
Yeah, I believe "figures" is a non-specific catch-all for pretty much all types of units with health. Maybe it wouldn't work for, say, the Geomancer's summoned stones, but other than that I think everything but the giant/troll himself gets caught up in the sweep.
The way I look at it is … You have three figures standing next each other in a row, first a hero, then a goblin, then another hero, all within the giant's reach. It would make no sense if the giant were to swing his club, hit the first hero ,magically skip the gob in the middle, then hit the hero on the other end. Just for consistency and the sake of logic, I would think the sweep affects all figures with in range, whether friend or foe.
BatHead said:
The way I look at it is … You have three figures standing next each other in a row, first a hero, then a goblin, then another hero, all within the giant's reach. It would make no sense if the giant were to swing his club, hit the first hero ,magically skip the gob in the middle, then hit the hero on the other end. Just for consistency and the sake of logic, I would think the sweep affects all figures with in range, whether friend or foe.
Well, what if the two heroes are fairly tall, the club would sweep over the little gobbo's head and only hit the heroes
.
Graf said:
In the German version of the game, the "sweep"-ability of Giants and Trolls says that all figures within two spaces are affected. This would mean that monsters are affected as well.
That is correct. Most AoE attacks, Sweep included, affect ALL figures, friendly or enemy within the affected area.
Sym said:
Yeah, I believe "figures" is a non-specific catch-all for pretty much all types of units with health.
"Figure" is a defined game term that refers to any "hero" or "monster" in the game. LTs are considered "monsters" and therefore inherit the status of "figure" despite not actually being a plastic figurine. Some NPCs and familiars are called out explicitly as being "treated like a hero figure," but that's on a case-by-case basis.
It's probably true that most "units" which have a health rating are also "treated as figures" if they aren't actually figures by virtue of having a plastic figure to represent them, however, there may be some exceptions. By default , any figure represented by a cardboard token is NOT a figure, unless the rules say otherwise.
Sym said:
Maybe it wouldn't work for, say, the Geomancer's summoned stones, but other than that I think everything but the giant/troll himself gets caught up in the sweep.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure the summoned stones specifically say "monster" instead of "figure."
Dam said:
BatHead said:
The way I look at it is … You have three figures standing next each other in a row, first a hero, then a goblin, then another hero, all within the giant's reach. It would make no sense if the giant were to swing his club, hit the first hero ,magically skip the gob in the middle, then hit the hero on the other end. Just for consistency and the sake of logic, I would think the sweep affects all figures with in range, whether friend or foe.
Well, what if the two heroes are fairly tall, the club would sweep over the little gobbo's head and only hit the heroes
.
That is correct. Most AoE attacks, Sweep included, affect ALL figures, friendly or enemy within the affected area.
And what about the giant itself ? He has LOS to itself and is within 2 spaces . . . ?
Edited by carsten1977You are not in line of sight of yourself, though.
Edit: Maybe you are, if the LOS is a point at one of your corners drawn to that same corner. Perhaps the giant's sweep is supposed to say "each other figure." Question submitted, good catch!
Edited by ZaltyreAnd what about the giant itself ? He has LOS to itself and is within 2 spaces . . . ?
Well, Sweep says that you perform an attack that affects all figures within range.
The "range" for a Melee attack is "an adjacent space." The space occupied by the giant is certainly within LoS, but it is not adjacent to itself.
Giants also have Reach, which "allows Melee attacks to target figures up to 2 spaces away. " This could be interpreted as meaning "range within 2 spaces," which would include the Giant itself within the Sweep radius. Or it could be interpreted as a shorthand for "adjacent and 1 space beyond adjacent," which would continue to exclude the Giant in the center of the whirlwind. IMHO, the latter would be more consistent with the basic rules for Melee attacks, but I admit it's an ambiguity.
We should also consider exactly where this "2 spaces away" limit is being measured from. We don't pick a specific space within the Giant's footprint to measure from, as we would for a ranged or magic attack. That would leave the sweep radius lop-sided, rather the centered on the Giant figure. Instead, we measure two spaces out from all sides, putting the Giant in the center. In my opinion, that adds support for the latter Reach interpretation as well. We're taking all spaces adjacent to the Giant (which excludes the Giant's spaces themselves) and all spaces 1 beyond those as the AoE for the Sweep.
You can play that the Giant sweeps himself if you like. IMHO, whether or not the rules support that idea hinges upon how you interpret the rules for Melee attack "range" as discussed above. Zaltyre has already sent in the question, so we can hear what FFG has to say about it, officially. However, I already know which interpretation I support, official or not. =P