Fear of a Slow Death

By Maine, in Dust Warfare General Discussion

Posted at

While talking to the owner of a local shop about Netrunner and Dust Warfare, he expressed fears that the game is languishing and dying a slow death, strangled by FFG's distribution model.

He said DW sales have been declining; what started off strong is quickly falling off, and DW will (from sales perspective at his shop) soon become a has-been game.

His concerns were valid, ones we've voiced before. We've come to accept them, come up with solutions, even gone so far as to rationalize them, perhaps in the hope that they were simply growing pains and FFG would resolve the issues. However, 8 months on and nothing has changed. Our tolerance and acceptance of the situation has gone beyond coping and hoping, and it may be time we start to express our concerns to FFG if we want the game to have a healthy future, and not go the way of AT-43.

This discussion is in the context of an FLGS that offers in-store gaming. Ideally customers will be purchasing product in the store, but even if they aren't the health of the game can be judged in part by whether people are chosing to play the game over the other games available.

1. Core units not available separately

Being a store, it's bad business to direct people to ebay or online singles sellers to pick these up units, and pushing the idea of buying another Core set for another unit or two is a hard sell. Suggesting reselling the other units, or even just trading, would not go over well with most consumers - that is a level of effort they should not be expected to put forth.

2. Heros not available outside of expansion packs.

Given the price of units at $15 to $20, and $20 for a 3-pack of heroes, pushing a $40 purchase to pick up 2 heroes (when you might only want 1 if you play a single faction). Thus the effective price of a single hero is between $20 and $40.

This was supposedly going to be resolved with 3-packs of heroes from earlier expansions, but I have heard no progress on this front.

3. Lack of Warfare unit cards causes difficulty while playing.

Customers wonder why there are Tactics ones but not Warfare ones. Not everyone will come to the forums to find the fan-made ones. This is partly related to the next point:

4. Core Rulebook layout needs work

A unit has a list of rules in the rulebook, and a list of weapons. These weapons may have special rules, but those rules will be buried in a section of the book that is 90% fluff and easily overlooked. These embedded rules should at least be emphasized through formatting.

I told the shop owner to contact FFG's B2B sales rep and express his concerns. I'm curious if anyone else knows if their FLGS owner is of the same opinions.

Posted at

Maine said:

While talking to the owner of a local shop about Netrunner and Dust Warfare, he expressed fears that the game is languishing and dying a slow death, strangled by FFG's distribution model.

He said DW sales have been declining; what started off strong is quickly falling off, and DW will (from sales perspective at his shop) soon become a has-been game.

His concerns were valid, ones we've voiced before. We've come to accept them, come up with solutions, even gone so far as to rationalize them, perhaps in the hope that they were simply growing pains and FFG would resolve the issues. However, 8 months on and nothing has changed. Our tolerance and acceptance of the situation has gone beyond coping and hoping, and it may be time we start to express our concerns to FFG if we want the game to have a healthy future, and not go the way of AT-43.

This discussion is in the context of an FLGS that offers in-store gaming. Ideally customers will be purchasing product in the store, but even if they aren't the health of the game can be judged in part by whether people are chosing to play the game over the other games available.

1. Core units not available separately

Being a store, it's bad business to direct people to ebay or online singles sellers to pick these up units, and pushing the idea of buying another Core set for another unit or two is a hard sell. Suggesting reselling the other units, or even just trading, would not go over well with most consumers - that is a level of effort they should not be expected to put forth.

2. Heros not available outside of expansion packs.

Given the price of units at $15 to $20, and $20 for a 3-pack of heroes, pushing a $40 purchase to pick up 2 heroes (when you might only want 1 if you play a single faction). Thus the effective price of a single hero is between $20 and $40.

This was supposedly going to be resolved with 3-packs of heroes from earlier expansions, but I have heard no progress on this front.

3. Lack of Warfare unit cards causes difficulty while playing.

Customers wonder why there are Tactics ones but not Warfare ones. Not everyone will come to the forums to find the fan-made ones. This is partly related to the next point:

4. Core Rulebook layout needs work

A unit has a list of rules in the rulebook, and a list of weapons. These weapons may have special rules, but those rules will be buried in a section of the book that is 90% fluff and easily overlooked. These embedded rules should at least be emphasized through formatting.

I told the shop owner to contact FFG's B2B sales rep and express his concerns. I'm curious if anyone else knows if their FLGS owner is of the same opinions.

ours have been fine, mostly because most of our Warfare players also play Tactics. Warfare was always meant to be a companion to Tactics, but it's definitely taken on a life of its own. Warfare being forced to cater around Tactics holds it up a bit. Hopefully after the new year, we'll see FFG come up with some kind of agreement with Dust Games to be able to keep Warfare in a more side by side relationship, but it's up to them to negotiate that. It definitely won't go the way of AT43 for two reasons. Paolo has good funding and even if Warfare only players die off (which I hope never happens), Tactics only and Tactics/Warfare players will still thrive.

Posted at

blkdymnd said:

ours have been fine, mostly because most of our Warfare players also play Tactics. Warfare was always meant to be a companion to Tactics, but it's definitely taken on a life of its own. Warfare being forced to cater around Tactics holds it up a bit. Hopefully after the new year, we'll see FFG come up with some kind of agreement with Dust Games to be able to keep Warfare in a more side by side relationship, but it's up to them to negotiate that. It definitely won't go the way of AT43 for two reasons. Paolo has good funding and even if Warfare only players die off (which I hope never happens), Tactics only and Tactics/Warfare players will still thrive.

I was under the impression Tactics-focused sales were higher than Warfare, and mentioned this, but the shop owner was surprised - he didn't know anyone who played Tactics. I'm not really sure how FFG could tell the difference though - every single Tactics product is useful for Warfare, while the opposite is not true.

Posted at

Maine said:

blkdymnd said:

ours have been fine, mostly because most of our Warfare players also play Tactics. Warfare was always meant to be a companion to Tactics, but it's definitely taken on a life of its own. Warfare being forced to cater around Tactics holds it up a bit. Hopefully after the new year, we'll see FFG come up with some kind of agreement with Dust Games to be able to keep Warfare in a more side by side relationship, but it's up to them to negotiate that. It definitely won't go the way of AT43 for two reasons. Paolo has good funding and even if Warfare only players die off (which I hope never happens), Tactics only and Tactics/Warfare players will still thrive.

I was under the impression Tactics-focused sales were higher than Warfare, and mentioned this, but the shop owner was surprised - he didn't know anyone who played Tactics. I'm not really sure how FFG could tell the difference though - every single Tactics product is useful for Warfare, while the opposite is not true.

to my knowledge Tactics has done extremely well. I agree that it'd be impossible to measure who's buying for what. You'd just have to gauge sales of the Warfare campaign books. Your owner might not see much in Tactics sales, but I think it's doing very well in a broad scope.