Ok we've seen the Rebels, now time for the Imperials.

I've been unable to get some decent 100 point builds for the Imperials, whereas for the Rebels it is so easy. start off with 3 ships, change the pilots, then add whatever upgrades you want with the remaining points till you hit 100. Also, my 7 TIE builds are getting torn apart by Rebels like some slaughterfest, especially if asteroids are in play. oh well, I'll go first and share my current builds:

favourite:

Howlrunner + squad leader

2x Obsidian TIEs

2x Storm TIEadv + 2x concuss missiles

a rather strange build for the imperials, especially with the low number of ships fielded. The idea is rather simple. Howlrunner uses squad leader to turn either TIEadv into fake Darth Vaders, or turn your Obsidian TIEs into fake Night Beasts, then concuss missiles to deliver the hurting to major targets eg. Luke, Wedge, any bugger with R2D2, Darth Vader etc. With a bit of luck and maybe a bit of follow up shooting, it is possible to take down 1 target of your choice on the 2nd turn with 2 missiles and a bit of follow up shooting. Pilot skill points are intentionally kept the same for easier maneuvering in pairs, and kept high to ensure that you would shoot first when up against all those swarmy players. yeah, you can see those academy TIEs and rookie Xwings suck it. Hard. Just take extra care of Howlrunner, if she kicks the bucket you are in for a pretty tough fight. TIEadvs tend to go first because they are more tanky than your average TIE, and can usually divert attention away from Howlruner, especially if they still have missiles left.

currently most used:

the TIE allstars

Howlrunner + squad leader

Mauler Mithel + Determination

Dark Curse / Night Beast / Winged Gundark / Backstabber

nothing much to say about this build, but I'm loving the randomness of it all. Depending on your starting positions, you can have totally different fights and really wacky and fun battle scenarios. As you can see, I'm kinda addicted to Howl + squad lead, and determination because you have 1 point left over. really fun and random, although it isn't anywhere near competitive or lethal or anything like that.

I'm not a big fan of Tempest/Storm Squadron pilots. I think you're better off bringing a couple of Academy pilots.

This Imperial squad I've been messing around with:

• Howlrunner, Squad Leader
• Maarek Steele, Marksmanship, Cluster Missiles
• Backstabber
• Mauler Mithal
• Obsidian Squadron Pilot

Use Squad Leader to give Maarek a Target Lock and Marksmanship in a single round and get off those Cluster Missiles early, hopefully getting some crits through to make maximum use of Maarek's ability. Howlrunner synergizes well with Backstabber, Mauler, and Maarek, as all three have built-ins whose effectiveness can be maximized with Howlrunner's built-in and Squad Leader. Use Squad Leader to get Mauler/Backstabber into the right position with Barrel Rolls while also getting them that Focus token they need to really lay down some hurting. Or keep getting Maarek those Target Lock/Marksmanship turns with a reroll.

Offensive though this squad may be, I still recommend the majority of your actions being Evade, though, especially against Rebel squads. Evade is the mechanism by which Imps survive those hard-hitting Rebels. It's not quite as crucial against Imp squads, but I still think it's the single highest-value action in the game.

Duraham said:

Your second list is much more competitive than your first.

Your first list has major issues. Storm pilots instead of Tempest are a total waste. They should only be used to try to reach 100pts if you don't have anywhere else to spend points. The same is true of the Obsidian Pilots. Howlrunner works best with more ships; having only 4 other ships on her team won't allow for good use of her ability. I also don't like squad leader on Howlrunner because she is such a target compared to everything else. So far that is 8 points wasted. That's 2/3 of an Academy Pilot. Remove one of the missiles and you can add a whole extra ship.

The new list would look like:

Total Squad Points: 100

Pilot: "Howlrunner"
Tie Fighter

Pilot: Academy Pilot 1
Tie Fighter

Pilot: Academy Pilot 2
Tie Fighter

Pilot: Academy Pilot 3
Tie Fighter

Pilot: Tempest Squadron Pilot 1
Tie Advanced
Cluster Missiles

Pilot: Tempest Squadron Pilot 2
Tie Advanced

It's still not a good list by any stretch of the imagination, but it is much better than it was before. Pilot skill is majorly overvalued by most players. It's a tertiary concern behind ship abilities and number of ships (ships with abilities tend to have decent pilot skill anyway).

The TIE Allstars list (good name for it) is better because it has better ship abilities, more ships, and even has better pilot skill. The list isn't even that much softer because it runs Dark Curse, Night Beast, and Determination. Because it has an extra ship, the list has a total of 18 hull vs. the 19 hull/shields of your other list.

The 8 Tie swarm is very effective.

I prefer to play the Tie allstar team though. All the named Tie fighters on one team make a very effective team. Split up into pairs with mauler, backstabber, and howly in different groups. The enemy is forced to either focus on one group (allowing you to flank and destroy with special abilities), or try to face off equally with each group which favors the Imps as they seldom have enough firepower to level 1 Tie out of each group. Then after the first round the TIEs need to swarm all over the board in unpredictable ways then. Don't stay paired off, go after other targets and focus your attacks.

My 100 Point Imperial List

I’m currently using the Imperial Swarm from the Assemble Your Squadron article. This is my fall back. I tried different mods with this so that I could use multiple swarm tactics on the Academy pilots but giving up the missile to do this was devastating.

My second list that I have been messing with is as follows.

Vader with a concussion missile = 33 pts

Maarek Stele with concussion missile = 31 pts

Three Academy Pilots = 36 pts

Strategy is simple, pick the biggest target on the table and shoot into it with the missiles on the first turn. Chances are you just took it out. If it is Luke or Wedge it is an eight point for thirtyish swing in the game. I then use Vader and Maarek to fly past the rest of my opponent’s ships and set up to flank the rebels as the Academy pilots tie them up for a turn or two. I always try to focus on shooting down one rebel ship at a time. I did have this list loose to two rookie pilots and two gold squadron Y-wings with ion cannons and torps. My opponent targeted the Academy pilots first and it made me one bad roll away from getting owned. The end was Vader and a crippled Y-wing and a crippled X-wing. I miss judged a move and Vader overlapped the Y-wing and took no actions. He crippled the Y-wing in the shooting phase but was overwhelmed by the X-wing and then the Ion Cannon.

ShadowJak said:

I don't think your suggested build would work for me, because it doesnt give missiles for both TIE advs and removes the squad leader tactic, which is what i'm aiming for. 2 actions for anybody + missiles + howlrunner's ability. I will still give it a try though when i have the chance, seems workable, and an extra ship is always better than an extra missile. Anyways, after reviewing your suggestions, I came up with this instead. What do you think about this?:

Darth Vader + squad leader + missiles

Howlrunner + swarm tactics

Tempest TIEadv (couldn't fit in the missiles due to points)

academy TIE

academy TIE

somewhat similiar, but at least now howlrunner can expect to survive a little bit better as she has access to 2 actions herself, while the other ships can still benefit from her effect and squad leader if howlrunner isn't using it. I still get 2 TIE advs that can do 2 actions, and my squad now gets to attack earlier than the previous build thanks to swarm tactics. thoughts?

and also anybody tried out a build with multiple TIEadv yet? eg. like 3-4 of them, similar to rebel Xwing builds

Tawnos said:

managed to try out this build, pretty effective , but i changed backstabber to dark curse, and downgraded obsidian TIE to academy TIE to give Mauler determination. many thanks for sharing.

generally, i tend to prefer more defensive options, such as Dark Curse over Backstabber, Luke over Wedge, R5 astromech over R2 astromech etc.

Duraham said:

Good idea to protect howlrunner with Vader + squad leader. She is strong and may be the first target for the rebels. My setup is a bit more agressiv and less devensiv. Due to "the best defence is the strongest offence". I disagree that pilot skill is underestimated. Howerver I agree with "quantety goes for quality". So I tried another - more rushing - setting.

How it works:

Vader, Howlrunner and Mauler with swarm tactics made 4 pilots Rank 9. When fly close in one group and rush in with 5 forward in round one. Mayby in T formation, first line Academy - Mauler - Academy, secound line Howlrunner, then Vader, or in H formation with Vader an Mauler on first line, Howlrunner and the two Academy TieF in last line. Then all [exept one] your pilots attack [Vader with ClusterM] first in round two and you have a good chance to kill one Xwing [Antellis oder however is the strongest, or has R2D2] befor he can even hit you. In this build I would prefer focous instead of evade deu to maximum firepower, maybe only Howlrunner chooses a evade [hoping he will survive this round]. With a bit of luck it's even possible to kill 2 Xwings in round two. Then the game is nearly decided. If not, ships stay in formation try to focus on one traget, get aus close als possible an kill one ship after another.

The setting:

TieAdv - Darth Vader
Swarm Tactics - Cluster Missile

TieF Howlrunner
Swarm Tactics

TieF Mauler Mithel
Swarm Tactics

TieF Academy

TieF Academy

It's 98 points, so you WILL start at first, even when the Rebels have 99 oder 98 Point, or against IMP with 100 or 99 points.

Swarmtactics said:

I edited the quote to remove the wall of text. Hopefully it turns out right.

Having initiative is generally bad. Being at 98 points is just wasting 2 points. Swarm Tactics x3 is 6 points. Cluster Missiles is 4 points. That's a total of 12 points which could be spent on another Academy Pilot.

ShadowJak said:

but his entire squad bar one TIE gets to shoot first as all of them are psuedo 9 skill-points. maybe I'd upgrade the academy TIEs to Obsidian TIEs to get 100 just nice, and swap out darth vader's swarm tactics for squad leader, as 9 vs 8 doesnt have too much of a difference except against wedge. I'd change cluster missile to concussion missile too, but that really depends on how many Ywings i'm facing.

while more ships is always a good thing, I do not agree on exchanging x3 skill upgrades and a missile for an extra Academy TIE, especially if you are playing with obstacles, which will severely reduce the impact that the single 2 attack dice TIE has. Like in his case, 4 ships firing at 9sp compared to 9-8-7-1-1-1 is quite a big difference, if you are facing a 3 ship rebel build your academy TIEs will be taking the full brunt of their attacks and there's a very high likelihood that they'd die before even firing a single shot, or maybe even have 2 TIEs kick the bucket if you took some damage while navigating the obstacles. at least with the 3 swarm tactic option even if they do die they'd still get to shoot back, and if you manage to get rid of any ship before they get a chance to fire back at you, you will be saving a couple of hp as well, which makes up for the difference in hp that an additional ship grants to your squad.

ShadowJak said:

ShadowJak said:

Jap, sorry for the wall.

Having the Initiative is not that bad, it depends on the situation. For instance, when fighting a Rebel Swarm (4 Rookie Xwings) it is useless und a wast on points, I agree with you. But fighting Antellis, Luke or Horton Salm, you get the chance to hit und kill him first. So having x3 Swarm Tactics is expensive but worth it to fast kill the best pilot in the opposite team. In this situation it is one good Xwing, less instead of on normal TIE more.

Duraham said:

Pilot Skill and Upgrades (including torpedoes) are vastly overvalued on these forums. Just the fact that a TIE absorbed 3 hits is huge; the possibility of shooting back is just a bonus at that point. Also, not getting to shoot back assumes the rebels focus fired on an academy pilot instead of one of the named ships.

This is all entirely abstract so lets take a real team as an example:

Total Squad Points: 100

Pilot: Biggs Darklighter
X-Wing
Upgrades:
R2-F2

Pilot: Wedge Antillies
X-Wing
Upgrades:
Proton Torpedoes
R2-D2

Pilot: Horton Salm
Y-Wing
Upgrades:
Proton Torpedoes
Ion Cannon Turret
R5 Astromech

This is probably the highest pilot skill 3 ship team that is still viable (Yes, I know it would have been possible to take Luke but then Wedge or Horton would get lit up even with R2-D2).

Against the 6 ship list, the rebels won't be attacking Vader because he has too much HP for a couple of torps and they wouldn't want to waste the highly probable crit on his shields. Even if they did and killed him, he'd still get his attack off because he has skill 9. That leaves howlrunner and mithel at skills 8 and 7. Howlrunner will still most likely get her attack off because 1 torp from Wedge probably won't kill her (especially if she has a focus) and she'd get to attack simultaneously with Horton if his torp knocks her out. That leaves Mithel and the 3 scrubs as possible targets where lower pilot skill will probably come into play.

Lets say the Rebels kill Mithel before he attacks; the Imps still have 5 attacks left in the first turn. If the formation is tight, they all get a pseudo target lock from howlrunner. If they went after howlrunner instead, then that is 6 attacks with no pseudo target lock apart from Vader's real lock. The only real shortfall of this list compared to the 5 ship list is that biggs will be hard to kill when taking all the hits with 3 or 4 defensive dice because of his droid. If the rebels can keep him mostly at range 3 with the droid on, the imperials will have serious problems without access to a missile to soften him up.

When starting with the 5 ship list you will end up with 9-9-9-8-8 after swarm tactics (Vader to Mithel to Academy, Howlrunner to Academy). Even if the rebels kill one, they will probably all get their attacks off. However, the best case scenario is 4 attacks with a pseudo target lock and a missile (this first turn missile is possibly really powerful because it is focused from Vader). If the rebels attack howlrunner first, the 1 other ship with 8 skill might not get the pseudo target lock. (Note: in this case, initiative is good because it allows the imperials an additional pseudo lock)

If howlrunner does die, the Imps will be at either 9-9-9-1 or 9-9-7-7 in the next round. Either way, there is a good chance one of them is dying before attacking, so all those Swarm Tactics become useless and the imperials will only get 3 attacks as opposed to 4 attacks from the 6 ship list. Their only hope at this point is that biggs died in the first round after being softened up by Vader's missile.

That's just the way I see it.

Swarmtactics said:

It's not your fault, the forum software FFG uses isn't very good. Even short conversations turn into walls after a few quotes.