mdc273 said:

Meh. I don't think I agree with a lot of what you say here. Where are the grounds for any banishment or thread removal? Because some people think Damon is Penfold and are seeing if anyone can confirm? Because some people do not like Damon's attitude toward them? Like you have the right to post, others have the right to post suggestion that something fishy is going on here. Some people want some answers if there is any truth behind the OP.

If no good can come out of this, does that imply that only bad can come out of this? What is bad? Truth?

What is the definition of "no good can come out this"?
Here are some ideas:

Drinking poison
Committing a crime in front of an on duty police officer in public
Shooting yourself in the face

Here are some ideas on what could be good or bad:

Gambling any amount of money
Attacking or defending with Crastor with a chance to lose the challenge
Driving during inclement weather conditions
Drinking milk when you are lactose intolerant

Here are some ideas where it's likely good all the time:

Drinking water when you're thirsty
Having a new job offer
Saying hello to someone
Going all in with the best possible poker hand in Texas Hold'em

Now where does this OP fall under? Always a bad thing? Maybe the OP has been forgotten in the sea of threads responding to one post about Damon specifically.

When you little scamps get together, you're worse than a sewing circle.

but seriously my favorite part of this little witchhunt was hearing people associated with the collusion at the Melee Table complain that if Penfold is in fact Damon he might be snooty towards them. . . . . .. . . .. . . . . better get those torches

This thread is embarrassing.

Alternatively…..

This thread is entertaining

Really? Really.

Oh, BTW everyone ever has had difficulty in making their World card…ask Dobbler and his Flea Bottom.

Wow, when I left home on Sunday for a trip the forums were ghostly quiet. What a difference four days makes.

This thread disturbs me. While it raises my curiosity (an understatement, actually), and I am typically in full support of transparency especially as it relates to customer engagement, I feel an “outing” like this (if it in fact is true) is problematic and counterproductive.

The biggest problem, I think, is that an alter ego or pseudonym is meant to protect the author from personal attacks that have arisen in response to expressed “alternative” views. Moreover, though I haven’t seen it explicitly stated, the undertone from some posters seems to be advocating for some sort of official reprimand. Not only is there little justification for this – such a reprimand would be the EXACT OPPOSITE of what we want as a community, because it would likely have a chilling effect on the part of FFG and their employees at a time of unparalleled openness. In short, this “outing” (if in fact it proves to be accurate)will ultimately harm the community’s efforts to build bridges and encourage FFG to be more open.

But putting the problematic aspect of this post aside, I think one can make a strong argument in defense of Penfold’s somewhat controversial posts, assuming he is Damon. I’m not saying I agree with these posts…in many cases I completely disagree: Finite raised such an example in his post on page 1…I wholeheartedly agree that Corey and Erick acted responsibly in their collusion at World’s last year. That said, I feel it important to point out the following:

Comments made by an “alter ego” posting under a pseudonym are not necessarily the views of the “real” individual. We all have many identities – and we may choose a different identity depending on the situation. For example, when I go to work, my identity may be one of professionalism, reliability, trustworthiness. But this identity may be too difficult to maintain 24/7. Sometimes, I prefer to let loose, play AGOT obsessively, have a few beers, and allow my “gamer identity” to take over. To use an extreme example, an investment banker or surgeon who works long hours may spend the little free time he has getting trashed and sleeping around. He may be more productive or attentive during his day NOT despite the irresponsible alter ego, but BECAUSE that inebriated, promiscuous alter ego allows him to blow off steam. We may question his ethics, but just because he is chauvinistic in his off time doesn’t mean he’ll refuse to work with female colleagues or fondle a woman on the operating table. Simply put, an alter ego is just that—an alternate to the primary identity.

In addition, I strongly believe (and I think most libertarians would agree) that a variety of views are important to drive innovation. Different views inform different approaches and spur creativity. Assuming Penfold is Damon, we are talking about someone who reflects on the game and its direction; if he doesn’t see an important perspective adequately represented on the forums, it seems to me it would be his obligation to represent that view. I draw the line at inflammatory or overly negative language, but online forums always lean a bit inflammatory, and I don’t think he’s crossed the negative threshold (though I can see how Finite may feel otherwise, given the comment about banning someone who colludes).

Twn2dn said:

I am going to take a different tactic than normal and try (keyword there is try, im not promising anything) to make a coherent statement for once, because I have a ton of respect for Dan, but I completely disagree with the above statement. For those who would rather not listen to a serious dcdennis, skip to the *** below.

The below opinion is completely independent of the Penfold identity debate which is moot at this point, I am speaking generically.

The global meta of this game is a delicate ecosystem that is ever changing of its own momentum. If there is 'an important perspective' that is not 'adequately represented' in this community, then the meta as a whole has decided that said perspective is not important, otherwise it would have come upon the perspective on its own naturally (or will eventually if given enough time). Why should one person get to unilaterally decide that the entire meta 'doesn't get it'. I absolutely agree that different views are vital to drive innovation, however if the problem is that the card designs are not inspiring "different approaches" or "spurring creativity", should the proper solution be to artificially inject these things into the meta, or should the root cause be fixed by changing the direction of the card designs to something that would inspire these different approaches and spur creativity on their own, without assistance.

I hope that for once I have relayed an opinion without causing more trouble in the process. If I did, for once, that wasn't my intention. Erick's post aside, my only dog in this fight was to learn the truth. I hate being lied to (edit: or generally deceived).

***Here is what I would have written if anyone else had written the above post:

"…if he doesn’t see an important perspective adequately represented…..it seems to me it would be his obligation to represent that view."

This sounds like the same reasoning Christian missionaries used to force their religion on the natives.

I will only note that Penfold has yet to refute the allegations in this thread, nor has he denied the disturbing rumors of pederasty.

Draw your own conclusions.

@ Twn2dn: Thank you for composing a thoughtful response to the thread. I'm glad that to say it raises your curiosity is an understatement.

Regarding FFG's openness. If Damon really is posting on the forums under Penfold as a pseudonym, it really isn't about FFG openness. If anything, it's intentionally misleading communication from FFG employees. It's an employee posing as a player. Penfold's posts are not giving us information regarding FFG's plans for the game. He doesn't tell us about reprints, what new cycles will be focusing on, spoil any cards, or inform us of prize support at events. Instead, Penfold is advocating for a specific view on the game. As far as any reprimand, I'm not calling for one. It has been brought up, but I believe as a question as to what would happen. Every now and then someone asks why we do not get official FFG communication on the forums, and inevitably someone replies that it is against FFG policy for their employees to be posting on the forums without getting specific approval for every post.

This leads to an assumption that anyone wants to silence Penfold. Whether Penfold is Damon, a casual player, or a member of the competitive community who is afraid to make his or her posts under a primary account, I do not say he should be silenced. Penfold is free and welcome to express opinions as part of the community, if he is a part of the community.

Regarding pseudonyms, if Penfold really is a member of the community posting under a second account out of fear to express actual opinions, then I think that shows a problem with the community. Since there are some members of the community on his sides of the various debates and the Thrones community at large is one of the best around, I hope this is not the case. If it were someone posting under a pseudonym for another reason, all I can think of is it would be to invite reaction against the opinions stated by Penfold given the tone in which his posts are made. This assumes someone who believes the opposite and wants more people stating the opposite. If that were the case, I think that person would likely have come forward by now to disprove the questioned link between Damon and Penfold. Outside of those two options, I'm not sure where you're going with the "alter ego" argument.

Finally, regarding multiple opinions, I do believe that having many opinions in the community on the game and its direction adds value. If Penfold is Damon, and Damon believes there is an important view absent from the community, he would have many other and better options at his disposal as the lead designer to put forth his opinion. He does not need to stoop to posting what others have described as some of the most "caustic" posts on the forums behind a pseudonym to get around his employer's policy prohibiting him from posting.

OK folks. This has gone on long enough. I had been hoping the whole, ridiculous "conspiracy theory" thing would blow over, but it's been four pages now….

Penfold and Damon are not the same person.

I didn't say anything earlier because I don't know Penfold very well. He is primarily a CoC player. That probably explains why no one has a strong memory of him from AGoT competitive events, either. I was introduced to him at one Gencon or another, though, while assisting with pairings for CoC.

Anyway, Damon's "handle" before he got the job at FFG was "dormouse." Penfold and dormouse overlap on the boards (in fact, Penfold joined first - probably because CoC moved to these forums before AGoT did). So, for this "same guy" theory to be true, Damon would have had to have been posting under two different personalities even before he got the job at FFG, abandoned one when he got the job, but not the other. We're starting to stretch credibility here.

Part of the problem is that people seem to be starting with the assumption that they ARE the same. All the coincidences start looking a lot like "proof" when you start that way. But if you start with the assumption that they are NOT the same person, it starts looking like maybe the two are friends who game together with some regularity. In fact, if you start with the assumption that they are different people, all the reasons why they might be the same start looking kind of silly. I hate to invoke Goodkind, but it looks like a "Wizard's First Rule" problem to me!

Anyway, they are different people. Can we put the wild speculation to rest?

Thank-you.

ktom said:

this doesnt offer up any more substantial evidence to prove they ARENT the same as we offered to say they ARE the same. In fact it offers significantly less. Both are circumstantial at best. So if one conclusion is flawed, they both must be. Shocking that the one person who can undeniably end this is two seconds, and shove this up all our asses, is somehow MIA for 48 hours now,….

dcdennis said:

dcdennis said:

Then you must be part of the conspiracy ;P

edit: this is hardly a ringing endorsement btw: " I was introduced to him at one Gencon or another, though, while assisting with pairings for CoC. "

The reader doesn't get the sense that you could pick him out of a lineup.

dcdennis said:

Yeah, but I was introduced to 80% of the AGoT players at one Gencon or another, too. I couldn't pick them out of a lineup, either. I couldn't match board names with any of them. Heck, if I ran into most of this community on the street, I wouldn't have any clue who they were outside of the Gencon/game store context. And in most cases, the context wouldn't help me identify them, either.

The point is, I've met Penfold before. It wasn't for long, and it was in a limited context. I couldn't describe him or pick him out of a crown to save my life. That doesn't change the fact that I know Damon on sight. I don't need to be able pick Penfold out of a line-up today to be able to recognize that the guy I met by that name then fell into the "not Damon" category.

Oh, and I am part of the conspiracy. But… which conspiracy?

rings said:

Not me!

ktom said:

It is ktomed.

it is ktomed.

Penfoldjunior said:

I agree, time to shut this post down because it is hurting our community's great image.

Just one final question for penfold: are you coming to worlds? And can I get 10 minutes in the bar with you to talk shop?

I guess that was two…

I would like to say one final thing to Penfold directly. No one hates you, no one dislikes you no matter what your true identity. Please do not mistake our inquiries into your identity as anything but rampant curiosity. Like pinnochio, we all just want you to be a real boy, but are desperately afraid that you are only made of wood. Your posts, though not always productive aren't near as bad as half the stuff I post. So come out to worlds, put this matter to rest once and for all, and I will publicly humiliate myself as pennence by doing the gangnam style dance on top of my melee table.

signed,

(your future bestie)

dcdennis

I won't be happy until I see Penfold's long form birth certificate!

For those who missed it, Penfold identified himself in the Cthulu boards in a cross-referenced thread looking for someone who knows him in real life. He and Damon were part of the same meta back before Damon started working for FFG. If my memory serves me correctly when I was a fresh noob inquiring about the game's direction, our current designer hails from CA.

@Rings, Mathlete, and Laughing Tree, why didn't you just tell us he's from your state? You could have cleared this up quickly.

@Penfold, this is no witch hunt. Many of us were genuinely curious. Yes, had you come here and only posted, "not Damon" it wouldn't have been enough. But telling us your meta, and therefore who on the boards you play against, is more than sufficient proof that you exist. To prove no hard feelings and that this is not a witch hunt, if you are at worlds or any other tournament where I'm at in the future introduce yourself. I'll buy you a beer and you can get more than just 10 minutes with me in a bar. ~Such a good friend Damon is, he won't give you as much time in a bar as a stranger on the boards. I guess that's what happens when the student becomes the teacher . In all seriousness, GenCon must be a very busy time for FFG employees. Maybe worlds will be less busy and he can join us for that beer.

The t-shirt company just called me. The Penfold avatar image was copyright'd so they refused to make the shirt They actually said 'several' companies have rights to the image….what is it? I've never seen it anywhere else.

I'd probably speculate that Penfold is more likely one of the playtester community--it would fit all the facts. Close working relationship with Damon, advance knowledge of upcoming cards and developers' thoughts on the game state, and if he's part of Damon's meta from way back, no reason it's implausible.

And he probably *can't* confirm or deny any suspicions because there's the Oath Rod from Wheel of Time, the Unbreakable Vow from Harry Potter, and THEN there's Fantasy Flight NDA's.

1.) Umm, the internet is full of people who seem to like wasting people's eyes with ass kissing, for every person that ******* about FFG shitting in their cereal you have the others that are cookoo for coco puffs. So someone towing the company line just means they know how to use a keyboard.

2.) People will lie about supposed inside knowledge to prove their point, just look at wikipedia.

3.) Those with personal issues with Damon are better off resolving said issues off the boards, its embarrassing. This is what getting drinks with friends are for, or challenging Damon to a duel (or a dance off I suppose?)

4.) And this is the final one, Ktom has been in this game for so **** long, and is a VERY trustworthy source, if he says they are not the same person, I would trust to that.

bloodycelt said:

Uh oh. Celt kicked the sleeping giant.