dreddwulf1 said:

I imagine we'll start seeing blaster deflection rules as we get closer to Force & Destiny.

As lots of other folks have noted, FFG appears to be going for an Original Trilogy feel for Edge of the Empire, and going by the movies, the only time we saw blaster deflection and reflection in combat, was Return of the Jedi, where Luke was pretty much a Jedi Knight in all but name. Even in the Prequel Trilogy, we really only saw blaster deflection/reflection being done by people that were either at Jedi Knight level of ability or better.

A deliberate design choice was made to not let the PCs be able to become Jedi Knights or other highly-proficient Force-users, and that is going to result in some abilities simply not being available to the PCs until much later in the product line.

Personally, I'm thinking Blaster Reflection would be a talent found under a Jedi specialization(s) rather than a separate Force Power or bend-out of the Sense Power. Could probably add it to the Force specializations for Sith as well. Don't know enough about Jensaarai to determine whether they should or shouldn't be able to reflect blaster fire.

Perhaps mechanics-wise, the Blaster Reflection talent would trigger if the foe rolls a certain number of Threats on their attack roll. It would certainly make that Deflect quality that much sweeter… once the PCs have a way to get access to it (which I'm thinking would also be a talent, to let the Jedi character add the Defensive and Deflect quality to their lightsaber when wielding it).

Donovan Morningfire said:

Week two? Why wasn't it kept for week 3-5? OK, then. However, what about Vigilance, the book claims that it has a use as well.

Donovan Morningfire said:

I think a multi-level talent much like the Defensive quality would be the way to go. Jensaarai studied lightsaber forms so I think it would apply to them as well. But they also wore armor so it probably wasn't as much of a focus.

Chris Brady said:

Week 2 was when it was introduced, and has been kept for all the following Week # Updates. It's towards the far end of the file, since that's where the Force Chapter is located, towards the back end of the book.

Nothing so far on Vigilance, though in another thread I posited that's it's already important in regards to the Uncanny Reactions talent, allowing for "Jedi Reflexes" and the ability to react to danger faster than other characters.

It could also be old data that's not yet been removed like the "opposed check" elements listed for Brawl and Melee because unlike those skills, it's not really getting a lot of attention at the moment.

Donovan Morningfire said:

True enough. That said, there is ALOT more material than just the movies stating that not only were other Jedi Around (I ended up finding a few scattered in different novels), but Jedi weren't the only people able to do it. The Antaran Rangers could do it, to name one, as well as the Mandalorian guards protecting Princess Satine in the CLONE WARS Series and The Jensaarai who were still very much active in that time frame. There are a few others scattered in the other books, but the movies are far from the only source to draw from. Considering that none of it could exist without the LUCASFILM stamp, it's all technically cannon, anyway.

As for learning the skill, even the Jedi had to start somewhere. All the knowledge of the Force didn't just spring up from nothing. The Jedi had to experiment to come up with this stuff, why not allow PC's to do the same?

I get the fact that the Original Trilogy had a certain feel that this game wants to engender. Problem is, Star Wars grew into what it is because the original trilogy wasn't nearly enough to go on for those fans who truly love the setting. The Original trilogy wasn't the end of Star Wars, should it really be the end in the game?

Hi:

I have a question about the Force Sensitive Exile Specialization itself, I was wonderin' if this is the right place to axe it:

What exactly happens to a Character when the player "gets rid of" the Force Sensitive Exile Specialization (to make room for more Specializations)?

Thanks!

L

LETE said:

Good Question! If I read the updates correctly, you don't get rid of any specializations anymore, it's just that they are more expensive the more you buy. For example, A second Specialization within your career costs 10 points, if it were out-of-career it's 20 points. The third would be 15 career spec. and the out of career 30 points, etc. (The cost is 5 times the total number of Specializations you have for Specializations within your Career, 10 times the total number for those out-of-career).

Question on that….does this happen to Force Power Trees as well? The Book gives a flat rate and the book doesn't directly address it that I see.

dreddwulf1 said:

hello!

I've been looking at the Updates but haven't found anything about this in any… That's why I was axing this in the first place… Couldya please point me in the right direction?

Thanks again!

L

That would be WEEK 6 page 2 of the Updates.

Acquiring New Specializations (page 65): Delete the paragraph
“Purchasing an additional specialization within a career…” and
the paragraph below it “Each character may only have three
specializations at any one time…” Replace with the following:
“Purchasing an additional specialization within a character’s
career costs five times the total number of specializations he
would possess with this new specialization. So a character with
one specialization could purchase a second career specializa-
tion for 10 experience. If he wished to purchase a third career
specialization, it would cost 15 experience.
“Characters may also purchase additional specializations
outside of their career. Purchasing non-career specializations
costs ten times the total number of specializations he would
possess with this new specialization. So a character with one
specialization could purchase a second–non-career–spe-
cialization for 20 experience. If he had two specializations
already, a third specialization that was also a non-career
specialization would cost 30 experience.”

Right there in the text. just not mentioned again so it can be easy to miss if you are skimming rather than reading. You don't 'get rid' of ANY trees anymore.

It is a decent question, just the rules changes answered it in an indirect way. Sorry for double posting, still mastering these forums.

EldritchFire said:

Not quite…. it's putting the blade in the path the bolt will take so that it hits somewhere else. Enough advantage should allow you to hit someone else with the blaster shot…

I apologize if this has come up, but do the duration upgrades apply to the Influence power's ability to inflict strain on a mind?

Thebearisdriving said:

I'd say they don't, as I'm pretty sure the Duration Upgrades were worded in such a way as to only be applicable to the mind trick upgrade.

I've got a question for you fine folks, regarding a ruling I made. I'd like some validation on it. (Or rebuttal of it.)

In my "Amnesia" game of EotE, my wife made a force-sensitive rodian bounty hunter, who poured everything into the Sense force power. It took her all the XP from our last session, but she's now got:

- Sense Basic Power

- Control Upgrade 1

- Duration Upgrade

- Strength Upgrade

- Control Upgrade 2

So… she can, as an ongoing effect, choose to upgrade the difficulty of 2 attacks per round that target her - OR (with that 2nd Control Upgrade) upgrade 2 attacks she makes per round.

Here's the question - the Strength upgrade reads: "When using Sense's ongoing effects, upgrade the difficulty of the effect one additional time." I ruled this only applies to the first control upgrade ongoing effect, due to the wording of it. That's the one that increases difficulty. My wife (being my wife…) proclaimed that the Strength upgrade should also apply to the 2nd Control upgrade ongoing effect, allowing her to upgrade her attacks twice.

That seemed too much, to me. So I said no.

What would you have said?

GM Chris said:

I agree with your ruling, if only because the Strength Upgrade in the tree specifies "difficulty," and the 2nd Control Upgrade makes no mention of difficulty in its effects, just that you upgrade an Ability die to a Proficiency die.

Now regarding the Duration Upgrade, I'd say that could only be applied to the defensive ability, but that's more due to really only being able to make one attack roll per round, particularly with the update to two-weapon fighting, but that's more of a personal interpretation.

Also (mostly out of curiosity), are you treating each Ongoing Effect as a separate power? Because I'm pretty sure that's what they are, separate powers, and that you'd need a Force Rating of 2 in order to have both of them going at the same time. At the very least, allowing both Ongoing effects to be maintained at the cost of a single Force Die seems a bit too good of a benefit, particularly given concerns in prior systems of Force-users coming to dominate combat (WEG with the Combat Sense and Lightsaber Combat powers, OCR/RCR with the Lightsaber Defense talents and scaling lightsaber damage, SWSE with how easily Force Powers could be used at lower levels).

I completely concur with DM, especially making sure that each seperate ongoing power needs to be fueled by its own force die.

Side question: what action did you rule for activating the ongoing power (activating it as in commiting the force die). The rules state un-commiting the force die is an incidental, but they don't really talk about action type for commiting the force die.

I'd be satisfied in any case, though I feel if it's an incidental or maneuver, it should be restricted to the begining of your turn.

Thebearisdriving said:

Thanks.

As for activating an Ongoing Effect, I've been treating it the same as activating a Force Power, requiring the Force-user's action, though I could see allowing the Force-user to preemptively activate the defensive upgrade if it looks like trouble's a-brewin'.

@Dono:

Yeah… she can only make 1 attack a round now, so it's kinda moot. But who knows what the future will hold? ;-) And yes - I treat each ongoing effect as a separate effect. I think that much is clear in the rules. She has to choose which one to use, and when.

@The Bear

I treat activation/switch as an incidental as well, but I'm extremely fluid with it (I think the game enocourages loose play, and that's one of the things I really enjoy about it). For my own sanity, I laid it out before the first session that she needs to make the decision at some point on her turn, and she can only activate ONE per turn - regardless of "when" on the turn that is. She was cool with that.

She also wanted to "hide" the fact that she was force sensitive from her own party. And with the Sense power, that's totally feasible, there's nothing overt about it. (Plus, it's an "Amnesia" game, so her Force Use is entirely instinctual at this point.) So we even worked out a "code" at the table. She sits next to me, an taps my arm with 1 finger if she's using the Defensive Control power, and with 2 fingers if she's using the Offensive Control power. It's worked well! She's tracking what's active, and after I call the dice pool difficulty, she modifies appopriately on her own - with me watching to make sure it's correct. It's been fun!

For the first session - until the players caught on - they were like, "HOW IS SHE SO GOOD!!!???"

(And as a note, our first session was before the beta update that change how The Force works… so her previous character creation build was invalid. It took her all the XP she earned from the next session to get BACK to where she was originally at character creation. She's sooooo bitter… LOLOL… I told her the last update came out this week. Her response, "Hmmph. Are they still punishing force users for being badass?" "Yes, honey, they are." "Hmmph. Still bitter.")

The best part of that story is the "hmmph"s.

I imagine her sittign with her arms crossed and an expression that says, "I'm not impressed."

Thebearisdriving said:

It's even funnier if you've had the chance to meet her in real life

Thebearisdriving said:

Yeah. That's my wife.

FIERY redhead. Much passion in that one. (This is both very good, and at times… very bad… but worth it.) ;-)

I realize this is a bit after the fact, but I feel that it is too easy to throw about silhouette 3 and 4 objects.

I propose that the strength upgrades increase the maximum size of an object that can be lifted, and the size of the silhuette be added to the force point cost of activating the power, possibly even more.

For example: if I understand the RAW, to thrust a silhuette 4 object at an opponent and deal 40 damage you would only need the appropriate upgrades and to obtain two force points on a roll, trivial for a force rating of 2 ( and a discipline check at difficulty 4). This means that a Sufficiently trained padawan could throw around the falcon.

With my proposed fix: to throw a silhuette 4 object would take 5 force points. One to activate the power, and 4 for the object. However, to move a silhuette 1 object would still require only 2 force points.

Also, shouldn't the difficulty of the discipline check increase based on range? +1 for medium, +2 for long, etc.

what do people think?

Given how infrequently objects of that size will be showing up in most encounters to start with, having to only pay 2 LS Force Points to lift said object (especially given the hard cap on Force Rating that currently exists) isn't worrisome. After all, the Force-use has had to devote a decent chunk of XP to be able to lift objects of that size, and those 2 FP only enable you to lift something that's a few meters away, requiring a separate Upgrade and another FP to be able to affect something further away. Plus yet another Upgrade to be able to attack with said object.

Given all the XP barriers that are in place already, I don't think additional costs are really needed, again particularly given the (current) inability to go beyond a Force Rating of 2. Your suggestion pushes the Strength Upgrades beyond the second into the "waste of XP" category, particularly as the best that most Force-users could hope for is 4 Force Points (assuming Force Rating 2 and scoring double LS on both dice), which probably isn't a frequent occurance.

As for the Discipline check, since that only comes into play when using Move to attack, I don't see a need to increase it based on the hurled object's size, especially for players as most non-mook adversaries are already going to upgrade the difficulty at least once just from their Adversary talent.

Donovan Morningfire said:

i understand what you're saying, but what I see is some one with a force rating of 2, a fairly pathetic force rating as shown in EotE, of being able to reproduce today/star killer style feats of move with no risk of failure.

From a combat standpoint the range matters little, and the xp barrier is not an issue to me because it's not actually that much xp. 10 for move, 30 for all the strength upgrades, 20 to be able to attack with it. 60 xp. And to get force rating 2 costs the same as getting dedication. So xp costs are minimal compared to. Sing able to fling 40 damage crushing defeat about.

From an in universe perspective, Ashoka tano could easily have force lifted seperatist tanks and have thrown them into each other. Silhuette 2 or 3 objects are not exactly a challenge difficulty wise ( the same as a melee attack or so) and dealing 20-30 damage regularly to two objects/tanks at the same time, with no chance of not succeeding at FR 2 is much to me. Plus, since you can move twice in a round and still accomplish this it makes range far less impacting. At medium range? Move to engaged, lift and throw tank at tank at short range, deal prodigious damage.

Im exaggerating a touch, but give. The scale of what force rating is supposed to represent and the damage increases shown with larger objects, I think some long term rethinking is in order. I know the force isn't a "focus" but having and eye for long term builds is important.

For a total investment of 170 xp, plus 25 to raise disciple to at least a four, a human can attain really shocking power with this in what,4-6 regular sessions? I dunno.

Seems a little… Not good.

But I do see that the xp cost is high.

And I apologize for the typos. Mobile device.