I'm not new to FFG products, but I am new to following a release as I have been since they announced they had the SW licence last year. While my focus has been more on the LCG than the miniatures game, I will say that the PR aspect of the company is just dreadfully shocking. In a bad way. The LCG was slated for release in Q4 of 2011, as I think initially was X-Wing, and it was two months after that release date before they let us know that actually the LCG has been put back into development. X-Wing has certainly seen more love, if that's any consolation, but even that has been quite embarassing. This doesn't seem to be their general way of doing things though, as from in-passing it seems the Netrunner LCG has been released on schedule and is doing magnificently, which makes me wonder if they have their own internal priorities.

But nor is it exclusive to their Star Wars games. The Lord of the Rings LCG has been beset by problems from the outset, and I think it was one of the early Dwarrowdelf adventure packs that had been released and was in general circulation about 10 days before they even announced its release on the site. Other packs have been similarly malsupported earlier this year, but continued calls for hiring marketing people seem to be paying off as things appear to be calming down now, from what I can tell.

I don't think WotC are exactly the saints in this, though. For easily the last eight months of their time with the licence, possibly more, they seemed to have just zoned out from the fanbase and were churning out all sorts of sub-par stuff, and not one staff member was active in their forums for this time, if not longer. So it's not just FFG who ignore their own forums, but then FFG forums come with the tagline "share your hobby with the rest of the players", not "with the company", so can we really expect them to be here, and get upset when they don't respond to forum messages? For rules questions, I've had very good responses in the past by email, usually within a day or two, so I can't complain there. As Budgernaut says, you have to approach the company on their own terms, not how you think they should be.

I also don't think approaching LFL will accomplish anything, either. Unless it is stipulated in the licence agreement "you will produce x games a year, and will provide specific release dates and stick to them or so help you", then I think all they care about will be the sales. And if the sales from GenCon, not to mention the talk from here and BGG from folks who have preordered by the dozen, are anything to go by, then LFL will no doubt be very happy with FFG's performance and will be happy to let the licence rest with the company. At the end of the day, all George Lucas wants to do is make more money, and SW fans have, for years, been complaining how he isn't listening to the fans, and how he has done his own thing anyway, etc, so maybe LFL and FFG are the perfect bedfellows, both with equal disregard for the opinions of the fans…

But on a more serious note, I've learned to basically wait for FFG to produce the game I'm after without taking any account of release date estimates. Their games are generally top-notch when they arrive, and I won't be so proud to say "I'm not going to buy this game because the company got the release date wrong" - I'm more concerned with how enjoyable the game is once I get it. Living in Britain, we have to wait even longer anyway, so release date estimates frequently mean nothing to us. It can take anywhere from four days (Return to Mirkwood) to four weeks (still waiting for A Harsh Mistress) for stuff to arrive over here. I'm happy with what I get, so I've learned to just sit back and wait for it to arrive.

spalanzani said:

This sums up my feelings precisely. I appreciate what FFG does when they get their hands on a license/IP. Could they do better in the communication department? Absolutely. Are they the worst out there? Not be a very long shot. Would I be willing to trade in some of their quality/cool factor for more timely communication? Not in the least.

That being said, I also appreciate dissenting views in this conversation. In the end, the entire relationship between consumer and company is a personal thing. One which a company WILL NEVER please everyone. The fact that these forums are as busy as they are is a testament to the fact that FFG is clearly doing SOMETHING right!

My biggest complaint right now if that I need to just see a modicum of patience for my pre order to be delivered by mail and fight the urge to go buy EVEN MORE before I even play the game! Thanks for the entertaining thread here, everyone. It certainly was a good read for me.

You guys obviously aren't Games Workshop fans, huh? Compared to them, it feels like FFG is a pretty full service outfit here--at least they are giving us updates and previews more than a week in advance. And yes, I too have been itching for this game for a year, and the delays were killing me, but that's the nature of the beast, especially with a relatively small, up-and-coming operation like FFG. I really don't think there is much to complain about here.

Disappointed customers always have the option to speak with their wallets.

FFG doesn't really respond on these forums. Now you know. Sometimes there are responses on the BGG forums.

That said, the updates and overall marketing for upcoming games on this site is decidedly not awesome. I think whomever is in charge of it must also have other more pressing responsibilities at the company. I hope. If not, there are some competency issues.

I was about three weeks away from losing interest in this game completely. Still on the fence for Star Wars: The Card Game. The delays in LOTR: LCG initial release were pretty rough, too, with my disdain compounded by what a boring game it is. I will say this. FFG got it absolutely right with Netrunner in regards to the announcement, updates, and release.

Customer service is pretty good. I got a copy of a game that had some busted components. FFG handled that for me very quickly. About a week's time start to finish.

I can vouch for customer services too, they are excellent. I had a few cards missing from a WFRP 3e Expansion, Hero's Call I think. I e-mailed them and within a short time I had a complete set of new cards (not just the ones I was missing) and I live in UK. So those in the USA would probably get them quicker.

Gazery

ItsUncertainWho said:

The part I bolded is false. FFG does not reply to questions on these forums. The ToU you agree to before posting here states as much clearly.

The only time I've ever seen them post is when there was a question about the legality of a certain pack of cards that released just in advance of a major tournament, and the question arose something like 2 days before the tournament.

If you want to contact FFG, these forums are not the place to do it. As has been mentioned previously, there are other official channels that need to be used.

spalanzani said:

The worst part about this was that the LCG was AT THE PRINTERS which means that the core Solo/Co-op set was COMPLETED when they canceled the game. That's the thing that really kills me because I was so jazzed to finally get a Star Wars card game that I could play even though no one else would be likely to want it.

Not disappointed at all, no. I've had a few customer support incidents with some of my FFG games, all of which were handled to my great satisfaction, with replacement bits shipped free of charge all the way across the ocean. Release dates in board games are generally a rule of thumb to me, and when the games arrive from FFG, they're awesome. I've never had component issues (or heard of any) from FFG that the company wasn't willing to resolve, unlike WotC (which seems to be wary of replacing misaligned cards and tiles for Mage Knight if the customer requests that later than a few weeks after purchase).

Whenever I contacted FFG, the response time and response itself were satisfactory.

And indeed, posting on these forums is not "contacting FFG".

I'm going to throw in my 2 cents here for what its worth. This is NOT my first FFG game, and even felt a little scorned by them in the past. I played two card games they produced, UFS and Kingdom Hearts. While UFS had a longer life then KH, they were both cut suddenly. I have since stayed away from FFG for that reason, but how can anyone resist a STAR WARS game?

As for the release issues, we all have to keep in mind that we are in the ending of Tournament/Con Season, so I am sure FFG has been busy promoting this game as well as others. All we can do for now is hope for the best of the future of this game and keep our lightsabers crossed.

ItsUncertainWho said:

Yes. I did. Multiple times!

Every time I requeste dinformation regarding the upcoming section not showing correct dates (i.e showing a q2 release after q2 had finished) I got the same stock response of "All information shown on the upcoming page is accurate and up to date". This proved in every occasion (3 that I can think of off hand) to be incorrect.

They did, on one occasion, respond saying "the upcoming page will be updated in the next few days to show correct information." 2 weeks later they updated some of the information, but left the core showing as a q2 release (though it was July already).

In response to a question about release date (once target had already started selling the game on shelves) they told me that the game had not yet been released and was not yet available to buy at any retailer (though I sent them a picture of it on sale on target shelves).

In addition to this they informed me on 2 seperate occasions of a simultaneous worldwide release date in all FLGS, yet I find myself in the UK being told that the game wont be available until at least the 27th, although its clearly already been released elsewhere.

I work for a global logistics firm, so am well aware of the problems which can be encountered with transit and the issues surrounding delivery dates. However, in my industry, where a 1 day delay can mean ~$10,000,000 in lost profit for a project, we are almost always able to deliver. Getting all the X-wing sets to shops at the same time worldwide would have been a very easy task to execute, had they really wanted to. Moreover, if this wasnt going to be achieved, then they shouldnt state is as the case.

People on here have stated customs as a potential cause for delay, but customs going into big countries like the UK will rarely delay something like a board game from a US manufacturer, so this isnt really a likely cause.

I dont expect them to answer question on the forums, as I realise that this would take a lot of an employees time to trawl through and also accept that these responses could easily be missed. There is really no excuse for misleading, non factual and therefore rather aggravating information being given to fans.

Someone said earlier in this thread that manufacturers should always overestimate and then overachieve. I couldnt agree more. This is the same tactics that airlines use when they inform customers of delays (i.e they will say there is a 3 hour delay, when they believe there will be a 2 hour delay. this way they can announce the 2 hour delay as a positive thing because everyone has already settled on a 3 hour wait). There's no reason that FFG couldnt have done the same. Imagine how much happier we would all be if they had stated an october release, then said "some shops will be able to get this game a few weeks earlier!" in an update. those of us still waiting wouldnt feel that we had been misled and those who are just recieving would be positively elated.

In actuality, I imagine that the constant over optimism on release date was intentional, as it helps push sales (i.e when people think they only have 3 weeks to preorder before they might all be sold out, it pushes them to order asap and possibly to order more stock than they would otherwise, for fear of it selling out sooner). This has the knock on effect of making shops up their orders and saving FFG some money on logistics planning and feight movement. (again I am wearing my logistics hat here).

Perhaps I will feel better in 11-14 days, when I can FINALLY pick up my copy from my FLGS, barring any further "unexpected" and "unavoidable" (rarely, if ever the case) delays (there have been 3 of these for the UK so far…) but it still doesnt excuse the misinformation and lacklustre way in which this has been handled.

If my company dealt with clients and customers in this way, needless to say it would be dealt with at the highest level.

-R2D2

radiskull said:

This needs to be reiterated as its kind of the point of this thread.

FFG has a company policy of not responding to rules questions on these forums. There is a point during your registration process for this site where you are informed of this.

You (as in the OP) are making a fool of yourself by somehow acting as if this is/should be the case.

@R2D2, you have misquoted me, I did not type those things, those things were directed at me after I had been quoted. Not nitpicking here but I don't want others to think I am an argumentative arse.

As I also live in the UK I have resigned myself to expect this game at some point before xmas, rather than before my SW mad son's birthday which was on Sunday just gone.

Thanks FFG.

An official release date would have been great. END THREAD.

Seriously X-Wing is a brilliant product. Why is there a hate thread going? To me this just shows how well FFS is doing, that people get angry when they can't get their hands on the product yesterday . Its the same way people treat Apple every time a new iPhone launches.

So again - an official launch date would have set everyone's expectations and provided a more professional and cohesive hard launch. Sweet. It didn't happen. Post your feedback constructively. Did anyone die because of this soft launch? Were baby seals clubbed? No. What's with all the other unrelated complaining?

I don't think this was meant to be a hate thread (all of us are excited and want the game to succeed or we wouldn't be on the forums). Some of us are frustrated and wanted to vent that frustration (and I think most of the comments have been relevant and constructive). I appreciate that some people do not feel the situation was frustrating/disappointing (and that's actually good to know as it helps give a fuller perspective), but it's clear that more than a few of us do.

I think it's is fair to say that the situation is not ideal (it certainly could have been handled better), and it's not the end of the world either (it also could have been a lot worse). So, no hate. Love the game, love the forums, and happy to give FFG another chance. But, I do hope they do a better job communicating dates and/or updating the dates/info on their web page in the future.

I appreciate and agree with what you're saying El Tonio. However some of the comments here are just plain inaccurate. My main point is this: if the community sees room for improvement on communication related to the launch, they ought to voice it in the clearest most constructive way (which many have). It weakens the useful criticism when others start complaining about other unrelated issues or making blanket statements like "FFG is bad at communication," when that is clearly not the case 100% of the time.

I was bummed when the game launched at Target early, and when local game stores weren't sure when they would receive their product and thus could not tell customers what to expect. I was stoked on the video tutorial FFG produced for the game. So while communication about launch dates was flawed, the overall communication with fans including really excellent high quality card previews and write ups on the main site have been stellar.

Non-specific feedback is useless. Be specific and accurate. Also don't forget that FFG doesn't read these threads, so all we are doing is voicing our concerns to the community. "Preaching to the choir."

Perhaps a lot of people in this thread are video gamers and not tabletop gamers, and used to solid release dates. As a tabletop gamer,darn near every company I play games by never puts out release dates beyond maybe a month or a "coming soon." Heck, one company in particular seems to go out of their may to make sure no one knows their books are even coming out, let alone releasing them in a timely manner. I can't tell you how many games I've pre-ordered on Amazon then gotten more than one mail saying the game has been postponed until X date, often months off, only to get a mail a couple of weeks later saying "Oh, hey, we just sent it to you!"

FFG used to be active on the forums/internet and used to update people on product delays, etc (and delays are not always a bad thing… I would rather have a product come out late and be good as opposed to rushed out and crap) then immature internet asshats jumped all over them and cried like babies for pages and pages and multiple threads any time they made an announcement. Internet forum users are very much like a mob mentality. What I mean by this is that a person is smart… a mob of people that might even be made up of people who, on their own, are smart, become dumb as hell when in a mob. Forum/internet users are individually smart, get them all together on the internet forum feeding each other with no repurcussions since they are anonomous with nonsensical internet tags for names and they are suddenly a bunch of A-holes.

FFG got sick and tired of dealing with forum whiners and complainers and so they retreated from the forums and now no longer say a single word on their forums… on any of their forums and they have a ton of them. They make soo many products it's mind boggling… they are busy do little things like… you know… making awesome games… they don't have time to play on the internet and argue with people who want gold nuggets to fall from the sky for them because they feel entitled and cry and piss and moan about everything because there is no repercussions for doing so. If you want someone to blame for why FFG doesn't answer forum posts/members, look in the mirror because we are the ones to blame for it.

If you ask them a genuine question via email they will be more than happy to respond to it… what more do you want. Its no different for Dust warfare, a game that I play a lot of. They don't give out info for that either other than "this will be available late Q4" for example, and they don't talk to people on forums. But they answer legitimate emails, they have done interviews for fan organizations, etc, and most important of all, they produced a fantastic product that is adored by a great many people. That's their job… to make great games, whether they be RPGs, card games, board games, or miniatures games… and they deliver on the only thing they need to deliver on… making great games… they are not an internet forum speaking company, they are game makers. They don't work on one or two games and have an army of employees, they have a modest staff when you think of the staggering amount of titles that they produce. They are an American company, and you Americans don't have many game companies that are truly "American" and are not just "British" with some American office somewhere, etc.

X wing is a great game and it came out when it was supposed to come out while at the same time, the comapany had other new titles releasing at the same time, while continuing to support the outrageous amount of existing titles they have. Q4 is going to be big for me… the Falcon, Slave 1 and A wing are scheduled to come out for X wing but there is also a ton of models for Dust Warfare coming out at the same time with tons of new models for that game, plus new products for probably 20 other games that they make. They don't have time to sit on the internet all day and argue with pimple-faced pubes who will sit on the internet for page after page crying about everything that they can possibly think to cry about because they think that spending a few dollars on a product entitles them to some kind of personal correspondance from the President of the company every five minutes…. every booster pack should come with a special red phone that when you pick it up the President of the company is there to answer your every complaint….Email them if you have a real problem… if you just want to complain about things on internet forums, go ahead, wear yourself out…. FFG isn't going to acknowledge you… and I don't blame them.

Got an issue… get a tissue.

I love FFG, they produce great products for a reasonable price and don't pander to crybaby meatballs on the internet

Nalydd said:

Apologies for the shortsighted quote error. DOnt know if youve heard ( I assume you have) but new uk release date seems to be next monday (24th) so it should be hitting local stores next week sometime! (unless some unforseen fire tornado destroys all the stock or something).

R2D2

p.s dont suppose you are in London? looking for people to play the game with outside my gaming group of friends!

R2D2 said:

No probs. 24th sounds great, maybe, just maybe, it'll arrive before my slightly less SW mad wife's birthday.

London, nowhere near me, sorry. But if you ever find yourself up shropshire way…