Hello,

yesterday evening I had my first DOOM game. I bought both game and expansion and me and my friends decided to start with a Deathmatch game to test combat rules.

Everything was fine, the second scenario is great with the Reactor Core rule (scored a couple of funny Frags with it). The winner scored his last Frag in such a weird way that I have to ask a question about the Scatter Rule. Sorry if this was discussed somewhere else, I searched the forum for a dedicated thread but couldn't find anything.

- Scatter Rule is used when a Blast weapon attack misses its intended target, because of a Miss on the dice or insufficient range . If the attack scatters you draw an Invader Card and see what happens.

This works nicely in most cases but in the above mentioned Deathmatch the player tried to hit my marine with the Rocket Launcher 11 spaces away. He missed because of insufficient range (no surprise to anyone, he scored Range 8), the attack scattered and resulted in the rocket exploding 1 space NE from the intended target. Damage was very high (9) and fragged a Marine with 4 Lives left!

I spent some time reading the rules in order to find a clarification but we did everything right. You can declare an attack with a ridiculous range and Scatter rule helps you hitting a target which is almost impossible (11 is the maximum range for the Rocket Launcher). According to the rules, you may declare an attack on an enemy you can see. If you don't roll enough range, you may miss the shot; with Scatter, you may attack very far enemies and hit them somehow. BFG has a wider radius and can hit the targe even if the attack scatters 2 spaces away.

I might accept such a rule to help the Marines in the normal game(only Cacodemons have Blast attack), but in Deathmatch/capture the flag it's not fair.

Related topic: Grenades have the Seeking attack limitation to 8 spaces, which prevents the above mentioned use of Scatter Rule. Can you declare a Seeking Attack on a Space up to Range 8, even if Grenade max. range is normally 6? You will surely miss, but you can always count on a lucky scatter.

Don't you think that Scatter should be calculated from the space on the intented Line of Sight, where it was destined by rolled Range? (hope this is clear enough)

Firstly, I'd blame you for allowing your friend to get LOS from 11 spaces away . "Duck and cover". Also, said rules work both ways in DM/CTF(unlike in regular scenario play, as you point out, Invader doesn't really have Scatter), so if he used them to his advantage, there is nothing preventing you from doing the same (need to get your hands on the weapon of course). Scatter is always down to luck, though with experience, you can somewhat predict the scatter possibilities better. I think you're just sore you didn't think of that method first .

As for throwing 'nades up to 8 away, it's legit. In recent games, I've tended to give 'nades to the Marine with Marksman (+3 range on Yellow die weapons) to ensure no need for Scatter. One way to look at it, if 6 is the max range from the dice, 2 extra spaces are actually bounces/rolling due to momentum .

Additionally, did he have some Marine card that gave him extra pip(s) (damage), as I count Rocket Launcher Blue + Yellow + 2x Green max damage as 8 (and even though it doesn't matter, at a range of only 5)?

Dam said:

It was the first game, neither my friends nor I were aware that an attack from 11 spaces away could really hit. Now we know. My friend was somewhat disappointed as well, because he tried an almost impossible shot and managed to get a devastating hit. He did not really want to kill me with that. He was very lucky, but Scatter rule sounds a little preposterous to me. It is made to simplify the calculation at best, but it's not fair that a projectile that should have hit at Range 6 (as per your dice analysis) actually hits at range 4, just because you consider Scatter from target space. Then you can shoot with LOS at 30 spaces and score a hit. I simply don't like this option.

Dam said:

He had the Officer card (+1 to both Range and Damage). I'm not sure about the exact Range, but I'm sure about the Damage because he wiped out a healthy Marine.

The_Warlock said:

The range on the dice doesn't mean that your Bullets/Shells/Rockets/Plasma shots or whatever just reach that many spaces away. It's just another way to calculate hit probability based on distance between you and your target.

Don't think it as "I rolled 2 range" so my bullets can only reach 2 spaces away. Look it as "I missed" {because of the range between you and your target} just as you simply say " I missed" when you roll an "X". It's the same type of "failure". You point the gun at your enemy, fire and he is far away you simply have less probability to hit him. Your bullet/rockets/shells all fly straight, they don't drop down when you don't roll enough range!

If you've played Deathmatch on the PC game {or any other Deatchmatch game} you surely have noticed that sometimes you launch a rocket at some very distant enemy and that rocket just happens to hit him! It's not impossible.

Note that grenades actually have a maximum range limit. Thus I believe that scatter from far away is not a design mistake, it's the so called "designer's intent"".

FragMaster said:

This is true. If I assume I'm shooting far away my rocket, the rocket goes straight and will perhaps explode right on the back of a player running in the same direction. This is what could have happened in my deathmatch session.

I have to look at the boardgame with the computer game in mind. Rocket Launcher/BFG are the only weapons that allow this miss/scatter/blast combo, but as you say they might be intentional effects. If you know how it works, you'll enjoy it like any other rule in the book.

About Grenades: are those weapons always used with Seeking ability? Can you throw a Grenade without using the Seeking ability, thus being able to activate the above mentioned combo with Grenades?

The_Warlock said:

No, the 8 spaces maximum range is always in effect even if you have LOS to the target.

If you want reasoning for this, you can think of it as the maximum range a marine can throw a grenade. Any further would require superhuman strength.