It says you can get 6 Thrall Wizards for one Greater Minion of Chaos talent, in Tome of Fate.

It says you are limited to your Fellowship bonus in minions in core.

It also says you are limited to your Fellowship bonus in thrall wizards in Tome of Fate.

Since you get 6 for 1 talent, should it be considered that all 6 Thrall Wizards you get with Greater Minion of Chaos count as 1 minion for the general-Fellowship limit, and that you additionally can't have more than your Fellowship bonus in Thrall Wizards as well?

In other words, my interpretation is that a Fellowship 60 Thousand Son could have, for instance, take the Minion of Chaos talent five times (to get 5 rubric marines) and then take Greater Minion of Chaos to get an extra six Thrall Wizards. Does this seem right?

Deinos said:

I would have to say that the total amount of individual minions (remember that each thrall wizard is an individual, no matter what their usage is!) is capped by your fellowship bonus. So your TSS could get 5 Rubric Marines and 1 Thrall Wizard, or get one Rubric Marine and take Greater Minion of Chaos and get 5 Thralls from it, or any combination you can think of.

Forgot to add, that if you think about the way you thought it worked, your TSS could have a total of 6x6=36 Thrall Wizards, and I don't think I need to go into great detail why such a number seems to be a bit off from a game perspective.

The way I said I thought it worked, would still limit you to 6 thrall wizards, as like I said, it notes a "you are restricted to your fellowship bonus in thrall wizards" in addition to "you are restricted to your fellowship bonus in minions."

If they are separate, I wonder why the thralls are mentioned separately as being capped.

Probably because you could teoretically take 3 wizards with 3x lesser minion of chaos or 3 with minion of chaos and then one could wonder about the numers again. Unless creators say otherwise, FB wizards it is.

One of the easiest ways to work out whether or not you're doing something wrong is to apply a simple mantra to any rules question:

"Break no rule."

So say you're a Tzeentchian Sorcerer. You have a Fellowship of 60. You have two Rubric Marines following you around, but you want some lesser beings to fuel your psychic powers, so you go looking for some Thralls. You take Greater Minion of Chaos, and immediately choose 6 Thralls.

Have you broken any rules?

Well, you have 6 Thralls, and you can take 6 Thralls as a Greater Minion of Chaos. So you haven't broken the rule that limits Thralls as described in Tome of Fate.

Have you broken any other rules?

You have 8 Minions (2 Rubric Marines, 6 Thralls)… and the Core Rulebook says that Minions cannot go above Fel Bonus. Your Fel Bonus is 6, so you have 2 above what you can legally have. So you have broken a rule. You must either give up your two Rubrics, or just take 4 Thralls. Or take 3 Thralls and find a way to get a Glimmerwing - those things are awesome!



This is not an official answer to a rules question, even though I wrote the rules for Thralls/Glimmerwings, as I cannot give official answers. This is simply how I would approach this rules issue. Remember - Break no rule.

That looks like an EXP efficient way to get to your minion cap. Sounds like a perfectly fine interpretation to me.

H.B.M.C. said:

Thank you for your time, though may I ask why the thralls FB limit was mentioned separately if minions are already capped?

Because I like being thorough. The Thralls are different to other kinds of Minions because you can take multiples as a single choice. I didn't want people to think that because you can get multiple Thralls for a single Talent choice that it somehow caused an override of the general Minion limitations.

I hope that makes sense.

BYE

The passage resulted in the opposite effect, but okay.

The best way to view them is probably as either the most inexpensive (and horrible) way to make use of your minion cap or for 250 xp (I think?) and 1 minion cap a way to ensure you won't be instantly deathed or suffer permanent loss from perils.

While we're on the topic, I can't tell if thousand sons being able to get rubrics for 500 xp are good or not… the intent, presumably, is that they qualify as aligned: Tzeentch or Marked by Tzeentch (maybe) since they can use Tzeentch bullets, is being aligned: Tzeentch or Marked by Tzeentch intended to be worth a feature slot?

Also if we're on the topic of "break no rules" if a character roleplays their minions as having a trusting and friendly relationship is there any rule violated by letting one's minions sign into compacts? This seems nearly the only way to enable minions to get corruption & infamy to gain alignment and marks, and certainly the guy leading a squad of marked followers rather than aligned ruling the unaligned is EXTREMELY in-theme for chaos.

Also speaking of the "break no rules"-rule, I find it a bit iffy/funky that the weapon statline for the Rubric Marine includes the stats for the Tzeentchian Inferno bolts while still retaining semi-auto fire mode on them. I bet there are going to be people who for *some* reason will think that the Rubrics are a little bit too powerful, what with semi-autoing warp weapon blast bolters unless they actually read the armoury with care

The real trick is to give them regular bolter rounds and then give them bolter magazines you've blessed with Incendiaries of Tzeentch. Those have no such autofire ban and are a little more powerful, while still being warp weapons.