Do we know if there will be any more books?

Dark Heresy has quite a few books now, with a pretty sizeable bulk of content. While it's nowhere near such bloated hulks as GURPS or D&D 3.5, I can't help but wonder what's coming next. Deathwatch seems to be in a similar spot, with little left to make but adventures or rules for more chapters.Only War is wrapping up its beta soon, and once it releases we'll have a nice wait before we get anything further for it. Black Crusade should be getting a further three books (one for each god) and Rogue Trader is safe as long as they can think of more xenos to include, but I have to wonder: what's left for 40kRPG?

Plushy said:

I doubt it, I would imagine that any serious rules balance in the line has come to an end, though. Dark Heresy seems like a clunky, old car compared to Only War, but considering that it's the best selling (and the fan-favorite) line, I'd imagine they'd keep it running for money's sake. Because of the premium prices they place on their books, it seems like it would be ridiculous to start a " 2nd ed." that outmodes all of the previous content and alienates those who paid that premium price to own those books. While writing an FAQ for all the books doesn't seem beyond them, the idea seems very unattractive, almost.

But honestly, I would prefer to have to convert things to an entirely new system than jury-rig a game using OW.

I'd appreciate a "Calixis Sector sourcebook" in the meantime, though.

This line is far from over! And there are many books that I at least would still like to see and possess to run my games. Here's just a few ideas of what I would like to see:

A sourcebook for the Ordo Xenos

Books giving some more information for the Guardsman, Psyker, Adepts and Assassin classes like the Cleric and Sororitas had the BoM, Arbites (and Scum to a degree) had the BoJ and Tech-priests will have the LW. In fact I think that these could immensly interesting with detailing how other parts of the Imperium works in the Calixis Sector.

A sourcebook for the Calixis Sector with new information about various planets and stuff

So there's plenty of room for expanding the line as far as I can see.

Gurkhal said:

Absolutely agree. Deathwatch has the two outstanding sourcebooks, Achillus Assault and the Jericho Reach, I would love to see a pair (or more) of equivalent volumes for the Calixis Sector. I know we've had piecemeal books that cover aspects of the Sector, but I would love to see some pure "Sector books."

There is still plently to do, Calixis Sector Sourcebook, Witchhunter and Alienhunter, splatbook about Assasins, whole fluffbook DEDICATED to Tyranite Cabal…

But I still hope we will get Puritans Handbook. Many argue that all what should be there was already presented in IH and BoM, but there are still many things which could be adressed such as writeup of Puritan factions, adding of some minor ones, interactions in "official" Inquisition institutions, how to operate an acolyte cell which is not undercover (you know, those pesky firebrands with "I" in poles, or militants riding in chimeras with all Ordo heraldy…) and chapter about various types of excrutiation, interoggation and mindrape.

And of course, Ordo Chronos Sourcebook.

This was on my mind when I got my copy of The Lathe Worlds. I dont think the line will be over. Everything that was mentioned before I'd love to see and i'm sure other players and GMs would as well. I can point to numerous threads on this forum about wanting more information on Moritats and other death cults. And i'm sure there are some resources that adepts and psykers could use to further the glory of the Emperor.

I don't think the line is over. I still expect an Eldar-based game to be announced any time now. And there are plenty of potential Sourcebooks for DH : ones focused on specific careers (the way Blood of Martyrs did for Clerics, Book of Judgement did for Arbites and Scum, The Lathe Worlds does for Techpriests,and Only War was supposed to do for Guardsmen…). Plus I've been asking for a Calixis Sector Sourcebook (or multiple Subsector Sourcebooks) for a while now, along with an Ordo Xenos Sourcebook (since Hereticus and Malleus have a great deal of cross-over in the threats they tackle, Xenos is the least-supported Ordo in DH - and there are a bunch of Calixis-specific xenos mentioned in The Radical's Handbook that have never been followed up on). And then there is the possibilty (likelyhood?) of a DH 2nd Edition ; and, taking a page from the D&D line, the potential for alternate settings. So, the game system has plenty of potential for new books, as long as the sales hold up…

However, the system needs to be fixed and I'm pretty sure they know this.

Once again, I could totally picture the hypothetical "system update" as a chapter in the Calixis Sector Sourcebook. It would be too long to include in OW.

Kainus said:

What exactly is it you see as broken? What do you want in a "system update"?

Lionus said:

The system has undergone four revisions since DH came out. Psychic powers are pretty ridiculous in Dark Heresy. Unnatural characteristics are +2 instead of x2. Skill bloat is a big issue in Dark Heresy. Firing has been extensively changed (all modes of fire are Half actions, Single shot is now +10, Full Auto is -20 iirc)

Simply put, it's miles behind the other lines. There's also a pretty big issue of Tech-Priests and Psykers being better than everyone else, with the former now capable of doing any job in the game.

Plushy said:

Adeptus-B said:

Can we get a Ratling-based game, while we're at it?
If you've been under a rock for the last 4 years, FFG has produced numerous 40K RPG related supplements featuring Eldar. Why not just work it out yourself? I did. I actually had rules for Eldar "Wayfinders" and Dark Eldar outcasts before Rogue Trader ever hit the shelves, Nathan Dowdel has produced some amazing home-brew Exarch rules for use with Deathwath, The Koronus Bestiary is leaden with Eldar Aspect Warriors, Wraithguard and Wraithlords, Lure of the Expanse has Farseers and Warlocks, Soul Reaver is purported to have rules for Dark Eldar Kabalite Warriors (perfect base material for launching your own Character creation, just make them fluffy and fresh instead of evil), Creatures Anathema has Pathfinders and Dire Avengers…need I say more? There is more than enough Eldar material available. Besides, what would a game of technologically-advanced, introspective future-obsessive hippies play like? Like Dark Heresy, except with Farseers telling the Children where to go and what to do, instead of Inquisitors to Acolytes.

So seriously; can we get a Ratling-based game?

Just kidding!
Give the Eldar-based game requests a well-deserved break.

Alekzanter said:

Eldar are popular, Ratlings aren't.

-And I wasn't 'requesting' an Eldar-based game (I have my hands full running Dark Heresy and Deathwatch campaigns), just responding to the question about future books: a ton of people have been asking for an Eldar rpg for years now, so I would be surprised if FFG didn't have one in the works.

Alekzanter said:

>Ratlings

>a minor unit in the Imperial Guard

>Craftworld Eldar

>the most humanized non-Human faction in 40k and an entire army on the tabletop

Hardly a fair comparison. None of the things you have listed are character generation rules. I maintain my stance that FFG hasn't given us Eldar rules in Rogue Trader because they're saving them for their own game. You know people would buy it.

I understand there was some mention of the future of the 40K rpgs at GenCon's Inflight Report from FFG. Can't seem to find anything about in the news-section though (except a small mention in the caption of Day 2).

Did anyone pick up anything of what was said there?

Hive said:

The only thing I've heard about is Tome of Blood being the next supplement for Black Crusade. I'd love to hear more.

Plushy:

You have been writing DH 1.5 in the "Only war" Forum. I think FFG should pick your thread up and develop it!

EDIT: Soul Reaver, a Rogue Trader adventure supplement, is rumored to have rules allowing players to create and advance Dark Eldar Kabalite Warrior Characters, and these could very well be used as the basis of home-brewed Eldar Character creation rules.

Did we really need a fifth "stand-alone" game, or was it just a case of "we'll get the core rules banged out in a concise and comprehensive rendition sooner or later"? Going into the fifth redesign of the rules do we really need to be asking them for a sixth? I'd rather have supplements than rules. I already have enough rules to choke a hippo. Actually, I have enough supplements to choke five hippos, but that's not the point. Sure, people will buy an Eldar-based game. People would also buy a Tau-based game, an Ork-based game, and/or a Squat-based game. A supplement the size and price point of the Inquisitors Handbook could easily cover Tau and Eldar, and additional supplements could be released focusing on those PC races…but the question remains- does FFG produce yet another $60 core rules set, or get the rules situation ironed out with Only War and put the following on the back of each Tau/Eldar/Ork/Squat release: "A copy of the Only War Core Rules is needed to use this supplement."

As an aside; if FFG pulls another copy/paste stunt like they did with Hostile Acquisitions they're gonna find me standing on the front door of their offices, waiting to personally ask to have my money back. That was a lame release. Lame.

There are plenty of customers left so the line isn't over.

We've got Hereticus and Malleus, I would like an Oros Xenos book please.

Interrogator Z

Plushy said:

Four new games have been released that work along the same lines. You can call them revisions, but each game is designed to have it's own relative power level, it's own feel and it's own particular niche in the 40K universe. I don't buy the argument that each new core book is a 'revision' of previous ones. They're all pretty similar, and they are based on Dark Heresy as produced and printed by Black Industries, but the new games, starting with Rogue Trader had taken off in a different direction. I keep hearing complaints about the DH psyker rules, but agree with Bothrian that the real problems don't tend to arise except at the upper power levels. I don't think overbleed is disgustinly powerful like some people have said, because rolling enough dice to get massive overbleed comes with alot of risk of rolling 9's. Plus, that's an interesting part of the charachter of 40K, the capriciousness of the warp; you can be incredibly powerful, but it will probably only cost you your soul. No biggie.

One thing that irritates me is how people on the forums want to change everything to Black Crusade. I've never played it, partly because I don't think it sounds that interesting, partly because I don't really want to dole out the money for a game I don't think sounds that interesting. All the rules for BC are probably fine for BC, but that's another game, it's a game that mixes space marines and normal humans in the same group and tries to balance it all out. What's good in that game might not necessarily be good for other games. Of all the games in the line I've played, DH continues to be the most unique and flavorful of all because it does have unique rules and mechanics for Psychic powers and such. The blanket WP test for any power, then it does exactly the same thing every time is so frigging boring it makes me want to hang myself. Not to mention the warp is supposed to be completely unpredictable, and since you can do any power pused or fettered and that's the only thing that changes the effect of any particular power is absolutely in violation of all the fluff, even fluff in the FF books themselves.I know they don't have it in DH, but at least DW I know has a talent that allows you to essentially choose what effect you want your psychic phenomenon to be, so in the exceedingly rare occasions where one comes up, unless you roll a perils of the warp, you end up with the same pointless, boring, repeated phenomenon.

As far as Tech Priests being supposedly all-powerful now, we should all keep in mind that they are anEmpire within an Empire. They are a complete entity unto themselves, and most of the stuff I've seen in the new book are incredibly unlikley to be seconded to the Inquisiton. The AdMech is one of only a few institutions that the =I= has no real jurisdiction over, after all; so as a GM, I would feel no qualms saying "no" to anything in that book.

In short, there are some clunky things, and the experience of the other games could probably improve DH in general in any "system update", but by and large I disagree completely with you on the point that it's miles behind, I would argue that in the subsequent lines alot of the flavor that makes the 40K universe interesting and unique has been lost and turned into vanilla whitebread boringness.

Kainus said:

Yes, this is definitely something I would like too.

Lionus said:

Which is why people use their reasoning faculties to deduce which changes would be good and which would be bad for their particular game. Like it or not each game has been a revision of the previous ones, slowly weeding out faults in the system. BC made more radical changes than the previous two revisions, leaving something that is quite different from DH while retaining much of the core mechanical concepts. I've effectively converted my DH campaign to the BC system (I'd already come up with houserules that ended up being exactly the same as some of the BC rules - great minds think alike!) and I have to tell you it's a great improvement.

macd21 said:

Exactly! The reason many people see the DH psyker rules as broken is because they are! FFG has used some variant of the current (psyker) rule system since rogue trader. The Only war Sanctioned battle psyker character is nothing less than a rewrite (or revision) of the DH sanctioned psyker. I'm not sure how much clearer they could be without publishing Dark Heresy 2.0!

Like I said before, I haven't played Black Crusade, and also have not played Only War so I can't honestly say what I'd like better. I'm glad it works for you guys to mix the rules, and that you get enjoyent out of the game. I understand the point that each line is a refinement of previous rule sets, and accept that. It is still true that they are seperate games, and do not require the others to function. Planting charachters from one game directly into another doesn't really work smoothly, even though it can be done.

Speaking only to the psyker system, I heard that you don't like the DH method, and say it's broken. It is true that they can be very powerful, but also come with pretty intense problems and setbacks. I always thought the balanced each other out pretty well. No one made any comment in reguard that the FF psyker system is incurably boring and generic. It totally takes all the flavor out of the Warp and despite all the fluff talking about how dangerous it is, and how short and troubled the lives of psykers are, those characters are pretty charmed in the FF system. From what I've seen they still get pretty powerful, but don't have as many drawbacks as in DH.

As to how much "clearer they could be" by redoing the sanctioned psyker to the battle psyker, you're assuming there's agreement that the old system is broken, but my point is that it isn't that simple. You believe it is, and I think differently. Powerful yes, broken no. Definately interesting and does a good job of portraying the randomness and hazard of the Warp.