I just had a look at Goblin King's Dwarf deck. He's using Gimli and my first thought was "why Gimli, if you have the Erebor Battlemaster"? And as Gimli is the only hero that makes regular use of "Dwarven Axe", I think the latter has also become obsolete.

Or are there still players that use Gimli? Isn't Thalin now way better? And are there still decks that include Dwarven Axe? If yes, do you really play it?

i no longer use it

my killing machine is: battle master + ~10 dwarf allies….works everytime

I'm still running Gimli in my Dwarf deck, extra WP and HP are worth it IMO. And with just 1 Tactic hero (who is often the one to hand off his resources to Bifur), it takes a while to get a Battlemaster out, so in the meantime, Gimli can still do his thing.

Don't forget that Gimli is also a dwarf…

So he will contribute to Erebor Battle Master…

And with Citadel Plate (i know its to expensive) Gimli turns out to be an excelent killing machine…

CJMatos said:

1) Thalin is also a dwarf.

2) Erebor Battle Master turns into a better killing machine for less money.

leptokurt said:

1) Indeed Thalin is a dwarf, but normally you use Thalin to quest and have his ability. And usually you don't quest with Gimli, you save him to atack or defend to get him stronger… That is what i mean when said that he can also contribute to Erebor Battle Master

2) Less money? Let's see:

Gimli is a hero, so no pay cost (2 more threat than Thalin) and Citadel Plate costs 4. So Gimli can give 10 attack by just 4 costs plus his threat.

Erebor Battle Master costs 3, plus 3 dwarf heros gets a total of 4 attack, So you will need 6 other dwarfs to get the same atack that Gimli can have.

So with only one dwarf costing 1 (lore - Erebor Record Keeper), times 3, you have already spend 6 (3 lore and 3 tactics) and still need 3 more dwarves.

If you choose 3 of these: Erebor Hammersmith (lore), Miner of the Iron Hills (lore), Veteran Axehand (tactics) or Zigl Miner (spirit), you will spend 6 more resources.

Let's assume you choose the 3 Veteran Axehand

So to summarize:

- you spent 4 tactics with Gimli and Citadel Plate;

- you spent 9 tactics resources and 3 lore resources with Erebor Battle Master just to make him equal to Gimli;

You can also say that Gimli will take more turns in getting those damage points that he needs to get those stats than you will need to pay for Erebor Battle Master and the other dwarves. It may be true but not an absolute true…

despite saying that i no longer use it, i think the main point here is that both do have their good and bad points, which after all is the point of a deck building game, so reading these id say its not obsolete, theres just more options available.

personally i like to splash tactics with a dwarf deck, so battlemaster is key here

rich

CJMatos, you are aware that these allies would be played anyway and give Erebor Battlemaster a bonus for free. You really only spend three resources to play the Batllemaster and you have no additional costs.

Furthermore, as you said, Thalin adds 2 WP plus his ability.

The only downside of the Thalin/EBM combo is that you can't be sure to get the latter in your hand when you need him. And it needs some time to play him, if you only have one tactics ally.

I am aware that those allies would still be played anyway.

I as just trying yo give an idea of the costs.

In my plays, I always try to have dain and bifur. The other hero depends on deck purpose and if solo or multi.

It also depends a lot from what i want and which quest i will play.

@leptokurt: your point is totally valid.

But i seem to like the Gimli/Citadel Plate combo, along with some boots from erebor. Plus some axes (Dwarven or Dwarrowdelf) it is a killing machine, as is erebor battle master with some more dwarves in play and a Dwarrodelf Axe…

For me Gimli isn't obsolete as it isn't any other card in the game. It has always use in some deck… Some more than others, but all have use…

I would put my trust in Gimli moreso than Erebor Battle Master. EBR can be good when given attachments and backed by a few Dwarves, but why waste a considerable amount of recourse tokens on buffering him up, when Gimli can gain attack power just from taking a few hits? I also see one other problem with EBR. If something happens and your Dwarves start to die then that leaves EBR weakened. If you slap Citadel Plate on Gimli and let him take a few hits, you have a one-Dwarf-wrecking-crew without spending nearly as many recourse tokens.

I also try to have a few Dwarven axes in my deck(s) to boost Gimli's attack that much more. Using the tank approach (Gimli + Dwarven Axe + Citadel Plate), I believe, is at least a bit more effective than the EBR strategy. If you don't want to spend 4 recourse tokens on Citadel Plate, switch it out with Ring Mail. It gives 1/2 the extra protection for just 1/2 the price.

after considerable play with battle master (and playing with gimli since core release) i have to say that i now hugely prefer battlemaster. now im not saying that he's better than gimli, as gimli can still function in a non-dwarven deck, but in a dwarven deck battle master is the dwarf for me

i have yet to come across an enemy one of these cant take down….most of my dwarf decks are ally heavy, so only in a few turns i have at least 3 allies out….even if theyre just 3 erebor record keepers, thats still +3 attack. add three dwarf heros so thats +3 and add dains +1 for being ready and thats a total of 8 so far. get two in a thats 16 attack combined. thats without any attatchments and 3 x 1-cost allies to buff up.

half way through the game i can have sometimes 7-8 dwarf allies in putting battlemaster up to 10+ easily. and unlike gimli you can have 3. they dont cost as much as veteran of nanhurion, and in a good resource drawing deck (which lets face it isnt hard to do) and maybe a narvis belt, you can get them out fairly quickly whilst still playing your other cards.

rich

Just for the record, my dwarf deck was rocking battlemaster, Thalin AND Gimli. Completely impractical for solo i'll admit but in a coop game with another deck loaded for questing and threat managment it was a lot of fun.

I think rich hit on a good point in his last post. EBM and Gimli are somewhat redundant when played together in the same Dwarf deck, but Gimli can do his thing with or without a host of diminutive allies backing him up. In that regard, Gimli offers much greater flexibility; if I need a masher for a Dwarf deck, I'll use EBM, but if I just need a huge beatstick for some other build, Gimli can fill that role independent of any synergistic considerations.

Dwarven Axe, on the other hand, doesn't seem like something I'd ever include now that Dwarrowdelf Axe is available. Dwarven Axe's one advantage is the fact that it can be played on ANY hero, but you hate to use up a Restricted slot just to give a hero +1 attack.

I love Gimili for my dwarf deck. Just last night he was cranking out 12-15 attack, which helped us take out a Balrog. I don't think having both is needless redundency. Gimili is a huge tank, with very little effort, he's able to tank almost anything for at-least 1 turn.