Fairly sure this is an easy one… When a former champion wins a challenge he gets a power icon that makes him deadly, however if to win said challenge he was a defender against a deadly character, does he have to die to satisfy the deadly advantage of the attacker?

i.e. Eddard Stark (deadly) attacks for 4, Former Champion (no power) defends for 5. Former champion wins. Do you resolve the challenge first (i.e. former champion becomes moribund then gets a power that will be returned when he dies) or win the power for renown, and then check the deadly count for attackers and defenders? We worked on the principle that the challenge would be resolved, i.e. champions wins, so no claim for the challenge, then resolve deadly so champion is moribund, then renown, player action - no save, then chamion joins the dead pile.

Second question - can you divert a diverted challenge? For example I am queen regent and redirect a challenge, new defender has Varys can they return him to shadows to re-direct the challenge? If there are only 3 characters - this would be back the original defender, in 4 player does this have to be against the last opponent or is there a choice again?

The steps for challenge resolution are as follows:

1. Determine winner (defense in your example, since Former Champion has 5 STR and Eddard only 3)
2. Implement claim (inapplicable, since defense won)
3. Award power for unopposed (inapplicable, since the challenge was opposed)
4. Award power for Renown (Former Champion gets his power at that point and gains -2 STR, a power icon and Deadly)
5. Passive effects initiate (now comes the time for Deadly: there is one character on each side with the keyword, so nothing happens)
6. Responses can be triggered

Since Renown power is awarded as a framework event and Deadly is resolved as a passive effect, Renown will always resolve first.

I'm not quite sure about the timing for Crown Regent (a response like Varys's ability or a passive effect), so the redirection might work in one way but not the other. I'm pretty sure it works in the order of your example. I also think a new choice is made independantly of the first: the restrictions aren't the same, nor is the same player choosing (unless Varys's controller is also the attacker).

Pendarric said:

Crown Regent is used immediately after attackers are declared/knelt. So it's going to happen in Step 4 of the "declare challenges" action window. Varys is a Response to a challenge being initiated, so he can be used in Step 5. When the Crown Regent redirects the attack, it doesn't change the fact that there was a challenge declared by an opponent. So, assuming there is an eligible defender (in a 3-person game, that's be the original defender), Varys can still redirect.

There is nothing in the rules stopping a redirected challenge form being redirected. For example, whether Crown Regent or Varys (or both) have redirected the challenge when it is initiated, there is nothing that says Lord Commander or a "Supporting" player cannot redirect that same challenge if no defenders are declared.

So the redirection from Crown Regent is a passive effect?

ktom said:

So if Varys re-directed a challenge, does the famework go back a step (to allow the attacker to declare new stealth targets) and then the crown regent can re-direct the challenge.

With the other question - deadly is a "passive effect" so it comes under player actions? Or is it still part of the challenge framework? I thought that "deadly" was part of the challenge rather than triggered after.

I've just thought - if you defend with less deadly than the opponent attacked with, you must kill one of the participating defenders. Lets say it was a military challenge, firstly we've always considered that the participating character has to die to satisy deadly, but also fulfils the military claim. Is this correct? Assuming it is and the participating character "has" to be the one killed, but Stoic Resolve is in play (so knelt characters do not die), but I have standing characters that could have fulfilled the claim, is deadly considered void by the plot card, and you have to fulfil the claim with a legal character, or does deadly demand the death of the participating character which therefore defeats the claim as well?

Khudzlin said:

Pendarric said:

Crown Regent will always have the first shot at redirecting the challenge. Then Varys. But if Varys redirects, the Crown Regent will not get another shot at it, whether they redirected or not, because that opportunity has passed.

Pendarric said:

Pendarric said:

In short, you have 2 kill effects that must be resolved in order. Their target restrictions are such that, if you do it right, the second kill effect will not have a legal target to kill = so only 1 character dies in total for the 2 separate effects. But if there is a legal target for the second kill, you will lose 2 characters.

ktom said:

And as for the deadly resolving, if at that time the kneeling characters cannot be killed then the defenders can't die for the deadly effect.

So the deadly resolves in the framework before or after the renown is awarded?

Pendarric said: