Derp, forgot about composite bows, which basically are the Moritat's answer to a sniper rifle. Isn't Shuriken HERETICAL XENOTECH (and a lot of GMs I know already give it tearing for free). A lot of people are on the fence with the widower (and hypo-pistol as well as the needler) arguing that they are too "advanced" and "like a gun" for Moritat to use, I don't think they are personally. Also, the two "holy crossbows" are allowed by some. Fractal Blades fall in a grey area, BUT out of all the "power swords" no one can deny they would not get tearing. When it comes to the Bolo Knife, I find it is a good cheap weapon for early on PCs who can afford it, but it is outshone at later costs by the sword, which is similar in damage, but also has balanced. (In a non Moritat, Bolo > Sword, but with tearing I think it changes the dynamic somewhat). And I will have to ask a friend who got the beta copy about the new needler stats, that would certainly give it a buff.

Edit: On second thought, having a list of Moritat Approved Weapons (ALL OF THEM) and then the top choices bolded or starred would be helpful. As well as a breakdown on cost. I will start here.

http://piratepad.net/CljDWRdzDh

Eldar weapons are generally forbidden in the Imperium, though whether that stops a Moritat in the service of the Inquisition isn't so clear. Still, while the Moritat may have qualms about using Xeno stuff, it does technically fit the bill of a Moritat-compatible weapon.

I would say a Moritat would not be allowed to use Eldar shuriken weapons for two reasons; first of all, it's a gun, not a sword or a bow (comparable to a shotgun that fires flechettes) and second of all, it's an alien weapon, and death cultists are far too fanatical to sully their hands by using an alien weapon. Fractal swords are sold by a human Rogue Trader, so they would probably be allowed, although the cost is likely astronomically high. I'd say they wouldn't be allowed to use needle weapons either, because they're guns.

Now, what about poisoning a target? If a Moritat is allowed to use poisoned blades, are they allowed to kill a mark by slipping something into his drink? It's not a weapon per say and it's certainly not in combat, so under the RaW, they wouldn't suffer a willpower check.

I'd tend to agree with you on the poison, Boss. Of course you can go with the "standard" poisons like ones that do damage or knock the target out. But I think some creative players and GMs can come up with some interesting toxins that fall in line with the moritats fondness of bloodletting. I'm just giggling with delight at the thought of a noble taking a sip of fine Amasec and then profusely bleeding from their nose mouth eyes ears and other places, as one of the servers quietly slips out the back entrance.

Boss Gitsmasha said:

I'd let the player decide on this one. Even within the Moritat (Moritariat?) cult I'd imagine there are some different philosophies on the issue of bloodletting. If the player wants to play an absolute purist who believes every death should be inflicted by their blade, well great! If they believe only the worthy targets should be cut down by their blades, also cool! This seems like a grey area of philosophy and personality, so I say let the player decide.

So on the "type with me" like posting thing I got all the DH, RT and going to add Black Crusade soon, next step is probably weapon upgrades that Moritat can use with their weapons

I do know you missed 1, the Spike Picks it a piece of feral/feudal gear that can be used to climb

Hmm, I didn't really think of that one, it says it can be used as an improvised weapon, but would that be Moritat allowed? Also, the great thing of the "type with me" like sites, is that anyone can edit onto them

Personally I ruled, after discussing it with the player, that the tearing effect doesn't apply with the power field. I did however give him the option of 'swapping', via the cult, his power sword for a Lathe Blade. he does a bit less damage and the penetration is lower but he seems happy enough especially when he also got access to a composite longbow with mono-adamtium tipped arrows meaning he can do a bit of damage at range too.

adamtium?! adamantium rather

Well, if you give Lathe PLUS some extras (like sancitifed as well as the choice between shocking or poison dispensing).

Another idea is to look at for Ascension is the Material worth of the two BQ Power Swords (25,000 thrones EACH) and give them that many lathe blades almost (1 BQ Power Sword = 10ish Lathe Weapons), letting them have an armory as well as playing around with different weapons for different purposes.

How much do the special arrows do?

(Side Note, you can use the edit option to avoid most double posts)

Edit: Side note, why is the normal needler and the one used in the executioner SUPER COMBI pistol so different?

I think there's a time limit on how long you can edit. or I'm showing my feral world origins and failing at tech use ;-)

For context the Moritat is rank 6 and I should have said it's a Lathe Great Sword that lets him do something like 2d10+10 damage with a pen of 5. Combine that with tearing and it's lethal enough for now! I've told the player about poisons but he's not interested yet… though I'm sure that'll change given time!

Off the top of my head I think the composite Longbow with the fancy arrows does 1d10+7 damage with a pen of 3 but we're gonna work on other 'special' arrows such as explosive or something similar to the Catechist Crossbow from the Holy Ordos section of the Inquisitors Handbook or for full anti-psyker I s'pose arrows covered in hexagrammitic wards would really mess up a psykers day!

No worries!

+10? I see +2 from the Lathe BQ, but where does the +8 come from?

And on the bow, the composite is 1d10+1 Pen1 (3 if you use mono or treat them like manstoppers), so where does the +6 come from there?

Tearing and Accurate are a nasty combo so the extra damage seems a bit odd there, as well as on the great sword (With Pen5 and 2+3/4 (SB) damage, it is enough to rip through the "soak" of most foes, so the 3d10 drop the lowest is a lot of power at that point, let alone +4 extra damage)

Did you take a look at adding fleshrender to the Moritat? That may solve the EXTRA EXTRA damage problem while making them love the tearing blades even more.

funkwit81 said:

2d10+10 on a great weapon? Does your Moritat have Unnatural Strength or something? It also seems silly that a bow of all things does more damage than a plasma gun.

Boss Gitsmasha said:

I didn't ahve access to the character sheets at the time and was doing it off memory. It's actually 2d10+9 as he has a strength of 53, crushing blow and the Lathe Blade upgrade gives an additional +2. As for Plasma Guns, well I upgraded them in my game as the way they were statted didn't match either my expectations or that of a lot of friends so they were upped to 2d10+4, not that anyone's used them yet beyond an npc that rolled a natural 100…boom.

In regard to the Bow I remembered incorrectly and instead it's 1d0+5 including Mighty Shot and with the arrows it no longer counts as primitive.

Okay, that makes sense on the greatsword (though SB 5 is a LOT, the normal human is 30 or less, 40 is a very strong person, 50 is a bit inhuman at that point)

With the Composite bow, 1d10+3 is what the base AND mighty shot would bring. Again, 1d10+5 is a bit high for what it is

In regard to the bow i just figured it was a best quality weapon firing mono-adamantium arrows so I gave it a little boost and the Strength, while seeming high, is a result of him being a Feral Worlder, rolling an 18 and then the player deciding to spend the ridiculous amounts of xp it costs to increase Strength.

You players can make odd decisions at times

funkwit81 said:

Best-quality firearms don't do any more damage than lesser quality ones; they simply jam less often. As for mono adamantium arrows, that's not exactly a "little" boost; it should at best give him +2 pen and remove Primitive. A bow should not do as much damage as a freaking boltgun.

Yeah, best to keep it that way and if you want a good boost, make the "mono arrows" counts as manstoppers (increase pen to 3)

they don't do as much damage as a boltgun, they only do so because he took mighty shot, which works for all ranged so if someone with mighty shot used a boltgun they wouldn't be doing the same damage even if we were using the underpowered boltguns from the corebook which we don't.

Do you have the same attitude regarding SP weapons that can do as much if not more damage than a boltgun with certain talents and get only slightly lower pen with manstopper rounds? Are you as dismissive then that they shouldn't do as much damage as a "freaking boltgun"? Considering SP ammo is nowhere near as expensive as Bolt Shells and often the weapon itself is the same price or cheaper.

Cymbel said:

Because the Executor Pistol is a masterpiece created by the brightest artisans of the Adeptus Mechanicus for the dreaded Officio Assassinorum, while the normal needler is produced on every second Forge World.

Whatever equipment they need, Officio gets a better version of it. They're like the Men In Black.

funkwit81 said:

I keep forgetting about Mighty Shot. D'oh.

If you don't use boltguns from the corebook, then what do you have instead?

Cymbel said:

I can see them using the spike as weapon, because of the duel use. Primary to aid in climbing, but in a pinch

So Cymbel sent a message to FFG, and this is what she got:

"Hi Cymbel. Sorry, no plans to list out all approved weapons (we'd have to annotate each new weapon created in each new book after all), so GMs and players will have to decide together on a weapon for the Moritat. I'd guideline it though as things with actual edges (arrows count as most have a bladed two-sided edge), so stakes would be a no (they are a pointed weapon), and ditto on darts. Needlers would be a no, but Xenos ranged weapons would have to be considered item by item (or more precisely, ammo by ammo). It really will depend on the actual weapon, and more importantly on your GM's concurrence on it."

So yeah. FFG hates Moritat. There's no reason to play as one. I think I'm going to roll up a new character, I'm sick of jumping through hoops figuring out what weapons I can and can't use.

Boss Gitsmasha said:

I wouldnt say they hate them… but it does kind of look that way. Well I guess the only thing to do is have a sensible GM. And I wouldnt say theres no reason to play a Moritat. No character, in the beginning of the game at least, can be super stealthy AND wield a (effectively) chainsword. This is just another obstacle, not a complete stand still.