So I'm running lure of the expanse right now, and my PC just made it through the governor's party on Footfall. Two of my PC felt a little bold and tried to eat the Warp-eel thing. No problem for the Astropath, he got away with some minor burns, but our rogue trader developed a nasty mutation on his hands. No problem, he says, I'll just chop them of and replace them with Bionics. I'm not against, but how should I translate this in gameplay? Give him a negative bonus as long as he is getting used to his new hands? And how would the NPC probably react? Somme helpp lease

Why do you feel the need to **** with your player just because he's getting bionics? Why should the NPCs react at all? People get bionics all the time.

This is of course assuming that he owns any bionic limbs. Also, bonus points for the thread title. =D

If you really feel that it's necessary for punishing your player for this action, then I would assume that weeks or even months of grueling physical therapy would be required to fully get used to a bionic limb (might be very different depending on whether the limb uses muscle movements or a neural interface). You could justify severe penalties to any task requiring manual dexterity, pretty much as bad as you want them to be. If you want the experience to be truly unpleasant, have him make toughness or intelligence tests to be able to adapt at all. My recommendation, however, is to just let him get bionics.

Disclaimer: My opinion goes against the majority of this forum nine times out of ten.

Well, I thought as much (letting him have it without penalties) but I wanted a second opinion.

The furthest I would go with something like that is describing him fumbling a bit as he gets used to the new augmetics, calibrates the tactile sensors and what have you. That said I do have some issues with the cavalier attitude many players take when it comes to lopping off their limbs. Damned if I know what to do about it though.

Lerak, I personally think it's a good attitude to minimize punishments and maximize rewards, in order to foster an attitude in your players to care about the fluff rather than mechanical drawbacks. However…

Errant said:

This is a good point. I don't have this problem in my current group (aside from the tech-priest, even the characters who *do* like augmentations are understandably hesitant to replace large parts of their anatomy, praise be to the Emperor) but I have seen it, and I'll probably keep seeing it. Honestly, I'm not even sure if you can effectively get a whole group to change their attitude about things like this (you can't force people to role play, or to role play a certain way) but discouraging it with mechanical penalties won't make it any less of a calculated move, so it seems to me as if people who opt out because of penalties are doing it for the wrong reasons.

If anything, I would recommend just mentioning it to the players that their attitudes seem a little out of character, trying not to sound too judgmental. It takes a little experience to get into the role, after all, especially if you're used to playing video games instead. That's something you could try too, Lerak. Is the Rogue Trader sure he wants to sacrifice his arms so lightly, when there is plastic surgery?

Errant said:

It's called a haywire grenade

There is a rather nifty haywire gun in Black Crusade, various factions use the grenades and similar tech, you adventure on a planet with a very wet climate, that thing is going to rust, tech viruses, obliterators, there are so many ways to annoy people who rely on bionics.

In my group the only person with bionics is the Explorator (who has two bionic arms encorparating shuriken catapults, bionic legs, a bale eye and other things) so its not been a problem for me.

Magellan said:

Problem is, this ain't some esthetic problem, it's a mutation. For all he knows, as long as the corrupted flesh is part of him, the mutation may re-apear after a few days.

UberMutant said:

…And we're right back to punishing players.

Not that you shouldn't be using various kinds of EMP weapons anyway.

lerak said:

A lot of mutations are just aesthetic problems, though. If you make them something else, that's really all on you. Doesn't sound to me like he has much of a choice other than to chop his hands off.

On the other hand, if I were him I'd probably experiment. He's rich enough to afford to hold off on getting bionics until he knows if the treatment works. However, I do wonder if you'd have mutated extra limbs, horns and other stuff regrow as well. What if he lost them against his will?

Short of becoming a necrophage and gaining the regenerate talent I doubt anything severed would come back. Though as far as the game is considered severed limbs or not he is still tainted i.e. he doesn't just get to lop 'em off and call it a day. He may once again physically pass as 'normal' but the genetic mutation remains… perhaps becoming an issue later.

Of course this is my interpretation of the trait and what I typically think about when dealing with regeneration.

That aside limbs don't typically grow back unless you're looking to house rule it. I could see a willpower test modified by corruption points rolled by the GM. Whenever corruption points are gained for the character you make a roll. Failure would result in the mutated limbs beginning to regenerate applying a penalty to the operation of the cybernetic ones (poor craftsmanship maybe if already poor double the penalty).

Removal of the cybernetics would allow the limbs to fully regenerate in 1d5 days with their original benefit/penalties.

Ignoring the situation would result in the mutated limbs over growing the cybernetics in 3d5 days imposing the mutation's benefit/penalties, and reducing the cybernetics to poor craftsmanship. (a combination of cybernetic and corrupted flesh may add some unique property… of course one wouldn't be able to tell what this is until it presented itself.)

Amputation of the mutated limbs, repair of the cybernetics, and reinstallation 2d5 days.

These options are just off the top of my head and really you could do all kinds of fun stuff none of which I feel as anything other than a minor inconvenience to a character that would risk a mutation in the first place. The GM's unwritten rules are what I think make the game more exciting as long as you aren't actively stacking the deck against your players.

If you feel a character is taking risks for the sake of taking risks and then tries to sidestep the consequences its up to you to do your part.

Later

Replacing mutations with cybernetics isn't unheard of. The Iron Warriors Legion is very big on that (who would have thought) and I think the Thousand Sons did it too before they were hit by the Rubic Spell.

So I'd allow it, but I second NGL that the taint would remain on a genetic level.

My view would be to just let them get a bionic hand (getting between planets, even in the warp) takes weeks or months, so there is plenty of hanging around on the ship for your players to get used to his new hand.

What I would be inclined to do, if you want to 'punish' him, would be to perhaps make people ask questions about why he wants to get a new hand - clearly getting a bionic replacement for a limb lost in battle is fair enough, but to disguise mutation…

I would suggest that unless your player is especially dicrete about getting his new hand someone gets wind of it, and tries to use it against him. Perhaps one of the rival rogue traders, perhaps a relatively pious one, tries to get him into trouble with one religious authority or another. Just an idea, but I imagine getting a bionic hand is not overly difficult, and getting over the surgery something which shouldn't impact on the game (I doubt it is any more traumatic than being hit by bullets, and that happens so very, very often…), but the potential problems of being seen to be trying to get rid of mutation are great.

You could also hit him with insanity and/or corruption points too, of course.

Just some ideas though.

All best,

David.

"Especially discreet"

Sorry.

David.