What would be the best way to be a guy that just sits there and takes it? I know for the most part this would be equipment based, so would that just be get the best armor or something else?

The flip of taking the most soak, would be just not getting hit, but this concept seems much harder to pull off. Would it even be possible to be (mostly) unhittable?

Another idea I had would be someone who doesn't necissarily hit hard, but hits often and the damage goes through (I think that's pierce correct?). Any idea on improving this?

Soak is the only combat modifier that matters. Go with the heaviest armor you can get with the biggest shield (or great weapon) and max out your toughness. An Ironbreaker, for example, will outlast all other characters and makes a nice meat shield for the other characters.

You have an 86% chance of getting hit when you have a defense up. If the GM uses any A/C/E dice whatsoever, you have about a 97% chance to get hit. Also, since defenses are only good against one opponent (each), they don't change your odds much.

On the damage end a 2-handed weapon plus reckless cleave, troll feller strike easily outpower any other feat combo.

Two handed weapons are waaaaay more powerful than any of the piddly lesser weapons (yes, 2 points really does count for /that/ much).

If you us 2 weapon strike you can maybe keep up for a round or two, but the MASSIVE damage is the only thing that actually beats soak, so there's not much point in doing piddly damage. Go with a heavy weapon.

So: Dwarf Ironbreaker with high Toughness, a great axe and those special actions is about as broken as you can go. Your gm will be forced to throw hundreds of goblins and strangely appearing pits of water in front of you just to kill off the rest of the party in order to /maybe/ do some 1-point-a-round damage to you.

jh

Emirikol said:

Is this a Feature or a Flaw? On the one hand it does speed up combat, but on the other it does limit the options if you want to be an effective melee fighter. That may be intentional, reflecting the Grim n' Gritty, or it may be over-done.

Of course, one of the problems is the effect of adding Challenge dice. Not only do they reduce your chance to hit, they also dramatically increase the chance of having a chaos star, which means in effect that Improved Dodge makes it more likely that your opponent fumbles. Which is a bit weird. I think the problem probably lies in one of the root mechanics of the game, which is that dice pools grow, they never shrink. Maybe an Expert Improved Dodge should actually remove a die of the players' choice, and Master Improved Dodge remove two? That would make defensive tactics at least a bit more viable.

To me, the "odds favour acting" principle of WFRP3's resolution system is a key positive feature. Monster attacks? Something will happen more often than not, issue is what, how successful, how effective is it against the heroes. Hero acts. Something will happen, issue is how successful, effective is it against the monsters.

The situation changes each round. That is important to keeping things interesting. If the situation hasn't changed in 2 rounds, GM needs to think about shaking it up. Were you not spending ACE? Were you not having monsters team up (once two intelligent or pack-animal types are engaged I always have them use maneouevre to give buddy a fortune die representing flanking etc.).? Etc.

The effective melee fighter mostly has max wounds and good soak - it's not that they never get hit, it's that they can take it a bit longer but critically they dish it out (or someone is). The best defence is strong offence - down foes that's how to avoid taking hits!

As to improved dodge making a foe possibly roll chaos star etc., I don't see that as weird. Hero dodged and tripped, hero ducked and foe over-swung becoming off-balance - there's all sorts of ways to narrate how a cool dodgy move leaves a foe worse off rather than just makes you not get hit. To me that is one of the features of the improved defences - not just black defence - dice success/failure , but chaos stars potentially for the attacker representing the "more active" defence of the highly skilled.

Rob

I would argue that it is a feature and a flaw. Your to hit chances are roughly DOUBLE what they were in WFRP2. In 2e, combat rounds were quicker, but you missed 60% of the time and your effects were nearly purely numerical . In 3e, you only miss 10-15% of the time, and your effects have all kinds of wonky effects, but I don't think those effects balance out the numerical. That's why tougness + armor is the most powerful element in the game (especially on the dwarf, as it is that much more powerful of a race than all others).

I think it's a good thing to have defined: What is the "powerful end" of this game? It makes all else relevant for GM tailoring.

For instance, if a person is playing an unarmored Halfling pedlar with a strength of 2, toughness of 2 and a bunch of social skills, the GM knows the character isn't just a twink, but instead has chosen the opposite end of the spectrum and he can adjust his game accordingly.

If the party is made up of a Watchman (with armor and halberd), Mercenary (with armor and great weapon), Dockhand (with armor and great weapon), and a Mystic (without armor), the combats need to become more diverse and challenging. <this is my current situation as I've lopped the limbs, burned bodies, and blasted holes in all the original characters of the group..they obviously were not aware of the loophole that is 'maximizing soak'

This begs a question: Is there the social equivalent? Can characters talk their enemies out of a combat in a round or two (rules as written), or is there no true equivalent-to-fighting mechanic for that yet?

jh

..

In my games, so far, there is always a place in combat for social oriented characters.

I allow them to interact with NPC (possible allies, or enemies) with guile, leadership, intimidate checks… They can get the door of the keep open, or the bridge lowered, convince a npc to join /abandon the fight. They can lower the enemy morale (my combats typically end when the enemy is demoralized an runs)…

As for damage absortion (To + soak), for sure it is the most important factor in a combat. It could not be differently. The same way you have to have a good weapon to fight, you need a good armour to survive. The nimble kind o fighter has no place in a battle, may be in a 1 vs 1 duel, but for sure not in a battle field. Still, there are many action cards that ignore all or a partial amount of the armour soak (some even the To)

Remember also that WFRP 3rd ed allows you to stack all your defensive reaction cards against a single attack, so from time to time you can dodge /parry/ block / guard position /dirty tricks etc. and make your enemy fail the attack.