Yes, exactly. I have played this for two days in a row and found the two cards plus Vast and Intricate the biggest threat perhaps. There is hardly anything one can do against the location - passing the test is hard. In a similar fashion, unless you cancel the treachery, you might lose. That said, I am yet to lose a game out of eight played (all 2-player, solo may be harder here, not sure).

However, I still think quests can kick one's butt, often when you adjust your deck - or pick one - to a certain quest, you might actually get weaker for another.

And as for the player cards, true, there are some great ones coming up but I still think if there be a poll for top 10, core set may get more than a half.

well id be the first to admit that when first testing a new deck againt passage through mirkwood….i quite often get my arse kicked

and yes, just a few months back a poll was taken on here, and i think almost all of the highest voted cards were core ie steward UC POL etc

I find this easier solo'ing than in multiplayer.
Still, this will never be a difficulty 7.

richsabre said:

Could someone please post english card names for encounter deck in this thread?

Location

Abandoned Mine, Dwarven Forge, Twisting Passage, Silent Caverns

Enemy

Cave Spider, Goblin Sneak, Goblin Warlord, Rock Adder

Treachery

Fatigue, Foul Air, Gathering Ground, Vast and Intricate

Objective

Durin's Greave

Thank you that's what I was looking for

richsabre said:

there has been some killer cards.. but this isn't one of them… 3 to cast, and has the same effect as a 1 cost song… and while the other effects powerful you have to run Aragorn to get that effect… (measurably worse than say CStone, as the non Aragorn ability for "any" deck is relevant. There has been some crazy powerful cards in darowdelf.. but yeah.. that aint one of them.

you cant be serious? each character with +1 willpower isnt powerful?….and so what if you have to play aragorn- i think thats a given, i mean no ones seriously going to pay 3 for it to be a song card….aragorn is a powerful hero, and this card in his hands is a powerful card

Actually some of us…..most of us to be honest play this game is 1 year already. So many of us have already quite good skill level as a players and deck builders.

So this mean even without new powerful player cards many players can manage the current quests without big problems. So i how you feel if the new quests is more easy then previous one??? NO challenge make game boring…………

I still think we need a better system which provide you options to change the difficult of the quest by players. Yes i can make a house rules but then Quest log is useless cose if everyone play by his rules how we can compare the scores? We can have in he rues of the quest some additional rules for advanced players like expert lever or Tournaments level rules and normal rules for beginners. So then every kind of player will be happy and every quest can be more hard or more easy depend of the players current need.

how would those 'advanced rules' go then? advanced=drawing extra card in staging step? or would it be more complex?

i think instead they should concentrate their efforts on getting it right the first time

richsabre said:

yes most easy solution is additional draw in staging but……with quest difficult more then 5 you lose quickly. Add. draw can work only with quests diffficult 4 or less. No there should be proper system developed by designers. I just trying to say this will be better for the game.

But they must be doing something right perhaps since you've been gaming for over a year now - and actually bashing the difficulty from almost the day 1.

An easy wat to make things difficult on you is to make a thematic deck for a theme that hasn't been well developed, like Silvan. Take a Lore Tactics (for instance) mostly Silvan deck around the quests and see your winning percentage then. Do not change the deck between the quests and I bet you're not going to win a half of the existing quests.

thats a good point - you dont have to field your best deck each time, on emyn muil for instance i can build a deck that wins every time (just a spirit deck) however when i change it about it isnt so easy anymore….want to make it really hard? try it with tactics..now thats a challenge..and while this doesnt solve the problem them not getting any harder it may help you get more out of them

guciomir said:

Welcome. I see you were needing them to write your report.

lleimmoen said:

Yes, report was ready for about a week, but I did not know english card names, so I could not post it.

richsabre said:

The effect is powerful IF you are running Aragorn. If not, then the card is rubbish. I do not have much of a problem with near out of balance cards if they are deck specific. In fact, there is a long history in card games of very powerful cards that are designed to only work in a handful of decks and nowhere else. This is cool and in fact can lead to interesting decks as the designers can encourage deck builders to make strange decks. The fact that this works with what until Loreagorn was a practically unplayable hero makes this card a curiosity to encourage deck building.. not a stupid power card like say Awern that will be in 100% of all spirit decks for the rest of time.

Just wanted to get back to the OP. I played tonight with 4 players. I was hoping that the quest would somehow be much harder with more people. But alas it was still fairly easy. Oh well. It's not that I mind having an easier quest, I just wish it was more accurately labeled.

Narsil0420 said:

I feel this one can only get hard in the very beginning. If you get the Mine-shaft or Twisting Passage as a set up (for solo) and then again or the Spider which you cannot cancel. Once you fall behind early in this one, there's probably no going back. Having said that I really haven't lost this once. And I remember losing Passage through Mirkwood many times solo (and not with a pre-constructed deck but my own built).

Glaurung said:

I think part of the problem is accommodating the difficulty needs of different "tiers" of players within the same quests. The quests are trying to cater for the play level of relatively new players with smallish card pools, and at the same time for seasoned players with honed decks and access to all the cards.

One potential design solution to this problem, building on Glaurung's idea of "advanced rules", would be to build "difficulty levels" into each quest. I think this could be accomplished quite easily, by keeping the encounter deck the same but printing two sets of the quest cards, one for "standard" difficulty and one for "advanced". The "advanced" quests would (say) place additional cards in staging at the start (one of the key points that makes a quest difficult or easy in my view), require significantly more questing points at each stage, and/or place additional restrictions on the players (like the Dol Guldur "only one ally" clause, the RTM extra threat gain, etc).

I think this could work because:

- everyone understands and would be comfortable with the concept of "difficulty levels"

- it could be done by printing only a small number of additional/duplicate cards (the quest cards)

- it would keep the story and overall design of each quest the same

- it would give double the challenge and play experience to newer players - tackle the basic level and then move up to advanced when this has been mastered

On the other hand, it looks like part of the problem is that the designers/playtesters are not capable of properly assessing the difficulty of quests. To put it bluntly, if the playtesters assessed TLD as being on the same level as Dol Guldur or Return to Mirkwood, then those playtesters are not very good. Or it may be that the designers are not listening to what the playtesters tell them. Either way, the outcome seems to be that FFG are trying to meet the need for more challenging quests, but are not succeeding in doing so at the moment.

lleimmoen said:

Agreed. I think that even the apparently tough openings (eg double Twisting Passage) are still quite easy to get round. My play experience with TLD so far is:

- win quite easily and repeatedly with my existing solo deck

- win very easily and repeatedly two player

- take both "halves" of the two player pair of decks, which aren't even designed to run independently, and contain a number of dead, useless and seriously weakened cards, and still win very easily. This included a victory against Twisting Passage in set up and another one revealed turn one.

Conclusion: I agree with (it seems) pretty much everyone - this quest is trivially easy and very disappointing.

jjeagle said:

I got this disappointed already long time ago………. But unfortunelly there is no other Lotr card game at the moment now so i keep play this one.

let look on the last Cycle:

Hunt for Gollum - is ok. Not goof noy bad just ok.

Conflict in the Carrock- Really easy quest in my opinion not worse difficult 7

Rhosgobel- yes this is good one. Really hard and interesting.

Hills of Emyn Muil- this quest is the big shame for Designers. Really disasters

Dead Marches- interesting idea but in the end very easy and boring quest

Return to Mirkwood- This one is cool. Really ok.

Massing In Osgiliath- the best quest ever. Why we dont have other quests on the same level?

KD- is not really difficult but anyway increase difficult of the game and bring new mechanic. Good job.

Red horn Gate- Very good quest. interesting mechanic and what ls really important get more difficult on the second and last quest step.

In my opinion good Example of difficult level and interesting idea.

Road to Rivendel- Very big dissapointed. Really easy and stupid. Ambush sound cool as a mechanic but in play is quite boring and no dangerous at all.

Watcher in the Water- IS ok. Good quest. Cannot say is amazing but is not bad too.OK

Long Dark- Just get it. Sound not to diffiucult and sure not worse difficult level 7.

So this is my vision of the game.

Instead to make great quests and make the system where the players can increase or discrease difficult level they create very cool (in theory) game but really most of the quest is not really good. Lazy designers or FFG leaders is dont care? Anyway there is no other Lotr card game so people will play anyway right?

Cose we love this world and we like to touch it again. But in My opinion ME CCG was much much better and Decipher game also.

In my rating:1 ME CCG, Second Decipher game and last place for Lotr FFG.

So what we need to make this game bettter? Better quest more difficult and more fun, Better balanced cards and really much more hard work of designers. I know many players dont agree with me but this is my position. And i stay on this position whole year and i still there. Things going better now but still not enough to say This is great game!!! Sorry is not and im the first who suffer from it……..

there isnt more quests like osgilliath - because most people find that ridiculously hard!! your opinion is most certainly a minority in this game

i seriously cannot see what skills or experience you are applying to be so far ahead of everyone else on this forum and finding the quest so much easier than anyone else- after all many people must have similar or more experience than you, so whats your secrect?

im not being sarcastic here, im genuinely interested in what methods you are applying to get such easy results with all the quests as you have literally been finding this too easy since day one

I have to say I too am disapointed with some of the quests. But it is not mostly the difficulty aspect, for instance I really dislike Rhosgobel, it can be quite hard but boring (for me) and very specific, Lore of Imladris being the card though it is mostly bordering useless in other quests. Maybe that is not actually bad but as I dislike deckbuilding specifically for quests, I am not a fan of this. I also dislike a quest like this because the games tend to be very similar, rush through it, find an Athelas or two (or not even if you have a copy or two of Lore of Imladris) and be done with it. You don't get to use the combos you've got in your deck, you don't build on the strategies you'd prepared, you don't boost the heroes, you just want to be done with it as quickly as possible because each new round makes the table red. I know race against time makes sense it is just not my cup of tea in this case.

Given the disapointment I have had with some of the quests I am usually looking forward to player cards when a new adventure pack hits the stores (or is being previewed). Were it not for the player cards, I wouldn't have bought some of the quests surely.

i admit that the first things i buy a pack for are often the player cards…….but i suppose thats all part of how the game works

Seems to me that, from a solo player's point of view, there aren't many quests that will both challenge you without being impossible to win. Journey Down The Anduin comes to mind here. I'm hard pressed to find another quest that fulfills that purpose quite so well. Most of what we have seems to be fairly easy stuff like Emyn Muil, Hunt for Gollum, even The Long Dark, which so far has been pretty easy for me, as well. Or you get Dol Guldur, Return to Mirkwood or Massing At Osgiliath, which are extremely difficult. There seems to be little middle ground.

The problem, I think stems from the amount of difficult encounter cards in a deck. In the tough quests, you get tough card after tough card. In the easier ones, you have one or two cards that can really hurt and that's it. Sometimes, like in Gollum, cards have to form a combo to be of any real threat. I just think that scenarios could be created where encounter cards can be more balanced towards a certain amount of toughness overall without them being all brutal or mostly harmless.