when a unit reacts to a cc attack how is the damage done? dose the reacting unit deal dmg first or is it done at the same time?

Reactions occur simultaneously. So if a squad reacts by firing, then neither squad will lose models until after both sides have shot. We were doing this wrong, but Mack, the co-designer, set us straight at the Adepticon Demos, and after he told us, we found it quite clear in the book.

Page 34: "Attack reactions are resolved at the same time as the triggering Attack action"

In retrospect, not sure how we missed it ourselves . . .

thanx totaly missed that.

No worries, like I said, so did we. And when Mack was running us through the demo and said that, we BOTH thought he was wrong . . . until he pointed it out . . .

pg 57 "any attack reaction to a Close Combat attack action may only include Close Combat weapons."

Your only reaction to CC is CC. So no moving away or shooting!!

Not sure outside the context you've included here, but that's limited ATTACK reactions, not saying you CAN'T make a MOVE reaction instead . . .

But like I said, not saying I'm sure you CAN, just that the part you quoted there doesn't actually say that . . .

Got into this the other night :

p. 57, "The target unit cannot react with a move reaction"

Makes CC a lot more brutal once they get into range.

Just remember that you can react to the move action that puts the enemy unit in CC range, either by moving away or shooting at them. However also remember that if at the beginning of a units action if they have both actions and are suppressed during their activation they can finish their activation ignoring the suppression markers received during their activation. This was some my group was doing wrong up until last week.

-jay

HuronBH said:

Unless it is a Jump move, as you can not react to those. Incoming!!!!

Or it's Marcus leading a kampfaffen unit.

also do keep in mind that should you survive the flurry of blows from the attacking unit, you are welcome to blast away at them at short range come your next oppertunity. I find that if a close combat unit doesnt destroy my defending squad, it'll happily shoot away at the attackers. You do not HAVE to fight in close combat when within 3 inches if it is your attack action.

caecitas said:

That is true and always an option!

But if you're in close combat range, I believe the enemy can react with close combat weapons even if you don't use them to attack.

felkor said:

Yes, they have that option [as long as they can react]

I believe you can react to a shooting attack with CC attack assuming you are able to react. I haven't seen anything that prevents it.

But this brings up an interesting situation with cover that is being discussed elsewhere. If both units are touching the same terrain, if you get a cover save by being in cover granting terrain, the Gorillas would get a cover save from the shooting attack while the unit doing the shooting would not get a cover save from the CC attack by the rule on page 57 Cover cannot negate damage from a CC attack.

This makes both Gorillas and Zombies more deadly against shooty units if you can get to them in Hard Cover. .

fortunately zombies get 1 less level of cover then they should. Also Ed ive clarrified the rule for you in the other thread.

On topic of shooting an up close unit, its worth mentioning how many close combat units have methods of avoiding reactions when moving up to get within close combat range. Coupled with the damage output of most close combat units, very few defending squads survive a flurry of blows with any serious numbers.