There are some cards I found weird that they are on the list. So here is some analyze of the cards from scale 1-5 (5 means it should totally be in the list and 1 it doesn't belong to the list). I think neutral cards should be restricted easiest because every deck can include them easily. Now there are some cards on the list which never see play. Post your thoughts also.

Itinerant Scholar

This I don't get. Card is ok that you can undrain your domain and drain your opponents biggest domain but it is one use only. I don't find that too major. Is there some recursion combo I am not aware? Was Misk rush too powerful before? 1/5

Things in the Ground

This is a cool card and could make some strong decks. But I don't see it needing restriction so bad. Maybe there is again some not Yog decks where this card would be too strong but I don't see them. 2/5

Diseased Sewer Rats

Might go to almost every deck if unrestricted. With skill 0 this card would had been perfect. Still strong but not too strong. I feel should still stay in the list because I fear I would face this in every game otherwise. 3,5/5

Negotium Perambulans in Tenebris

Can kill some rush decks and other decks too. Very strong effect and that kind of effect shouldn't be accessible to every deck . 5/5

Descendant of Eibon

The original card goes to category "what the heck designers were thinking". Rare to see so unbalanced card design in any game. After errata more balanced but still even those icons with 3 cost with blank card text would be totally playable. 4,5/5

Nyarlathotep

Poor Nyarl never gets to a deck because other cards in the list are stronger. 4 cost is a lot and the gap between 3 and 4 is a biggest gap for me. I don't think this would be included in every deck if it wouldn't be in the list. Hard to say. 3/5

Guardian Pillar

Costs one too little. I like the card but it so hard to get rid of. At least only works during your or opponents turn and it is unique. Might be ok to unrestrict if there are more dreamlands cards coming and some location/support controlling cards. But should stay in the list for now. 3,5/5

Doppelgänger

Powerful character that I don't want to see every deck 3x with some other Yog cards. 4/5

Khopesh of the Abyss

Duh 5/5

Iniative of Huang Hun

Bounce shouldn't be so easily done and especially not repeatable. Should stay. 4/5

Then cards to think adding to list:

Snow Graves

This card goes to every deck. Can somebody share design behind this card? Was it made to counter Eibon? I haven't played this game so much so I don't know. Discard pile recursion can be very powerful but this card kills the not powerful effects also. If there is too strong recursion card, then restrict it. Snow Graves just kills the balanced and fun recursion cards also. 4/5

Temple of R'lyeh or Deep One Assault

Only if Cthulhu is too dominant. Destruction and sacificing shouldn't be easily repeatable with Temple. If my board is cleared or almost cleared with Khopesh Temple gets very scary. I have to play 2xChar and then Attachment if I want to play any Attachments. I would also like to see other strong Cthulhu card restricted so there would be choice between that and Khopesh. That is reason to include Deep One Assault. 3/5

Surreal said:

Yes, there are two combos to lock all of your opponent's domains in the opponent's refresh phase.

Things in the Ground

This is a cool card and could make some strong decks. But I don't see it needing restriction so bad. Maybe there is again some not Yog decks where this card would be too strong but I don't see them. 2/5

things in the ground + nyarlatothep turn 1 = absolute win.

Then cards to think adding to list:

Snow Graves

This card goes to every deck. Can somebody share design behind this card? Was it made to counter Eibon? I haven't played this game so much so I don't know. Discard pile recursion can be very powerful but this card kills the not powerful effects also. If there is too strong recursion card, then restrict it. Snow Graves just kills the balanced and fun recursion cards also. 4/5

decks killed by snow graves just add deep one assault and there is no problem anymore. Only efficient against resurection or combos decks. And These decks have counter to that card. I really don't see that card as an overpowered card. And it takes 3 spaces in a deck. I don't want to draw them when i'm in a difficult situation.

I agreed with the entire Restricted List, except for Nyarlathotep… until B_P's comments. Thanks for clearing that up

I think that Snow Graves does not belong on the Restricted List; instead, it deserves a Steadfast Shub icon. Most newer 0 cost cards are at least Steadfast whatever faction, and that would limit its "it belongs in every deck"-ness. That's what Diseased Sewer Rats were made restricted.. but SG can be solved a different, more preferable way. Also, just as a design order clarification, Snow Graves came out several sets prior to Descendant of Eibon originally. Mountains of Madness was just a MUCH harder set to find before, and I blame 8xSledge Dogs for that! (As a personal aside, grr @ Hata and his Dutch Courage + Sledge Dogs!)

I disagree with your assessment of Initiate of Huang Hun. Bouncing is really not that prevalent from what I can tell. Of course, I use him in my deck, so what do I know? There are other way more annoying OotST cards out there. I'm not naming my favorite for risk of it getting the Ban Hammer

Temple of R'lyeh is also not that powerful. If you have a Cthulhu deck that relies on killing your own to force your opponent to kill creatures… last time I checked, Cthulhu wasn't typically a very fast faction. I think people are blowing that card way out of proportion. I'd much rather have a card like A Small Price to Pay in a deck than Temple of R'lyeh because ASPtP is much harder to counter and is as effective 90% of the time, if not moreso. And no one is clamoring about ASPtP.

Also, saying Deep One Assault should be Restricted would be like making that argument for Fireball in MtG. If you wanted to make an argument of why any X/X+1 cost card should be Restricted and/or Banned, I'd argue Catastrophic Explosion because it's essentially like Earthquake in MtG.

While we're at it, why are Magah Birds and The Seventy Steps still Banned? They were really only broken with Endless Interrogation as well, and that card most definitely needs to remain Banned. Magahs are so easy to counter… like with a Catastrophic Explosion! Both of those cards would go a long way to bringing Hastur back to a tier 1 faction too…

B_P said:

Itinerant Scholar

Could you share what those combos are? I guess other part of the combo would in the restricted list also so combo can't be used together but I don't see those. I guess Itinerant Scholar and Doppelgänger could be annoying but nothing too major. I don't see things in the ground + nyarlatothep absolutely win. It is annoying that opponent has to put resources random every turn apart from first one. It is strong effect to get nyarlatothep out so early. Might be worth to test if it is too abusive. You need lot of luck anyway to get Nyarlatothep out with first effect and later turns that effect is not so major anymore.

I don' think Snow Graves is necessary overpowered. It just kills the balanced effects also and can go to every deck. I don't understand the card design behind it at all. Lets say I want to include Yog cards in my deck, 3x Speak to the Dead and 3x Unspeakable Resurrection and some other cards. Those cards are strong but nothing too major. But I feel very uneasy including those cards because I will have 6x dead cards in my deck if I get Snow Graved. But those cards are not strong enough to make me include anti-Snow graves in my deck. I think it is very rare worth it to include cards against Snow Graves, better just not include recursion cards in your deck. So I just choose not to use discard pile recursion cards at all. That is what I feel Snow Graves is doing. It just punishes the balanced cards also and makes options about deck building actually lower. Those kind of cards worst cards anybody can design in my book. It doesn't offer any new strategies but does exactly the opposite.

AUCodeMonkey said:

I don't think The Seventy Steps is banned, just Magah Birds. Magah Birds and that card might still be too strong card. Getting that in opening hand and going first still means 3 stories unopposed. Game might be all about starting hands. But I feel it could be safe to make Magah Birds unbanned. There are ways to counter it now but almost every deck has to include counter of that also. Negotium makes Magah Birds cry. I just wouldn't want to every question to be "How I counter Magah Birds" when building a deck, especially if the best answers are in restricted list.

Also I feel restricted list have totally different role that ban list. Restricted list makes deck building more interesting because you have to think what to include in your deck. Restricted list is more about not having "it belongs in every deck"-ness. So not every card in restricted list is necessary super strong card. It just makes decks more varied from each other. That is reason to maybe think restrict other Cthulhu card but only if Cthulhu gets too good. Now Khopesh is always picked as restricted card so there isn't any choice. I don't think strong and powerful are wrong. I feel totally different. Problem is just when the whole meta game sifts to unwanted direction because of some strong cards. But this is not happening yet.

I remember before the restricted list showed up, i could easily deal all opponent's decks with rats, doppel, faceless abductors, dreamlands fanatics.

So, i think the restricted list is a good idea to improve deckbuilding.

With itinerant shcolar, the problem is different. It can be in or out of the restricted list, for the moment, it doesn't change anything. I see it as a reminder of the force of that card.

B_P said:

That's true. I guess Peaslee and the Ritual of Sacrifice (or w/e it's called) are both not Restricted either, so that combo could work. Is there another combo with Itinerant Scholar that you were thinking of?

AUCodeMonkey said:

I know of a few people who made a specific campaign to ban Magah. As if (in their words) "Banning magah will save the game".

I agree it was not magah that was broken but the 2 or 3 card combo involved with it.

That said, it is a very quick card still. I am of two minds regarding Magah and still have not fully recovered from thinking that that card was placed in the wrong faction. But I still think like a few other nasty cards like deep one assault, while nasty can be worked around and still consistently win against.

Aspiring artist was once banned, the first card to be banned in fact. Yet it now rests comfortably if rather crippled overly much as a legally tournament playable card. I see no reason why Magah could not similarly be either given errata, placed in restriction or both.

As for the list. I agree with the ratings for the most part and wont comment on the cards too much that previous posters have because I share similar thoughts.

I will say though that MANY people have said Snow Graves should be restricted for quite a long time.

I think that is a knee jerk mistake and beleive like many others that simply giving the card errata that it would now be Steadfast would solve a lot of its perceived problems.

Either solution for Snow Graves (Steadfast or Restricted) would be OK with me, but I do prefer Steadfast as the better solution.

I agree. Making it steadfast would be a good solution - definitely better than making it restricted.

I actually think restricting it is better. IF you make it steadfast only Yog can use it which means every faction loses the ability to prevent all the discard pile recursion shenanigans including all the relics. I am convinced that is a card that needs to be generally available in the environment.

Restricting it keeps it available to everyone, but lessons the chance of seeing it in every deck, it becomes a meta choice, and Yog discard manipulation decks become more viable…

That is my reasoning at least.

Well, if it became Steadfast, that would open up the possibility to add more cards that prevent discard recursion. Right now there's not really room for those I think because they'd have to be better than a card that does it for 0 cost, which is hard.

dboeren said:

I don't understand why this game needs more deck type disablers. New cards should be enablers to make new kind of strategies and decks available. This avoids power creep also. I am surprised how little this game use different keywords for example (Like card giving some benefits for Scientist etc). There are many different cards in this game but I feel there is surprising few different good deck types. I feel restricted is best thing for Snow Graves.

Those aren't keywords those are subtypes. Keywords are things like Toughness, Heroic, Invulnerability.

And the reason is because it really makes the design incredibly linear. I grab everything that says Mi-Go and boom I have a deck… either the deck is designed to do everything, or it has glaring holes in it and no one plays it. For whatever reason people seem reluctant to splash.

New cards definitely lean more towards reinforcing or creating new deck types than providing solutions to existing ones… but you need to have cards which do double duty, and Snow Graves is one of those cards. In a deck intended to filter or discard cards from your opponents deck Snow Graves is a serious tool in preventing him from turning your deck off. Sure it can also wreck other deck types, but it enables one also.

I feel there are many characters with just different icons and minor effects. That is not very interesting but of course those vanilla cards are needed too. I feel there aren't so many cards which really make feel like "I wanna build a deck around this mechanic". I feel decks I do are some faction strongest cards with support of 3x Khopesh, 3x Dreamlands Fanatic and 3x The Terror of The Tides for example. Then add some strong neutral or other cards which doesn't necessary need resource match. Khopesh and Negotium seem to be the main restricted cards I think of. I like cards similar as Things in the Ground which can create a new deck type. There is new spoiled card also now:

This card doesn't make feel play Miskatonic focused deck. Quite the opposite because I feel this character is better in a deck which has strong character destruction. But I might put some strong Misk resource needing cards to my deck with that new card. I feel you want to splash many different cards in your deck from some different factions (many loyal cards can make exception). Like The Terror of The Tides can go to many decks. I must say I like a lot the direction that it is easier now to include other factions to your deck. There are so much more choices that way. So I like the new card. You have to balance your deck more carefully so your resourcing works also. I don't even feel there is a Cthulhu or Miskatonic deck. I haven't understood why anybody would make just single faction deck. I feel I plan my decks different than else. But this going bit off topic now. I just wanted to talk about the new card also.

If that card gets Miskatonic more play time, then I approve! Even if she's just splashed into decks! My first deck was a Cops and Nerds deck, so I'm always going to have a soft spot for them

I think Surreal is right.

Dr. Mya is going to see more play time in Cthulhu destruction decks than it will in Nerd decks.

Which is a shame. Too early to say that for sure of course. But if I were a Cthulhu player, I would toss that in a deck in a meta that is so seemingly destruction-centric.

But back on topic, I agree in some ways with Penfold, as his argument is compelling. But Dboeren I feel is more accurate in the assessment of its power. Everyone locking down recursion which is the perview of Shub is nearly as bad as every deck being destruction centric which is the perview of Cthulhu.

Now that Snow Graves (as illustrated by Penfold in the rules forum with the relevant FAQ entry) locks down Yog-Sothoth the Lord of Time and Space 's action, Yog mill tech via recursion is severely crippled by a single card. I repeat, an entire deck archetype is crippled by a single card…. that anyone can take… and then play for free. Arguably the most effective mono faction mill deck available to Yog, if I do say so myself.

And even more importantly, it cripples Shub recursion decks further by use of their own card against them… that anyone can take… and then play for free.

I would not have a problem with that if I could so easily shut down Cthulhu destruction tech, but alas this is not possible.

I know that I am biased towards that deck archetype, but as one who so strongly pours his energy in making that alternate deck type function even slightly well, the wide availability of Snow Graves to possibly become Restricted instead of Steadfast I beleive would be a mistake. It makes the power disparity between Cthulhu destruction and other deck types even wider by allowing everyone to take Snow Graves in an unrestricted manner.

Hellfury said:

I have to agree, because when I saw that card my immediate thought was to put her in other decks rather than in Miskatonic decks. Sure, she's useful to them too, but Miskatonic decks are already heavily loaded with Investigation. But in the mythos factions this is rare. Cthluhu has the most destruction, sure, but Shub and Yog would want someone like that too, or any variety of 2-faction decks.

Cards like this, Black Dog, Master of the Myths, etc.. are making me wonder if we're seeing a new Rainbow meta coming. There have been a lot of "pay X to put into play" characters lately that can be splashed into whatever deck you like and sooner or later people will start really experimenting with them.