Hi all,

in Purge the Unclean

It depends on the power level you want to field them on - I'd put them as elite enemies that should put the fear in even a group of experienced acolytes, especially in melee. If anything, I'd say some of their stats could use adjusting up. If we go by the tabletop stats, these are drug-spiked, supremely skilled killers that pretty much no one wants to go in close combat with. They are an elite foe, and generally I think player should only expect to go toe-to-toe with them if they are martially-inclined acolytes of at least RT level of power.

- stats: I'd boost to 55+. The other stats may need minor adjustment. As a rule of thumb, take the CA Dire Avenger, remove a lot of the shooting, improve their CC ability. You could also decrease their agility if you give them agility-enhancing drugs.

- wounds: 12+. Sure, they usually don't get hit, but they are trained warriors. **** happens, and they need to handle it.

- Talents: consider any of Blademaster, combat master, lightning reflexes, leap up, decadence, sure strike, wall of steel or step aside (I would prefer wall of steel so they can only use it in CC). Basically, they should be very, very nasty in CC, not to mention hard to hit.

- gear: some may just have best-quality mono weapons, without the poison (or rather, have some poison in their gear). Also, seriously, where are the drugs ? Wyches are infamous for using some of the craziest combat drugs cocktails in the setting. They should go in battle hyped up on more biochemistry than anyone, maybe except a noise marine. Maybe.

As for the special guns… a blast pistol would be close to a melta pistol (as there are atm no rules for melta weapons in DH apart from high penetration), a shardnet would be a thrown entangling weapon, and an impaler would probably be a best-quality mono-something weapon with some fancy special rule - maybe base damage 1d10+2, pen 4, tearing?

Thanks a lot for your input.

Actually, I do not want to accommodate them to a certain power level, as I do not like this approach. This sounds too much like in computer games where you have level 2 goblins in area A and level 49 goblins in area z. The “accommodation” in regard to the power level happens for me through their numbers in the end (somewhere between one and a dozen…).

Still, my (five) PCs are all just Rank 6 and relatively martially minded (Arbitrator, Guardsman, Assassin, Tech-Priest, Psyker). They are about to embark to Mara (Dead Stars) and thus rather well equipped.

I have the stats for Incubi and Mandrakes from Black Crusade and I do not want Wyches to be better in combat than these. In the TT they count as Troops and are not considered Elites or something like that.

You have a good point in regard to the combat drugs. Is it somewhere mentioned how they inject/consume/whatever them? My PCs will encounter them after they massacred all personnel on an Inquisitorial space station, so I am not sure whether they should still be on drugs.

I sort of based their stats on a combination of their TT stats and the stats for Kabalite Warriors in Purge the Unclean. I could indeed increase their wounds a little. Most of your proposed Talents make sense as well. They should indeed be very hard to hit or pin, and they should hit really hard in CC, but they are also sort of glass cannons. So, when hit by a bolt on the chest or caught in the blast of a grenade, they should be toast.

Maybe I take the poison/Toxic away from the close combat weapons and put up some sort of combat drug instead. Good (or even Best) Quality for the CC wepons sounds also quite fitting. I will include an Agonizers and other DE wepons from RT most probably as well.

It depends on the power level you want to field them on - I'd put them as elite enemies that should put the fear in even a group of experienced acolytes, especially in melee. If anything, I'd say some of their stats could use adjusting up. If we go by the tabletop stats, these are drug-spiked, supremely skilled killers that pretty much no one wants to go in close combat with. They are an elite foe, and generally I think player should only expect to go toe-to-toe with them if they are martially-inclined acolytes of at least RT level of power.

Any more ideas guys?

Luthor Harkon said:

FoC slots don't count for that much. Mandrakes are infiltrators and assassins, wyches are gladiators. In their area of expertise, I expect wyches to be better. Incubi, now, they are another story - they are a full-blown warrior cult, at least as zealously dedicated as the craftworld aspects, and in addition to that sport heavy armor and powerful weapons.

Luthor Harkon said:

I agree that Wyches shouldn't be better than Incubi, but they should be better than rank-and-file Kabalite Warriors. As you have statted them, they lag behind the Dark Eldar's 'grunt' troops (as Warriors are depicted in BC ). I would re-scale them to fall between Warriors and Incubi (but with worse armour…).

Warriors have medium to long range weaponry and armour. Their job is to provide firepower, hold objectives and do general work on the battlefield. (Best in firefights)

Wyches have short range and CC weapons and almost no armour. Their role is to engage with the enemy using their speed, paticularly enemy troops which they will generally outclass. Their weaponry allows them to deal with a number of different targets including hordes. (Best in CC amongst the enemy troops)

Incubi are the Archons and Drachons most powerful bodyguard. They have heavy armour and are heavily armed with huge Klaivex power weapons. They are best used to take on enemy elites who tend to be of a lesser number where their skill at arms and their powerful weapons will make short work of their foes. (Best in CC against enemy elites)

Thank you all for you input. My original stats were more based on the DE in Purge the Unclean. I took a better look at BC now and adapted a lot of the helpful comments and ideas, thereby trying to focus more on the gladiatorial and acrobatic themes.

Dark Eldar Wyches

WS 49
BS 41
S 38
T 36
AG 63(12)
Int 32
Per 48
WP 35
Fel 35

Movement: 6/12/18/36 Wounds: 12

Skills:
Acrobatics +20, Awareness +10, Common Lore (Dark Eldar), Deceive, Dodge +20, Drive (Skimmer/Hoverer), Intimidate +10, Scrutiny, Silent Move, Speak Language (Dark Eldar)

Talents:
Ambidextrous, Combat Master, Crippling Strike, Exotic Weapon Training (Dark Eldar), Furious Assault, Hard Target, Leap Up, Lightning Reflexes, Resistance (Fear), Sprint, Sure Strike, Two Weapon Fighting (Ballistic, Melee)

Traits:
Unnatural Agility (x2)

Armour:
Eldar Wych Armour (2 AP All)

Weapons:
Splinter Pistol (Range 50m, S/3/-, 1d10+2 R, Pen 3, Clip 120, 2 Full, Toxic)
Splinter Pistol (Melee, 1d5+3 R, Pen 2)
Blade Whip (3m; 1d10+6 R, Pen 2, Flexible, Tearing)
Shardnet (SB; 1d10+3 R, Pen 1, Flexible, Tearing, Shocking, Snare)
Impaler (1D10+4 R, Pen 4)
Good Quality Mono Combat Knife (1d5+6 R, Pen 2)
Good Quality Mono Punch Dagger (1D5+4 R, Pen 4)
Plasma Grenade (Sx3; 1D10+6 E, Pen 6, Blast(1))

Gear:
Combat Drugs (counts as a combined dose of Frenzon and Stimm), Trophies (Heads, Ears, Fingers), 2 Reloads for Splinter Pistol

That looks good to me!

I have no idea ehat the stats are like in Black Crusade, but Wyches are close to a match for an Astartes, despite being practically naked. They fight Genestealers in the arena. Again, practically naked.

I would make WS and Agility 55 AT MINIMUM, wuth Unntural Agility of course. I would also give them the Temple Assassin trait; or maybe reserve that for Succubi. A Succubus should be at or near Temple Assassin level.

The PtU warriors are pretty badly designed (albeit an early attempt). They don't have Dodge trained, IIRC, which is kind of silly for Eldar (nothing does the Space Marine). Nor do they have Unnatural Agility, which I think all Eldar statted out later do.