Just wondering as I've been comparing stats with the cards to see is they are of any use (no, to many changes) and it appears that the Axis have been well nerfed. Sigrid can't fight her way out of a paperbag after being one of the toughest fighters, a single 17pdr is now more effective than quad 128mm, Heinrich is now worse than Wildfire for the same pts, Lothar is only half as good against infantry, squads have lost their grenades, twin MG44's are worse…..

I don't have the Allied cards, how do the two profiles compare there?

As an allied player, I say it's high time the axis stop living high on the hog!

I might think this is like comparing apples and oranges. Warfare is a very different game the ONLY thing these two games share is the models. I kinda feel that Dust warfare has its own checks and balances built into it, and there's way to many folks making assumptions without playing any games, The D6 Generation is going to be doing a in depth spot on the DW game in thier next pod cast episode, I am hoping it will be informative and dismiss alot of the negative assumtions and really focus on the point that the two games are not even close in game play….no negative intention here just trying to be positive and recomend folks be open minded before they compare the games its kind like saying all white folks are releated it doesnt work…LOL

Peace brother!

From the looks of each army, it seems like they each have units that are meant to help counter one another. Not to mention taking troops that have the ability to come back as Zombies seems to be pretty rad, although I know the chances of bringing an entire squad back as zombies is slim to none. We will have to wait to see how the Allies and Axis fair against the SSU.

I think where a lot of the pain is in the sudden change in play style of the axis. Before laser crazy Germans with walker support and some recon grenadiers were great. Now on paper it looks like the allies are faster, harder hitting, more versatile, just as cheap, just as resilient against axis weapons, and have more options to avoid unit reactions.

Some of it has to be typos and hopefully some errata on both sides. The rest has to be on play style but from the first book I can't see where they are going with a static German core and fast flanking support units.

I haven't played the game yet though so I don't have the hard facts.

A few Allied things got nerfed too. Tank Head isn't as powerful, and Steel Rain's rockets don't pack the same punch.

The Axis still seem to in general get more dice to throw, and when cover cancels out the first die or two, that's a big deal.

Also, the one heavy Axis walker got a boost in health and armor.

felkor said:

The Cannon heavy Axis walker, Koingsluther, got a huge boost from "Penetrator" on it's guns too. nasty business.

As a group we have played more table top "improvised" games than tile games. Now that we have the Warfare rule set it's obvious that Warfare is not just Tactics without the tiles Like we played it..

Suppression, Reactions, Command actions all have to be factored into the new game. Sure the Zombies are now Troop Type 2 instead of 3 but they dont suffer from Suppression.

Now if you play Tactics with this change then yes, I see your point. But then again you can just use the stats for Tactics. And, the primary Allied player claims his units were nerfed and the Axis is too powerful. We played our first game last Saturday.

I dread the Long Toms (No biggie according to him)!. And I can't wait to explore the nuances of this NEW game.

Yes, Axis got nerfed hard. My biggest complaint is the tank area, the konigsluther is supposed to be the biggest baddest tank ever made best armor best guns, practically unstoppable and the allied punisher has 8 armor and a bonus to damage chart rolls, if they are doing that for the the allies they better at least give the K. Luther Damage resilient because that what dozer blade is now. also damage resilient got nerfed to hell and back. For armor 3 troops the allies now have a mobility advantage a close combat advantage and an anti tank advantage where axis gets…. an extra 33% chance to prevent 1 damage, definately not on par. for armor 2 UGLs are rediculus they make the entire attack ignore cover, and they are 2 rolls each. this gives the the recon boys and most other allied armor 2 units 8 extra rolls vs armor 2 inf and inf 3. while the the Axis units don't even get an extra panzerfaust to compensate all with the allied units being cheaper. When try to fix a slight imbalance they completely over-nerfed axis units and over boosted allies. all you need to look at is rocket punch and you can see the problem.

I thought balancing and playtesting were a couple of the reasons they delayed the release … so what im reading here is they cant even balance 2 teams off eachother? Think im gonna wait for FFG to tweak their rules before buying any books. Shame, i had confidence in them on this one .. and shame, because i bought a ****-load of minis to start playing with asap.

Hatamoto said:

From what I've heard the Axis have won a few battles in a few battle reps people have posted here and elsewhere on the web which is why I'm confused by the 'nerf'. Maybe it appears there's a nerf compared to Tactics but it's also different when you have the ability to take x y and z of certain units in your platoons. As said, let's wait and see what happens when the Russians come out because it could result in everybody getting a spanking with some of their troops and abilities.

Yeah, I lost to the Axis in my Battle Report. They are not nerfed from what I have seen so far. I think it is way too early to be crying "foul" just yet. Let's wait and see what happens over the next couple of months.

I played 2 games on Tuesday and we both won 1 game, and they were both pretty close games.

Cool, that's good to know, looks like they have downgraded Allied weapons to so that probably balances things out.

post game results here and we'll have the numbers to compare:

http://at43-confrontation.co.uk/dustleague.html

axis 3 allies 1 so far. afraid i gave up that win…