Hi all, I wanted to share our Heroes' hosing for all to enjoy.

Overlord: The Titan
Initial upgrades: Lawlessness (5CT), Fiery Armor (5CT), Remove 4 cards (5CT)

Karnon, "The Badass" 4 CT, 16-4-1(4:Mle/3:Rng+Mgc)-4, 5/0/0
Ability: Tread Ice, immune to Frost and Fear
Skills: Parry (+1 armor / level vs Melee)
Supplies: Chain Mail, Axe (~ +1 Dmg)
Treasure: None

Varikas, "The Sexy" 4 CT, 16-4-2(4)-3, 2/0/1
Abilitiy: Recover 1 fatigue every turn
Skills: Leadership (Ready action on any hero for 1 fatigue)
Supplies: Chain Mail, Axe (~ +1 Dmg)
Treasure: None

Mad Carthos, "The Insane" 2/3CT (curse), 8-3-1(2:Mle/4:Rng+Mgc)-4, 0/0/3
Ability: +2 Dmg Magic
Skills: Inner Fire (+2 Rng & +1 Dmg with Ranged or Magic)
Supplies: Ring (+1), Wizards Robe (+0/+2)
Treasure: Staff of the Grave (cursed)

Lyssa, "The Cute & Cuddly" 2CT, 8-5-1(2)-5, 1/1/1
Ability: Force attacker to re-roll 1 die
Skills: Eagle Eye (Pierce 2 and +1 Rng with Ranged attack)
Supplies: Leather Armor, Iron Shield, Crossbow (~~ +1 Dmg)
Treasure: Ripper (Pierce 2, Reroll 1 die)

Sun Jan 04 2009, 8:00pm

WEEK 1: OL +1 CT

Heroes come up with a plan to head down to Olmric's Hut, so that Lyssa and Carthos can get some health, and Karnon and Varikas can get more fatigue.

OL moves Alric to the Plains of the Ruby Gate
Heroes move to Thelsvan Highway (no encounter), explore dungeon (Heroes +1 CT)
CT: 1/1

Level 1: 17, Bag of Bones

Heroes take a while to figure out how to trap Janius, but eventually they get him with a wall of human guard tokens. Lava Beetle spawn proves useless -- they have Blast, but the damage doesnt hurt the players by more than 1 wound. OL plays Doom and scores a kill with Dark Charm.

* Heroes gain 5 CT (3- glyph, 2-leader)
* OL gains 8 CT (2 kills of Lyssa, 2 kills of Carthos)

Heroes find the Ripper in the Chest, and buy the Staff of the Grave in a restock.

CT: 6/9 (15)

Wed Jan 07 2009, 8:00pm

Level 2: 5, The Barracks

Mad Carthos manages to blaze ALL the red masters from what seemed like a safe distance of an elevated 6 spaces away. Master Sorcerer and Ferrox killed instantly. Calls himself Point and Click he's so cocky with his big new Staff. Karnon rushes across the map to kill some Deep Elves, and gets swamped - 6 monsters attack and take Karnon down.

* Heroes gain 6 CT (3-glyph, 2-leader, 1-chest)
* OL gains 11 CT (4- Karnon, 4-Varikas, 3-Carthos/curse)

Heroes get hosed in the chest, no treasure, everyone wants to trade in their free CT for an item.

CT: 12/20 (32)

Level 3: 4, The Bridge of Death

Razorwings prove to be much stronger in RTL than in vanilla. Heroes kill the level leader in the first 2 turns, but take some damage - Karnon, Varikas, and Carthos get killed to make it happen. Then the Minions take forever to kill off, as the heroes are not able to get on the map at the same time, and they are committed to getting the treasures. 3 kills come at the end once Carthos and Lyssa have run thru the teleporter, leaving Karnon and Varikas alone.

* Heroes gain 7 CT (3-glyph, 4-leader)
* OL gains 30 CT (3-deck, 5-Karnon/curse, 4-Carthos/2curse, 4-Varikas, 2-Lyssa, 4-Karnon, 4-Varikas, 4-Karnon)

After all that work, the Heroes find another ranged weapon in the chest.

CT: 19/50 (69)

Death toll
Karnon: 4
Varikas: 3
Carthos: 4
Lyssa: 3

Wed Feb 04 2009, 8:00pm

This week's theme is "We're gonna make the Overlord cry like a baby". Do they succeed?

Heroes change their original plan of heading south toward Olmric's Hut, to instead head north toward the Caverns of Thuul.

WEEK 2: OL +1 CT

OL spends 30 CT upgrading BEASTS to silver.
OL moves Alric to Greyhaven
Heroes move back to Tamalir, (no encounter) and buy the Staff, the Boat, and some potions.

WEEK 3: OL +1 CT

OL spends 10 CT to buy a RED treachery.
OL (Alric) places 1st siege token on Greyhaven.
Heroes move to Greyhaven, and buy more potions.

ENCOUNTER:
The Wild Hunt, in the Snowy Woods. Heroes make quick work of 3 hell hounds, then race off instead of chasing down the leader. Silver Hell Hounds are worthless when the heroes can stand behind a tree and be immune to fire. (Petrified trees?)

WEEK 4: OL +1 CT

OL spends 5 CT to recruit Lord Merrick, places him in Shadow Peaks.
OL (Alric) places 2nd siege token on Greyhaven.
Heroes move 2 trails, to the Caverns of Thuul, but get LOST in an encounter, and return to Greyhaven. OL thanks the Heroes for his free CT and their lack of direction.

WEEK 5: OL +1 CT

OL spends 5 CT to recruit Lady Eliza, places her in Shadow peaks.
OL moves Merrick to Plains of the Ruby Gate.
OL (Alric) places 3rd siege token on Greyhaven.
Heroes move 2 trails (again) to the Caverns of Thuul, no encounter. (Heroes +1 CT)

Level 1: 37, Web of Something or other.

OL drools over this dungeon, crawling with 9 silver Spiders. 3 of them are red, and 2 of those red ones get 2 silver dice due to the Avatar bonus. This level is hell for the Heroes to beat, and they get slaughtered. OL feels bad it was such a hosing - Silver Spiders are nasty, particularly the red ones, and particularly when the OL draws two Rage cards to start the level. In the opening round, Carthos, Karnon, and Lyssa are killed off before ever getting to do more than use their Guard. Varikas manages to survive due to being tucked behind some rubble. Heroes will think twice before moving slow and using Guards in the future. Mad Carthos is renamed from "Point and Click" to "Scratch and Whiff". OL gets Doom in play. Heroes roll no treasure (again), and settle for the 1 CT consolation prize.

* Heroes gain 7 CT (2-leader, 4-saving the peasants, 1-chest)
* OL gains 24 CT (3-Carthos/curse, 4-Karnon, 2-Lyssa, 4-Karnon, 4-Varikas, 3-Carthos/curse, 4-Karnon)

CT gained: +8/+28
CT: 27(27)/78(28) (105 total)

Want to know how our valiant Heroes get their butts kicked next week? Stay tuned...

Wed Feb 18, 9pm
Level 2: Dungeon 35, Pull of the Depths

This week our beloved heroes enter level 2 in their quest to clear out the Caverns of Thuul. Drawn in by the lure of the gems that await below, they enter the level:

Initial setup allows the Overlord to place Razorwings and Hellhounds, getting some silver beasts in play. Includes one red Razorwing which moves 10. The Heroes have a hard time getting past the pits – it’s too far to run to the middle, but staying back is too slow. They opt for a middle ground, and stay just far enough from the pits that they won’t fall in, but still make progress. The pit-sucking is fun for everyone – and crimps the heroes’ style as they try to do their usual methodical movements. Karnon gets strung out early and takes a killing, but a Razorwing and a Hellhound go down, so I don’t know who did better in the opening round. With Karnon out, the party regroups, and the Overlord falls back, and spawns a Beastman War Party. The Command is great, giving every monster +1 as heroes try to enter the narrow corridor. Cat and mouse ensues for a while, heroes are unable to break into the second room, but they slowly pick off monster after monster, and the Overlord doesn’t waste too much threat respawning. The 2nd spawn of the evening is two Shades with Stealth – causing the first 4 attacks on them to be misses. They’re great blockers since Karnon and Varikas can’t hit them. The telekinesis of the leader was effective for dealing out 2 damage at a time by pushing heroes into pits, plus getting to attack – tho a bit squishy as he could only take 3 hits once the heroes reached him.

The OL managed to get simultaneous kills on both Karnon and Varikas, sure to send the party packing as they have to reenter the dungeon, but Lyssa managed to slip thru and activate the glyph, and bring the deceased warriors back into the fray quickly. This leads to a rather abrupt end to an otherwise hard-fought dungeon. At the end, the heroes lollygag around, and don’t want to let the last gold pile go unclaimed, so they tinker with the remaining white monsters, and their greed leads to one last kill of Carthos. They run off, and the OL happily returns the unclaimed gold to the storage tray.

Conquest gained: OL: 29, Heroes: 6 (35 total)
Conquest total: OL: 107, Heroes: 33 (140 total)

If we’re lucky, the game will flip into Silver stage by the end of this dungeon, and the OL can do some upgrades finally. Just have to average 30 CT on the final 2 levels. Carrying 55 threat into level 3 will help.

Oh yeah the chest? No treasure. Again. Just gold, and 3 vitality potions. And a sucker for the heroes to enjoy with their free CT.

Another day goes by and the Heroes get beaten down some more. They finish the Caverns of Thuul, but have to run out after only defeating one of the Gemstone Dragons due to the OL having too much threat stored up. We've now hit Silver level, and stopped before any upgrades or the next action in Terranoth. CT is something like 50 to 200. Is this worth playing on? At this point, the OL will do back-to-back upgrades, taking Eldritch to Silver, and Beasts to Gold, unless the Heroes jump right into another dungeon, which they wont do since they need to upgrade themselves. They have enough cash and XP to get a skill and a die, give or take. They have very few good magic items, having gotten bad draws in the chests. It's so tough cuz the silver beasts take 2-3 hits to kill, and bumping them to gold will make them insanely strong, plus adding in silver Eldritch, I think, will be over the top. (OL could conceivably get Humanoids upgraded too, if the Heroes spend more than 2 turns moving).

There were some things learned, like move faster, and dont be afraid to leave a dungeon, especially if you can prevent the OL upgrading monsters.

What do you think? Is it salvageable by the Heroes, or worth the beatings they'd take if they played on?

I had my heroes in similar standings, we just entered the gold and they are really starting to finally beat or match me per dungeon. The silver level legendary is huge for the heroes as well. The big thing for them is they should be spending money on skills and pips as much as possible. That was what was making the beginning so hard for my heroes. They kept wasting it on treasure that was going to be replaced in a few dungeons anyway.

I think the heroes here are in tough shape.

I would encouarge those involved to keep at it though. On some level I can;t entirely explain, it bugs me when parties bail out cause things look bad. It can be a fun chalange to make the best of a bad situation and turn it arround. As bad as it looks, the right set of traits on the heroes can go miles to turn it arround. I was ahead of the heroes by about 50% conquestm (not near as bad as your game however) then on set of trait upgrades form the silver legendary area, and I we have a party that can complete a dungeon level in 3 turns!

Also even if mistakes were made. The heroes will learn more if they play it out, then if they bail out. Sure they will do better if they start again, but playing to the end will give them more hints and clues as to areas they can imrove for next time.

Interesting thoughts.

Yeah, I agree the mere act of going thru an endgame would endow everyone (heroes and OL alike) with some of the necessary experience to be able to play toward the endgame in the next campaign...

But it's getting so rough... at what point would you call it? If they enter a dungeon and cant get past the first level?

poobaloo said:

I'm sort of reluctant to say this, but honestly? Your heroes need to go back to hero school.

The party is not very strong. It could be the best they could make, but that would have been an awful draw. Lyssa is rubbish, almost anything else is better (possibly Red Scorpion is worse, possibly). Karnon is barely adequate, but not really 'affordable' for a party which already has a useless character and another vulnerable (though hard hitting) character in Carthos. He might hit hard, but he costs you too much in CT.

Most importantly though, they simply die too often. It isn't possible without really being there but the rate they lose heroes in dungeons, even in the first level of the first dungeon when the OL has no upgrade, simply suggests that their tactics are not very good. When you add the reluctance to flee when getting smashed and continuing on through extra levels, this supports the notion that they haven't got very good tactics. It seems too consistent and there are too many other clues to suggest that its just bad luck (even though bad luck can contribute).

There are some good general hero playing guides available on BGG, they should read those and then try a few things different.

Note that there isn't a 'best ' or 'only' way to play RtL, but there are tactics and strategies which work better than others. If tactics are not good you can still enjoy the game, but the sort of CT imbalance you are seeing now will likely continue. And, as you may have noted, eventually that will lead to the game becoming substantially less fun, at least for 4/5 players!

It also might help if you (who has mostly if not always been OL?) swapped out with some other players for a while. Get some of them thinking from the OLs side of the table for a change might make a difference. And you might have some pointers towards tactical changes, having been on the other side of the fence.

LOL, no offense taken. :-)

It is a group of gamers, so there's no lack of general strategy and tactics. I think it has to do with adapting to the unconventional strategies needed to do well in RTL. Like abandoning a dungeon didnt really occur to me, until I read some strats out here. Then the Heroes bought a boat to head to the Caverns (sounds reasonable to someone who hasnt played RTL before, right?) but what they should have done was put that money into whatever upgrades they could have got, which may have only been 1 black die each, but that would have made a difference.

I'm trying to encourage another to be the OL, just for the experience. Playing the enemy makes you better as the Hero, and vice versa. It's just not a popular role, since you have to be the bad guy and on your own the whole time. I enjoy that, so it generally works out in our group this way.

The thing about RtL is, when the Overlord's winning big time, you might as well play it out - because the Overlord should head his lieutenants to Tamalir and drive the nail in the coffin. If he doesn't, then no matter how much he's ahead, he'll still probably lose the Final Battle, even if it "seems like" the Heroes are getting trounced in the dungeons all through Silver level.

I also agree with Corbon, the Heroes are not very good players. Which isn't a crime, but just a fact. Hopefully, they will learn and improve, which to me is what the fun of games is all about. I love nothing more than realizing what my mistakes were and working on correcting them for next time. A quick glance of the summaries reveals the Overlord made lots of mistakes too, it's just harder to make a really crippling mistake as the Overlord compared to the Heroes.

The_Immortal said:

Corbon said:

For example? :-) (for my own growth)

The only mistake I know I made, was that I "moved then bought" whereas I think I should have bought LT's then moved them the turn they were purchased. That was just simple not paying attn to the order of the OL turn.

poobaloo said:

Probably call it 'refinements' rather than error correction.

1. OL is the Titan who excells at city razing. So Seige Engines is probably a better buy for his 'starting' 15CT. Not that the others (especially Focus) are bad per se, just not playing to the strengths of that particular Avatar. In particular though, early OL Avatar upgrades are a bit pointless (unless Fiery Armour affects other monsters as well as the Avatar?). I know some people worry about a certain Rumour, but frankly its 1 of 12, you will almost always have a chance to buy what you need before they can get to the rumour and if the heroes are doing rumour dungeons early on and going all the way through them then you will rake in the CT anyway.

2. 1 Spawn Treachery is probably a bit wasteful. Spawn Treachery is by far the weakest, especially in Lt encounters. Thudd would have been a better buy probably and even getting the two other Farrows a turn earlier each instead would see you with more pressure being exerted on the Mapboard already. Or changing it for Event Treachery (far better in Encounters, CB option, Poltergeist etc).
Mind you, with the Titan's Elite Forces ability some extra unnamed Masters from a Treachery Spawn could be rather scary... Silver Master Bloodape with extra Silver dice anyone?

However, playing too 'refined' can be a bit formulaic. Sometimes mixing things up a little makes it more interesting or provides different challenges.

Also note, both of my last two sessions have resulted in bad decisions on my part (both late in the evening). On one I didn't bother to have my awake hero wake up the others during an ambush (foolish, even with only a single attacker, though I did get away with it). On the other I elected to buy more Treachery (2x, thanks to a lost) instead of upgrading a second category of monsters to support my Gold Beasts in Silver level. Cue a run through of easy dungeon levels and bad card draws as the heroes storn through the Legendary Silver dungeon heading for a (still bronze) Giant at the end. No sign of the treachery cards I bought yet... Duh! And I managed to lose two Lts in one night a few sessions earlier - one to a rules error and the other to abject stupidity (possibly shellshock from the first - at least thats what I tell myself!). So I'm not saying I play terribly refined or error free myself, although I am confident of my ability to spot errors or possible refinements from a distance (including in my own games.

Corbon said:

I considered the Siege Engines, but my logic was this: All they do really, is give you one shot at razing your first city one turn sooner. If you hit it, great. You made it useful, for now. If you miss it, (2/3 likely) then you are back to now being in a position where your initial purchase has done nothing for you. If you did hit it, then that LT will move on to the next city one turn earlier, and again, have only a 1/3 chance of keeping that card useful, or more likely, a 2/3 chance of missing on the one early roll you'll get on the 2nd city, thereby putting you back on to the schedule you'd have been on all along if you had not bought the Siege Engines in the first place.

If you did hit it, and raize one city one turn sooner, that's 1 extra CT you'll get in the game (big whoop) whereas starting your rolling the following turn only costs you that 1 extra CT (and even then only 1/3 of the time will you even succeed).

So given it was 2/3 likely to be mostly [but not entirely] useless, I took stuff that was definitely going to give me an advantage in the melee play, like Focused. If Focused helps you to either get a deck flip, or the stronger cards lead to even 1 extra Hero kill, that's approx 3 CT - way more than the off chance of getting 1 or 2 extra CT if you roll a surge on your early raze rolls.

Fiery Armor - agreed, it was useless at this point. But, I had nothing else to spend the 10 starting CT on other than Lawlessness and Fiery Armor. (I could have gone with the "Increase your hand to 9 cards" for 10 XP, or the 3 XP "you choose one encounter" card. I considered these). Plus getting lots of small ones early would save me turns later, when there might not be enough game weeks to gather those little ones.

Corbon said:

I took the red treachery, because there is one red treachery card that is not a spawn card - it is "remove any one regular white monster, and replace it with an unwounded master monster of the same type". This plays perfectly with the Titan's special, which is that unnamed red monsters get +1 power die. This is also essentially a free "spawn" (sort of)... to take an almost dead monster, and replace it with not just a red one, but an unwounded red one in the middle of a room, that gets bonus dice due to the Titan power. These red monsters, with their extra dice due to being masters, and extra die due to the Titan, and then sometimes plus Doom, were able to do damage most monsters simply could not. Upgrading Razorwings for their Stun (and range), and Beastmen for their Command both proved useful.

Also, the players had crap for weapons, so I didnt want to go for the Crushing Blow card. I kinda like Carthos carrying the staff since I can kill him and it makes him worth 50% more CT. The "Ignores undying" ability has hardly come into play, as I've compensated by focusing on Beasts instead of Eldritch for my target red upgrades.

Corbon said:

Most certainly. I dont like when any game is reduced to optimal strategies. Like players always choose Nanok, Tahlia, Landrec, Silhouette, etc. The game becomes repetitive if you dont force yourself to play with some alternate choices. Everyone says the Heroes should win this game, but should they win, if they start with average characters?

Degenerate strategies (like always taking Nanok if he comes up) are indeed unfortunate - but they are the fault of the game, not the players. That's why such TRUE imbalances (where they exist) need to be vigorously pointed out and complained about. ; >

I will also echo Corbon again in saying I certainly make mistakes as well, and that's a big part of the fun - I've already made several in my own "semi-self-play" game as the Titan. But since you asked.

One more thing: I don't see anywhere where you mentioned what the plot was, which is slightly relevant, but not terribly, since in most cases you can do fine by just ignoring it.

Mistake #1: Opening Buy

I agree (again) with Corbon that the opening buy was weak. I think you are not fully appreciating the value of Siege Engines. First of all, against GOOD players, razing that first city one turn earlier can very much mean the difference between razing it and not razing it at all - particularly as the Titan. The Titan actually has a VERY weak opening game - his Elite Forces really doesn't measure up (with Copper monsters) against the Sorcerer King's, the Beastman Lord's or the Spider Queen's ability for the opening dungeons, and he doesn't have awesome opening buys for his 15 XP that will really help in the dungeons. This means that it's VERY possible for the Heroes to get 20 XP and from 3000 to 4000 gold - enough for each to train a skill, or maybe one person's left out - BEFORE they give you the 25 (or 30) XP for a Monster upgrade. Heroes with a couple skills and a couple treasures will CRUSH any lieutenant without a Monster upgrade. This requires them blitzing from 2 to 4 dungeons depending on their luck with the dungeon draws - they MUST be conservative, and run away in the face of a bad situation, and in almost all cases this means never doing the 3rd floor of a dungeon, and often not even the second. Then 1 turn training in Tamalir, and the next turn, they can attack to liberate Greyhaven (which is presumably the first city to siege, as it is the closest). So that's a liberation attack somewhere on Turns 4 to 6, depending on their luck. Without Siege Engines and without a Turn 2 Merrick, Greyhaven burns Turn 7 at the earliest - which means that the Heroes WILL stop you guaranteed, even if they get unlucky with the dungeon draws. Siege Engines gives you a chance to get lucky by shaving off a turn - ready to burn on turn 6. Siege Engines PLUS turn 2 Merrick (which so long as you get 3 CT in the Heroes' first dungeon, you can afford) means you can burn turn 5 - which means the Heroes have to start getting much luckier with their early dungeon floors and treasure draws. Basically, as the Overlord, you have to give the Heroes as many chances as possible to 'get unlucky,' and capitalize on it when it happens.

And that's only the analysis of the first few turns. For the rest of the game, simply having Siege Engines allows you to exert MUCH more pressure on how quickly you can threaten cities, and more importantly, threaten Tamalir. The REAL purpose of your lieutenants is to hang around Tamalir such that the Heroes cannot go and get Secret Master Training (without risking a roll to let Tamalir burn of course, which good Heroes will never do). Siege Engines helps you apply that pressure more quickly and more intensely than any other starting upgrade.

For me, the Titan's main alternative to Siege Engines is Greater Ogres. The plan here is to get Silver Humanoids + Thaadd ASAP and thus make him into the biggest brute squad that you can. The other benefit is that there's a small chance it helps you in the dungeons; not much, as Ogres are rare, but it helps an awful lot if you are lucky enough to draw one of the few levels with an Ogre boss (and basically turns that level into "Heroes must run away"). Since you opted to go with Silver Beasts instead, this would have been the wrong choice.

Mistake #2: Red Treachery vs. Merrick

As well as simply remembering that you're allowed to buy Merrick and then move him out, you should have swapped the order in which you bought Merrick and your Red treachery. The Heroes weren't entering a dungeon that turn anyway, and buying Merrick that turn lets you roll for the Greyhaven siege one turn earlier.

Mistake #3: Playing DOOM!

You played DOOM!. Well okay, I don't know the exact circumstances - there might be some incredibly clever circumstances in which DOOM! is the correct play. But overwhelmingly, DOOM! seems to have this strange appeal (that I can't fully understand) to novice Overlords, when in fact 99% of the time it is the worst waste of 25 threat in the game. Probably your Heroes were moving so slowly and letting you get so much threat that you felt you had enough, but again, good Heroes would never let you do this.

Mistake #4: Lyssa "slipping" to the glyph on Pull of the Depths

Okay, this one is not necessarily a mistake, since of course I don't know the exact board situation - it simply raised possible red flags in my brain. It seemed to me that with Varikas and Karnon dead, and lots of Silver Razorwings plus and UNDYING sorcerer boss flitting around, I would imagine it would be possible to put SOMETHING on the glyph that Lyssa is simply unable to kill (I note she doesn't have Acrobat or anything else that would let her get around this problem). Basically, you MUST always have something sitting on unactivated glyphs if at all possible, and with their high speed and toughness at Silver level, Razorwings fit the bill perfectly. Perhaps too many of them died earlier and this wasn't possible, it just seemed a little incongruous to me that you could have firepower to take down big guys like Varikas and Karnon and yet not be able to sufficiently block Lyssa from the glyph, which suggested a tactical error.

Those are the ones I noticed. Again, in all cases, they didn't really hurt you because for every mistake you made, the Heroes probably made 5 or more, but even so, there's always still something to learn.

The_Immortal said:

@Carbon: you said: On one I didn't bother to have my awake hero wake up the others during an ambush (foolish, even with only a single attacker, though I did get away with it).

I thought this wasnt possible other than attacking your own heros?

Bravo McWilley said:

Thats correct.
Standard practice to choose an unarmed attack to hit your own guys with and wake them up. And with this ambush being in the -2damage for Melee attacks as well, I could have guaranteed a maximum 2 damage on my guys (4 from Red dice, spend enhancements on useless Range, -2 for terrain special).

It is definitely legal. It's doesn't feel right however, which probably contributed to my decision making subconciously - I play hard and would definitely have used it if needed (ie probably dead next turn and unable to kill bag guy this turn), but if I could get away without it I'll usually try.

The_Immortal said:

It's the Ascension

The_Immortal said:

That's some very refined play. Perhaps I am underestimating the value of going for that siege one turn sooner.

The_Immortal said:

I thought they were going to, and they could have done so. That's why I swiped the treachery first. They ended up just going to Greyhaven but I couldnt know that.

The_Immortal said:

Another thing that I'll probly accept in time, perhaps once the Heroes start learning to bail on dungeons quicker, the value of Doom will become significantly less.

The_Immortal said:

Of course it was possible. I just moved some guys to block a passage and didnt pay attn to the glyph for a turn. I think I even moved a silver hellhound OFF the glyph, to block another passage instead, forgetting that they'd just pop up behind the lines if I did that. Costly -- But again the ability to make such big mistakes and still come out of it so well is indicitive that this is a learning game for all.