Sorry for the weird question/analysis but bear with me.

I found great value in Signs of Faith, Winds of Magic and Omens of war for these reasons alone:

SoF: Disease rules

WoM: Corruption Rules

Omens: Severe Injuries

It seems all of teh 'core' rules features of the above sets could easily be incorporated in 'almost' every game session or potentially every game session. Meaning, that 9 times out of 10 in a give session 1 or all of teh core rules listed above would most likely see some game time. So due to my cash strapped mentality--i found value in getting these expansion sets because those core rules were worth teh price of admission alone since they were used often in any game session.

However, when i look at Lure of Power the core rule set that is included is Shame. For those that have bought it, are the Shame rules worth the price of admission? Are they used as often as Disease, Corruption or Injuries? Are they as good? What is teh compelling factor to Purchase LoP from of 'core' rules set addition. Yes, each pack has additional comps (monsters, Careers, talents etc) but if I only would only buy for the core rule piece is LoP worth it?

Thanks any help would be appreciated. I am debating the purchase of LoP (to conclude the god packs) or Black Fire Pass (black fire pass seems situational as well BTW hence i haven't purchased yet).

Help? Thanks!

The short answer is: No.

But really, it's all about what kind of game you're running. Lure Of Power is about playing nobles. You can use the rules for having the characters intereact with nobles, but the rules only really come into play if you're playing a game with at least one gold tier character.
The same could be said, at least to some degree, about the other sets. Particulatly Omens Of War. You're playing a game with a lot of social interaction and next to no fighting? Omens of War is next to useless. It all boils down to the type of game you play.

On the other hand, I like having the set of Chaos God rules completed. That's honestly my main motivation for buying the boxes.

Ralzar said:

Agree

If your group of players is very combat oriented, then forget about LoP. Otherwise, it is a great supplement with nice support action cards for social interactions and a set of rules for playing a noble character.

Ok, thanks guys for the response!

So my summarization is correct but perhaps it would be worthwhile to do noble interactions every once in awhile, thanks!

I couldn't disagree more.

If you look only at Nobles and Shame, then you are missing half the picture. When you factor Actions into the mix, LoP is the most universally useful of the 4 sets. It has everything from social to combat actions. Every character can benefit from LoP's action set.

With the other three you end up with actions that only a small set of your players will use. Winds of Magic and Signs of Faith especially are bad in this regard, as only one player (maybe) can benefit from the expansion.

Doc, the Weasel said:

Agreed!!!

Doc is very right on this one. The shame rules can be used almost unadapted across all aspects of society. They can be used amongst gangs, burghers everywhere, where an argument or dispute doesn't always lead to drawn weapons.

I use shame every once in a while and my group is all brass tier. It works nicely when the PC's are trying to convince people, plead cases, shame others, etc. I use it more as an extended influence challenge, when a simple charm (or any social) roll just doesn't cut it. For example ast session it was used to convince a group of pesky Zelots to stop cooking pigeons. It's also been used to convince road wardens that the PC's are innocent and that the dead men by the roead were bandits (instead of the other way around). It gives the social characters more of a "important" feeling, as it's almost the equivalent of social combat.

And as Doc pointed out, the actions for the players are great. The careers are also a neat addition if the players want to have more social options.

I love the disease rules in SoF, they see regular use. My players hate diseases with a passion (at the moment 2/3 players in my group are suffering from a disease) and that feels very "warhammer" to me. The corruption rules in WoM are also good, but somehow I don't feel they are as useful or have as much impact on the game as the diseases do.

I don't have any wizards or priests in my group at the moment most of the other content in those two boxes are "useless" at the moment, while actions, talents and careers from LoP see use every session.

From a core rules perspective though, when only focusing on the shame mechanic vs the other boxes core mechanics I'd say that you could do something similar to shame with simple progress trackers in social situations. Having the PC's and their opponents advance the tracker as they make their arguments and the first to hit the goal "wins". I did this before the Lure of Power was released and it worked fine, but now I use the shame rules and think it's better than the tracker.

The box in itself is really great, never regreted the purchase of LoP, and the shame mechanic is a neat addition to the rules and it can be used every session. But I must say that from a pure core rules perspective (defined as diseases, corruption, severe injuries and shame) it has the least impact on the actual game.

By the time Lure of Power came out there were less gaps in the core rules to be filled. Therefore it doesn't have the big headline rules addition like corruption or disease. The shame mechanic and rules for nobles are useful but nothing too far removed from what I had been doing prior to its release (I have an almost completely social party with no priests or wizards).

However I think it is actually one of the best releases so far. Slaanesh is probably the easiest of the Chaos gods to include in a campaign, the actions cards are very usable and the fluff is good as a well. All in all I would say it was the most useful expansion to date.

(Heroes Call is similarly good and I feel that now the burden of completing the rules set is over the writers can focus on good general products. It bodes well for the future)

My own view of Lure of Power is:

- love Slaanesh and the actions and critters (not all the artwork)

- the "new mechanic" not as shiny as corruption or disease, both of which were shiner than pemanent wounds (which are nice but not as fun as first 2), "shame" comes in 4th. I see the social contest rules here as not taking concepts a whole lot further than core set would and the rules are similar to Burning Wheel or other games that have "social duels" but not as shiny.

- the added action cards, careers etc. good, the rule for nobles depend on whether you have PC's that want to go that route (essential then) or not (in which case it's sort of like Black Fire Pass if you have no dwarf PC's on that front).

Thanks everyone for your opinions! I really appreciate the feedback.

Something that I think any noble character should have is background on their lineage. Sigmar's Heirs has all of the nobles of the empire (of any note) listed in it's pages and also that grid:

The more that I look at Lure of Power, the more I think that it's probably a STRONGER product than the priest or wizard product. I think the primary reason is that it brings useful actions to EVERY CAREER.

http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_news.asp?eidn=2524

http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_news.asp?eidn=2882

http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_news.asp?eidn=2563

http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_news.asp?eidn=2819

jh

p.s..that is with the exception of one of the most important pieces of artwork for the product, which absolutely fell short …

I'll have to disagree strongly with you on Daemonette art. I know he's not to everyone's taste, but in my opinion there is never an instance where John Blanche's work is anappropriate for Warhammer. Blanche is Warhammer.

On Lure of Power, the scenario is really good as well, especially if you've run any of the other adventures around Ubersreik. Our MoD ran for 8 sessions and I had the players guessing up until the very end.

I can't say I've used the stuff in Lure of Power enough to comment usefully on that, but… I think the Black Fire Pass box is very weak, and I would definitely get LoP before it. Again, it does depend a bit… It's probably okay if you want to play the more 'wacky' dwarf stuff and have magic runes, magic machines, etc. But there's very little useful background of help to playing dwarfs with more normal careers and I personally think the scenario is the worst of those published for WFRP 3. It's not very clever, pretty rail-roady, has holes that I think clever players would fall through, etc. It's a shame, because it had the potential to be a great setting and there are some fun ideas in the plot. It just isn't developed or thought-through enough.

I've got one gripe about LoP (and it's the same gripe I had about the 2e Kislev supplement): If I wanted to read dry, encyclopedic entries that just fill space with empty words, and that are devoid of useful warhammer-specific content, I'd read Wikipedia. The presentation of nobility and class, without putting any role-play-specific content made me want to cut my eyeballs out last night while re-reading it. After that first section of regurgitation from the "like, duh book of defining the same earth-analogues" is some presentation we can actually use. They list some nobles. Now, it's not to the extent that Sigmar's Heirs' quanity, but it may actually prove useful as a warhammerism.

To really be useful, there would be more charts like the one for Ubersreik, and maybe a list of patrons and people to know from each region. Something, anything, that traverses beyond the inane into looking like it was actually designed for a roleplaying game, and not just something that passes for "getting paid by the word." I'm not criticizing the writer here, I'm criticizing the design teams commitment to the game. Ok, so let me say that same thing happened in Omens of War. It's not enough to just put a spin on the WFB content. It should be written for a roleplaying game, for players and GMs to draw actual, unique, warhammer-specific content. The content is there in both OoW and LoP, however it is thin and this game team's phobia for simple percentile charts or brainstorming idea charts in general is evident in between lopsided amounts of senseless fluff from useful fluff. I'd like to have all fluff content filled with more non-ordinary content so that:

a) GMs can create encounters and embellish scenarios, and

b) Players can get warhammer content to embellish their character's current status and background

Other than that, the social action cards are nice to have (even if bribe, flirt, etc. seem redundant to what should simply be skill specializations).

I still rate it as the best PLAYER product out there (between WoM, SoF, OoW, BFP, and LoP).

jh

Emirikol said:

You know this image (and quite a few from LOP such as the steeds) are just taken from other Warhammer products, right? I don't know its original usage, but it is part of a daemons spread in the Warhammer Fantasy Battle hardcover.

I haven't read LOP but i've got all the others.

For me Black Fire Pass added in the most fun new stuff with all the runes and inventions. Omens of War had mounted combat and some careers and stances but i didnt really think it was that useful. I prefer BFP. As mentioned SOF and WOC have the disease and corruption rules in, even if you aren't bothered about casters.

Shame this stuff is split across so many books really

I'm amazed no-one mentioned secret societies from LoP yet.They're great ways of dragging unsuspecting PCs into something sinister, and provide a handy back-up if you need to think of some bad things to happen to your players. Also, IMO Slaanesh is the easiest chaos god to work into a campaign as every town and city could potentially harbour at least one Slaaneshi cult, whereas the others might be harder to justify in some areas.