...because it was only three players. I was the Sardak, I stayed in the game up until the last round, I wanted the Imperial card for the win, but the Xxcha had the Public Disgrace card which prevented me from taking it. They wound up the winner of the game, I got tag teamed by the Xxcha and Hacan.

We got 6 or 7 rounds of game play in.

Twilight Imperium with 3 players is like a strip club without alcohol, technically its still a strip club, but it just ain't right!

BigKahuna said:

+1

Word!

Ruleswise it is possible but there is so much less player interaction. 5-7 is the best amount imho since there is player interaction a plenty and with 5-7 players there is always the tension about which SC(s) will be unpicked. With 4 or 8 players there is still interaction but all the SC's will be picked every round. Slightly less interresting. At least to me.

I made some mistakes as the Sardak yesterday. I wasted resources building Dreadnoughts when I should have been building Cruisers. I also was not raiding the other players fleets to try and keep them in check. I need to think swarm mentality when playing them.

I know how you feel. Three player games are pretty much all I ever get to play anymore. We used to have more players, but they decided the game was a bit too long for their taste. I still enjoy myself when playing, but it's just not the same as with a larger group. It always boils down to the other two players teaming up against whoever's pulling out in the lead.

We played tonight actually. L1Z1X, Necro, and Creuss were the races chosen, myself playing Creuss. I managed to snag Imperial II when on the verge of completing several different objectives, including my Secret Objective, and scored myself a landslide victory. It was close too. One more turn and Nekro would have invaded my home planet, leaving me unable to complete objectives.

5 or 6 player game is the best you can hope for twilight 3.

Although, I do like 8 player games.

In an 8 player game, no alliance of players can take over the game and there is usually 3 small unrelated wars going on all the time.

In the final rounds, several players send their biggest fleets to take Mecatol Rex only to be wiped out by the next player.

Those battles are Epic. Bring the popcorn out, moments.

But in 8 player games, usually 2 players slow the game down to a crawl, leading to other players slow down, eventually killing the game.

I am more impressed with a player who says he wins 8 player games then a 5 player games.

The fundamental problem with a twilight game is if 3 friends are in a 5 or 6 player game, those players usually make sure that 1 of them will be the winner.

Having a 3 player alliance formed before even the galaxy is made........is game breaking in a 5 or 6 player game.

In a large 8 player game, a 3 player alliance is not game breaking.

But 8 player games are not done now. Good 8 player games are just legends of the past in Twilight.3 , just myths.

I should probably be able to manage an eight player game with my Saturday D&D group.

adamwehn said:

I am jealous, lol

Mighty Maltim said:

My D&D group wants to play Twilight Imperium every third Saturday.

Is my general idea of how to play the Sardakk a good plan? Focus on Cruisers, Destroyers, and Carriers, and using a swarm mentality with them?

Seems like a valid tactic as long as you keep focus on hindering other players from obtaining VPs and obtaining them yourself at the same time.

Fnoffen said:

Okay

Norr requires patience, waiting 1 turn, to have a large fleet battle is better then attacking quickly with a small fleet battle.

Example:

3 Norr fighters vs 3 opponents fighters is an even battle. Lucky dice rolling prevails

9 Norr fighters vs 9 opponent fighters is an uneven battle. Norr should win every time with his +1 advantage.

Norr requires patience, waiting 1 turn, to have a bigger force, before attacking, to prevent even battles seems to be the best strategy.

Do not forget, Norr starts with Deep Space cannons.

Capture a disputed planet and put 2 pds there. Your opponent cannot do the 1 crusier, 1 ground troop move with 2 pds shooting at him.

It will slow his expansion alot.

Also, put a small double planet system next to Mecatol Rex and eventually put 4 pds there.

When you capure Mecatol Rex, land 2 pds there and lots of ground troops.

The pds prevents bombing by Dreads and 6 pds next to Mecatol Rex means no one can easily score a Secret Mecatol Rex objective but you.

Delaying your opponent 2 or 3 turns is big in twilight.

Shadow said:

The thing with Cruisers and Destroyers as raiding groups is the +1 from Hylar V, and the +1 racial. The units are cheap to replace and have high probability of achieving hits.

The problem with the N'orr isn't their military strategy its that military strategy is generally pretty worthless at helping you win the game. I think I can describe most gaming groups when I say the Tactic to playing the Sardek N'orr is house ruling their racial ability

BigKahuna said:

What house rule or rules do you implement?

I made a homebrew expansion that actually became kind of our gaming bible after a while, but of all the things we changed the Sardek N'orr racial ability is the one we always loved the most.

In any case its a racial ability addition.

"When you control a player home system (The System and All Planets) during the status phase you earn 1 victory point. If you also control Mecatol Rex you earn 2 victory points during the status phase instead".

Generally speaking this has made the Sardek N'orr extremly playable, in fact its kind of almost become a top tier race now. While at the same time you don't really make any adjustments to your style of play with the race, they are an aggressive, war race, but you are now rewarded for being such with it potentially leading to a win. The general strategy is to claim someones homeworld and hold on to it for as long as possible to earn those extra points. Each status phase you get one and if you can manage Mecatol Rex at the same time you can concievably pull a conquest victory. Still war is tough and unpopular, thus far no one has managed a win with them despite the change, but certainly everyone in my group agrees that its possible. It is not easy to win with any race afterall.

BigKahuna said:

Okay, sounds interesting, in my three player game I nearly won with the Sardakk N'orr. It was the last strategy phase, and I had 8 points, I went for the Imperial card but the Xxcha player played his Public Disgrace card and made me give it back.

BigKahuna said:

If someone controls both Mecatol Rex and a player home system, they only earn 2 points? Or do they earn 3 points?

BigKahuna said:

Hmm, that's an interesting addition. I'll have to propose that to my group next time we play.

adamwehn said:

You earn 1 point for controling A Home System

You earn 2 points if you control a home system and Mecatol at the same time

You earn no points just for controling Mecatol

As to a 3 player game with the Imperial Strategy card. I honestly can't speak to that, I have no experiance with 3 player games at all and we abandoned the Imperial Strategy card years ago. So Im not sure how that would play out in that enviroment.

What would be the result if the other players f*** up completly and allow the N'orr to take 2 HS plus MR and keep hold of them until the status phase? 2VP? Or 3VP?

BigKahuna said:

The other players in the game would have to make sure the N'orr player cannot make a dash at the end of the Action Phase to nab a home system and/or Mecatol Rex right before the Status Phase.

Also, a question ... It appears the N'orr can fulfil this race-specific objective multiple times in one game. This is a little different than the way the public or secret objectives work ... Is this difference intentional?

Just reading about the proposed new N'orr ability conjures up images of a potentially bloody game where someone's home system is the battle ground for a back and forth fight or a game where folks guard their home systems even more jealously than normal. I know my youngest son who likes the N'orr especially when he has War Suns on the board along with picking the Warfare II strategy card would be on the absolute warpath to take over home systems with this new ability - he'd love it!

By the way, I really appreciate the very streamlined and dead simple homebrew/houserule suggestions folks make for this game that are at the same time thematic and generally fair. It speaks well about how much the fans of this game really understand it.

Fnoffen said:

It sounds easy on paper but I have played this game for a very long time and I have never seen a game in which a player manages to claim two seperate homesystems and hold on to them to the status phase without pulling off some pretty impressive and extrodindary gameplay. If you can manage that, you very well may deserve to win. This however is not a regular occurance even with the Sardek N'orrs combat advantage.

You have to consider three things here as well.

1. You cannot gain any victory points if you don't control your homesystem. Hence you really need to hold on to three systems to pull this off.

2. The logistics of having fleets seperated like this make it very difficult to support these locations, so generally you claim the system, hold on to it until the status and likely lose it on the following turn. At least that is my experiance with the rule so far. When you claim someones homesystem and start earning victory points, there isn't a player at the table that isn't going to be trying to stop you.

3. You generally can't pull this off until the late game. The Sardek N'orr are stuck with relatively bad starting conditions and ultimatly everyone at the table knows that at some point you are going to make the attempt. Their job of earning victory points the traditional way is not made any easier either, so you are still going to find yourself generally falling behind.

Its a powerul ability but it takes a lot of skill and strategy to pull it off. Even with this ability we haven't seen a Sardek N'orr victory at our table, but several times it has been very close.