Posting this here may tick some folks off but Hell - not like there's much movement right now with good ol' X-Wing .

Anyone heard of the new WotC game Angels 20 ? Not frequenting the site much since they lost/gave up the Star Wars license, I didn't even have visibility on this; came across it totally by accident, visiting a local bookstore. It's a branch of Axis & Allies, but pure air combat. The models have a general wingspan of friggin four inches! It's interesting to look at to see their solution for a dedicated miniatures fighter-combat game. One thing, in Angels 20 the aircraft can actually be pivoted on their flight base pillar to visually indicate orientation like bank, dive or whatever. It was also mentioned the game is specifically fighter combat; B-17s need not apply.

I thought the Starter was excessively expensive at a MSRP of $39.95 until I found out the SIX planes in it were so dang big. Two map sections too. 31 total birds in the lineup (blind boosters, though). Comparing that to what we're so far seeing for the X-Wing starter... well. You be the judge.

I just checked it out. The details look interesting. I mean, I'm not too interested in the theme, but the larger size planes on pivots sounds really interesting. If you could combine that with the grid-less FFG version, that'd be really neat.

Wow.

I'm glad you posted about this here, because if FFG haven't heard about it, they need to. Six planes, of the size you're talking about, for $40? That's serious. I don't even need planes/ships that size, but I definitely want more ships for my money.

Some will say, "but it's blind-buy! Blind-buy = evil!". Everyone has their opinion about random packaging, but one thing that can't be argued is that the blind-buy model keeps the costs down. And I like that! If I absolutely must have Vader's TIE fighter, and I don't draw one, well, that's what trading and online shops are for.

You know, if I didn't know it was too late, I'd be wishing that FFG would HALT production of X-wing (like they've done with their LCG), and go for something more like this. Again, I don't even need ships with a 4" wingspan, but I just want more ships. $40 for three just feels more and more like getting fleeced.

Plus, WWII fighters are different from SW minis. As far as I know, there's no "Adolf Galland," but rather classifications of piot skill (Poor, Average, Experienced & Ace or something similar); so, you could get a Spifire Average or a Spitfire Ace. HOWEVER, they really tried to get a good representation of planes for this (possibly unique) set, so there's not like four classifications of Hurricane, for example. There's only 31 planes.

As to blind buys? I can definitely see less problem than usual - UNLESS a player simply has interest in a limited area. The Starter, f'rinstance, is specifically themed to "Battle of Britain," so there's no Zeroes or Yaks. 2x ME-109E, 2x Hawker Hurricane, 1x Supermarine Spitfire and 1x ME-110 (very unusual, as apparently only the Starter is a big enough box for such a plane). If you just want to replicate the Pacific war, then yes, blind boosters will in fact severely tick you off. Otherwise though, what's wrong with having 4 - 6 ME-109s? Y'know?

Depending on exactly how FFG plays the rules, blind boosters could (have) worked fine here, too. But, if you're gonna have "Grievous' starfighter," or "Anakin's ETA-2," or "Millenium Falcon," then NON-blind is definitely the way to go.

So if I understand you two properly (based on this thread and others), if you have a whole bunch of rare/unique pieces, a player much prefers a fixed distribution method. If there are mostly nameless copies -- and you want to build up an army/squadron -- you would prefer blind buys because the cost is lower and you can get the few rares you want through trades and secondary market.

That makes a lot of sense. I hadn't really thought about it that way before, I was too concerned with the fact that I'm gonna need to pay out $60+ to get my Boba Fett, Bounty Hunter piece. That's always been a turn-off to me. But it sure beats $15 a stormtrooper, if you know what I mean.

P.S. Sorry to derail the thread from Angels 20 to a discussion about distribution methods.

Oh, it wasn't "derailing." I created this thread just as an interesting exercise in comparisons; how two very similar types of game are being handled by two different publishers. Rules, miniatures, distribution, costs, marketing, etc.

The part about this that turns me off is the WotC bit. They've got the anti-Midus touch, imnsho. Yeah, you get twice as many craft, and they are bigger, but that just gives WotC more surface area to mess up…

I bought Angels 20. It's okay.

On the positive side, the minis are big. The rules are not too complicated.

On the negative side, the quality of the minis is not that high. Also, since they are so big, it's difficult to find a playing area that is big enough. I definitely prefer the rules and minis of WWII Wing of War. I'm not a huge fan of blind buy, as I would rather have minis that I choose rather than a handful of minis that I didn't. The plane cards aren't formatted that well. For example, they say things like:

Hurricane Mk I
Average

or

P-51C Escort
Average

I'm an aviation history enthusiast, and it drives me a little crazy to see incomplete information like this. I'd rather see:

Hawker Hurricane Mk I
Average

or

North American P-51C Mustang
Average

The "escort" tag seems totally unnecessary.

So I'm not such a huge fan. I played the game a few times and sold all my stuff.