Just got First Founding, enjoyed it muchly.

Now that we have the Successor and Create your own Chapter Rules and all of the First Founding chapters made. What else is left, for character gen purposes at least?

One of the things I like about DW is that unlike DH, which seems to be nigh inifite in it's scope, DW has a deffinate (quite large) limit of material on Space Marines. Sure there's going to be special rules and relics etc that are always going to be different. But of the established cannon material what is there still left to do?

And sure, the cannon material might be out of date, or dubious now, or just a different name for the same formation in other Chapters (not that that stops some codexes and rules, meow) which might not be very different at all (so a distinction rather than a rank).

From memory, Possible alt ranks or distinctions:

Salamanders: 'Firedrake' veterans

White Scars: Souldrinkers melee specialists; Cobra Squad jump pack troops; Stormseers,

Iron hands: Iron Farthers techmarine-chaplins (yum); Great Clan Councilers

There's also numerous direct successors not yet stated, all of the First Founding including chapters for instance.

Any other ideas?

If Stormseers need their own alternate rank, then Rune Priests definitely do as well.

Salamanders/White Scars/Raven Guard/Iron Hands need a lot of options options added--psychic powers, Solo/Squad Modes, wargear and relics--especially since the book gave more substantive material to the Core First Founding Chapters than to these new ones.

Maybe detailed development of some of the big and famous Successor Chapters - more than what was presented in RoB.

Kshatriya said:

Absolutely, although I don't really know what Stormseers are like or Rune Priests.

I could have the wrong end of the of the stick and they are all but Librarians except in name and relying on the normal differences between the two chapters for everybody else.

I guess one factor is that if a SW or WS Librarian can be anything but a Rune Preist or Stormseer, of course technically they should all still be Deathwatch Rune Priest or Stormseer. But considering that two different bits of fur attached to your armour can have different stat bonus's I can't see that modest difference between them would be OP.

Kshatriya said:

Yes the 4 chapters in first founding do now seem to be behind the originals by at least the ammount in that chapter, unless they are worse than the original.

The only really bad original was Imperial Fists, and they barely got anything in FF either.

I'm not sure that Rune Priests and Stormseers are mechanically (in the Tabletop) different from normal Librarians. They may just have a different tradition and belief system: Rune Priests believe their power comes from the living energy of Fenris itself, for example, but they still channel the Warp in the end.

The Space Wolves do have a habit of re-naming everything in their army, that doesn't immediately mean it should be better, and if it isn't better what's the point of having rules for it.

But, why is there not an alternative rank for Sanguinary Guard when there is one for Ultra's Honor Guard? Is that missing?

No...read the honour guard writeup - it states you may use it (with chapter specific modification) for any chapter you like. The ultra honour guard is the template for all honour guard throughout the chapters.

Re-do the successor chapters, re-do the successor chapters, re-do the successor chapters. RoB was just a kludgy fix. Do it from the ground up, like the Black Templars. There is enough successor chapters with enough personality of their own. It's alright if you do it like: "They get psy power x from the Ultramarine list and psy power y from the Imperial Fists list for 600 xp." Just make them much more different and not First Foundings with a special rule tacked on top of it.

I believe this is the intention anyway, based on the remarks in RoB.

Alex

Zappiel said:

Ah, thanks for that, I haven't rad the whole book yet and that makes a lot of sense.

For the successors, looking at the chapters creation rules in RoB, I'm surprised that most of them don't have unique demeanors at least if they are relatively close to their progenitors, there shouldn't be that many that are exactly the same.

Still feeling the lack of even basic successor rules for the Chapters in FF. I know it wasn't really within the remit of the FF and RoB did need to come out first. A pdf would be nice, with some of the other stuff from RoB that they had done for the first 6 chapters.