A pretty universal response I get to my Dark Heresy questions on this forum is that the Dark Heresy rules are old, in that FFG has rapidly innovated with mechanics of ever more elegance (e.g., most of Black Crusade, Rogue Trader Psionics) while still using the core mechanics.

1. Has anyone succesfully converted Dark Heresy to using the Black Crusade rules?

2. Has anyone succesfully converted Dark Heresy to a generic system, like Savage Worlds or Strands of Fate?

In either case, I'd really appreciate seeing the conversion rules in details.

I think it would be easier to simply convert the DH system to MERP (Middle Earth Role-Play) rules..It is OLD school but it was one of THE first systems to use percentile for everything. Its simple and streamlined all around and wouldnt require much to tweak the DH system to it. Id have to dig up the old MERP manual etc and look into it more but i know the character sheets would require a major overhaul if the MERP system was used.

I have a basic idea of how to transfer DH to BC rules, but I've neither sat down to write it down nor tested it in play.

Conversion to Strands of Fate here .

Our group are a litte unsatisfied by the way our games have become more sluggish as we've approached Ascension-level, and after having chewed a bit on that very book, have decided to drop it. We are currently considering options, and Strands of Fate looks like the best one, IMHO.

Darth Smeg said:

I think we're about to hit the sluggish stage too, and the group wants me to run a higher powered game. Now I love the ffg books, but I just don't have the wherewithal to memoise all the gear, and special rules as a gm, it's too much like work for me.

So I went looking and I found a discussion on RPG.net about a Fate 3.0 hack based on the feel of the Eisenhorn and Ravenor books. I will be giving the ideas a playtest with some friends once we've got it where we want, and I think I'll find the dramatic fllow more to my liking. I will still use my ffg books for the really good fluff, setting, adventures, character ideas....

http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?437088-FATE-SotC-Inquisition-Throne-Agents

The fate system is very simple once you get your head around some slightly more challenfging concepts than the ffg system. But there are WAY less rules, with the one system ('fate fractal') being used to model everything from characters, to starships, to enviromental hazards.

I saw that link too, and liked what I saw.

Strands of Fate came out after that thread (which is from 2009), and is only about a year old. I haven't tried either solution yet, but Strands has some things going for it, as it already has a ready-to-go system for Psychic powers.

Either way, I'm interested to hear about your experiences

Edit: **** double posting.

Double posting is HERESY! Zap-zap-zap!

I've written out a conversion, haven't had a chance to run it though so dunno how well it'll hold together. Sort of ends up roughly somewhere between DH & RT in terms scale, but I did manage to squeeze in some of the more interesting RT classes that would end up in an Inquisitors retinue and Scout Marines along with keeping the more flavoursome aspects of DH's advance careers.

Darth Smeg said:

Hi Darth Smeg.

I haven't had much exposure to Strands of Fate. I understand it's an evolution of Fate, but get the impression that it 'has added crunch' for those that like that sort of thing.

I've been bashing away at my doc and it now bear little resemblence to what I started with. I have relented and included the OGL system from one of the Fate 3.0 games (SOTC) but haven't included all the sunts, backgroundand all that. At the moment it is about thirty five pages and should be a complete game once I've removed a bit of the SPTC verbosity and made a few more clarifications.

It is just about ready to playtest, but I may struggle getting players. Most players seem to just want to sit back and be entertained these days. Far too many FPS and MMOs seem to have spoiled the imaginations of a generation by serving it all up on a plate. I think the biggest stuhmling block will be that Fate requires intellectual input on the part of the players because of the way the Aspect system works. You can't just sit back and have yor attack if you want to get the most out of it.

Something I'm really not sure about though is including references to 40k. Everything else I've included is either my work, from the original discussion thread, or OGL content. Does anyone know what the deal is or including GW trademarked 'product identity' terms like 'Adeptus Astartes' etc? Can I just add a statement that those terms are property of GW and used by a fan for non-financial puposes?

@MKX That sounds exactly like what everyone here seems to be after.

Ok, I'll put it up on the basis people can make some use of it. Don't set me on fire if you hate it

http://www.sendspace.com/file/ybc3q3

If the link evaporates or the american's decide to make sendspace public pirate enemy, give me a holler and I'll re-up again. Likewise if theres something I missed or you've got a good idea on how it can be improved then also let me know as I'm always open to a lateral approach to things I might have missed in the coal-face, but I do try to be thorough.

i GM a mixed group of r.t/d.h and b.c characters using the b.c skills/talents and combat system, and it seems to work fine! its a bit of work converting official ffg adventures but not enough to put me off from dm'ing and the b.c system is just way better than d.h. and r.t!

oi oi

! : ?

I'm currently trying to work the kinks out but I'm trying a DH/BC conversion.
Mind you it is not finished by a longshot but you have to start somewhere.
The system is pretty much freeform with the classes/archetypes around 1.900 to 2.000xp flat.


Dark Heresy 2.0:

This is a revised edition of Dark Heresy using the Black Crusade, more free form rules. The disadvantage of this is that most advances have become a bit more expensive. The advantage is that you now have fewer limitation on what you can buy now.

The characters start out as human and thus gain the Human Starting Abilities.

All character may choose an Archetype, this is the starting point of their characters. These Archetypes grant the character a basic set of Skill & Talents appropriate to their background. From there the players characters may take and buy any skill or talent as long as they have the Experience Points and permission of their GM.
Abilities:
Each character has nine abilities. These abilities are: Weapon Skills (WS), Ballistic Skills (BS), Strength (S), Toughness (T), Agility (Ag), Intelligence (Int), Perception (Per), Willpower (WP) and Fellowship (Fel). These abilities all start at 25 and the players may at character creation divide 100 points among them. The minimum number of points they must put in one skill is 5 with 20 being the absolute maximum.
Besides these nine normal abilities there is also a tenth ability, Resources (Res). This ability starts out one 20. Resources cannot be raised with your starting nor, at least normally, by experience points. It is awarded by the GM.

Resources (Res):
This ability represents the characters monetary wealth and to a certain degree his influence. It can be raised by some talents or awarded by the GM.

Fate Points:
Fate can be used to do a number of thing, amongst other, prevent certain death. There are two ways to use Fate Points. You can spend them in the form of Fortune Points in which case they will be refreshed at the beginning of next session. The other way they can be used is by burning them permanently, burned Fate Points are gone and will not be refreshed.

Using Fortune Points:
• Re-roll a failed test once. The results of the re-roll are final
• Gain a +10 bonus to a Test. This must be chosen before the dice are rolled
• Gain an additional Degree of Success (DoS) on a test. This may be chosen after the dice are rolled
• Count as having rolled a 10 for Initiative
• Instantly remove 1d5 Damage (Cannot remove Critical Damage)
• Instantly recover from being Stunned
• Instantly remove the Bleeding condition

Burning a Fate Point:
When faced with certain death you can burn a Fate Point, at this point your life will be saved but everything immediately fades to black. You will gain consciousness at the GM’s discretion. Burning a Fate Point will NOT save you when performing an obviously suicidal act such as running towards a Promethium dump with a Melta Charge strapped to your chest. In such a case you will die a hero.

Human Starting Abilities:
All human characters begin play with the following Skill & Traits at no experience cost.
Starting Skills: Common Lore (Imperium), Linguistics (Low Gothic), Trade (Any One)
Starting Trait: The Quick and the Dead or Righteous Fear or Well Trained or Mutant
Starting Fate Points: 3

The Quick and the Dead:
To survive in the Imperium one must be both quick in wits and in action. Sometimes fast reflexes can compensate for ceramite armour. The character with this trait gains adds +2 to their Initiative and a +3 to either Weapons Skills (WS), Ballistic Skills (BS) or Agility (Ag).

Righteous Fear:
Fear is healthy, fear is a defensive mechanism. Though the horrors of the Ruinous Powers, the Heretic and Xenos are true, there is no stronger fear than that of the God Emperors Wrath should one fail him. You gain a +10% to any test to resist fear and reduce the Insanity Points gained from a failed Fear Test by one to a minimum of one.

Well Trained:
Some people are simply better than others at their trade.
Through rigorous training, hypnotherapy or some sort of biological or cybernetic enhancement you gain one additional Degree of Success (DoS) when making tests with one specific Characteristic which must be chosen at character creation. To gain advantage from this ability the test must be successful.

Mutant:
You are a mutant, perhaps you lived in the under hive or maybe you are the result of inbreeding. Nonetheless you will be hunted for the rest of your life because of your defect.
You must roll once on the Mutation Table (Table 14-3 of the RT Core Book) or may spend 300 Experience Points to choose any between 01 and 74 and choose his mutation. In additional a lifetime of abuse has hardened the mutant, he gains a +2 on his starting wounds. Should he ever be found out there could be some major consequences for the character.

Adept:
The Adept is the quintessential scholar whether he is part of the Adeptus Administratum or working for some private guild. His mind has been rigorously trained from early childhood to work with utmost precision, this did however leave a gap in their ability to defend themselves.
Starting Skills, Talents and Gear:

Characteristic Bonus: +3 to Intelligence and Perception

Starting Skills: Common Lore (Imperium) +10, Common lore (Administratum) or Commerce, Linguistics (High Gothic), Logic, Scholastic Lore (Bureaucracy) or Scholastic Lore (Judgement) or Scholastic Lore (Legend) or Scholastic Lore (Occult)

Starting Talents: Fore Sight, Light Sleeper or Resistance (Cold), Weapon Training (Las), Weapon Training (Primary) or Unremarkable or Total Recall

Starting Gear: Data Slate, Adept Robes, Las Pistol, Auto Quill or Writing Kit, Chrono

Starting Wounds: 10

Adepta Sororitas:
These humble women, sometimes also known as Battle Sisters are the brides and holy furies of the God Emperor. Though all are well trained in arms not all of them belong to a militant order. Such is their devotion that the God Emperor has blessed them with miraculous powers of faith.
Starting Skills, Talents and Gear:

Characteristic Bonus: +3 to Ballistic Skills and+3 Willpower

Starting Skills: Awareness, Common Lore (Ecclesiarchy), Dodge or Parry, Linguistics (High Gothic), Medicae or Scholastic Lore (Imperial Creed)

Starting Talents: Pure Faith, Weapon Training (Primary), Weapon Training (Las) or Weapon Training (SP)

Starting Gear: Mono Sword, Las Pistol or Hand Cannon, Chaplet Ecclesiasticus, Ring of Suffrage, Copy of Rule of the Sororitas, Shield Robes

Special Trait: Pure Faith
Such is your faith that the God Emperor has blessed you with powers of faith. You start out with the Pure Faith Talent and may buy more Faith Talents, all count as 2nd Tier Talents

Starting Wounds: 12

Arbitrator:
The Adeptus Arbites is responsible for maintaining the Lex Imperialis or Imperial Law. These men and women are more than just interstellar law enforcers, often they are also judge, jury and executioner. They are not only well trained in the art of war but also in the letter of the law
Starting Skills, Talents and Gear:

Characteristic Bonus: +3 to Toughness and Perception

Starting Skills: Awareness, Charm or Deceive, Intimidate or Interrogate or Inquiry, Common Lore (Adeptus Arbites), Dodge or Parry, Scholastic Lore (Judgement)

Starting Talents: Weapon Training (Primary, Shock, SP)

Starting Gear: Pump Action Shotgun, Knife, Uniform, Chrono, Manacles, Arbitrator ID, Flak Jacket

Starting Wounds: 12

Assassin:
There is always a place for a man or woman who is willing to end another’s life for some coin. While some are solitary others are part of larger organisations such as Assassins Guilds or Death Cults. The most feared of the Assassins are those of the Officio Assassinorum, the assassin of the Adeptus Terra.
Starting Skills, Talents and Gear:

Characteristic Bonus: +3 to Weapon Skills or Ballistics Skills and +3 to Agility

Starting Skills: Acrobatics or Athletics, Awareness, Common Knowledge (Underworld), Dodge, Parry, Stealth

Starting Talents: Weapon Training (Primary, Las, SP)

Starting Gear: Bodyglove, Las Carbine or Long Las or Mono Sword, Knife, Stub Automatic & Silencer

Starting Wounds: 12

Cleric:
These pious men and women are the priests of the Cult of the God Emperor. They can be charismatic and capable leaders, wise advisors and even feared witch hunters but above anything else they are respected. Few men dare to go against a cleric for fear of retribution by his congregation or even by the God Emperor himself.
Starting Skills, Talents and Gear:

Characteristic Bonus: +3 to Weapon Skills or +3 Willpower and +3 to Fellowship

Starting Skills: Charm or Command or Deceive, Common Lore (Ecclesiarchy), Dodge or Parry, Intimidate, Linguistics (High Gothic), Scholastic Lore (Imperial Creed), Scrutiny

Starting Talents: Weapon Training (Primary), Air of Authority or Weapon Training (Chain) or Weapon Training (Las) or Weapon Training (Flame)

Starting Gear: Aquila Necklace, Ecclesiarchy Robes, Pneumatic Hammer, Las Pistol, Flak Cloak

Starting Wounds: 12

Guardsman:
These men and women are the backbone of the Imperial Guard. It is their sacrifices that paves the way to Imperial victory and ever eternal expansion. While most lead short lives followed by a quick and gruesome death some are able to carve their names in annals of history.
Starting Skills, Talents and Gear:

Characteristic Bonus: +3 to Ballistic Skills and Strength

Starting Skills: Athletics, Awareness or Common Lore (Imperial guard), Dodge or Parry, Operate (Surface), Survival

Starting Talents: Weapon Training (Primary, Las), Weapon Training (Launcher) or Weapon Training (SP) or Jaded

Starting Gear: Guard Flak Armour, Las Gun, Knife, Dog Tags, Uniform, Rebreather

Starting Wounds: 12

Imperial Psyker:
Feared and reviled, these mutants are capable of wielding the powers of the warp to great effect. Each Psyker is doorway to the hellish dimension of the Immaterium. Though most are bound slaves to the Imperial Guard some are freed or recruited by more dubious organisations.
Starting Skills, Talents and Gear:

Characteristic Bonus: +3 to Toughness and Willpower

Starting Skills: Deceive or Intimidate, Forbidden Lore (Psykers) or Linguistics (High Gothic), Psyniscience

Starting Talents: Weapon Training (Primary) or Weapon Training (Las) or Weapon Training (SP), 300xp worth of Psychic Powers chosen from Divination, Telekinesis or Telepathy

Starting Gear: Psy Focus, Psykana Mercy Blade, Tattered Robes, Mono Sword or Las Pistol or Stub Revolver

Special Trait: Sanctioned Psyker
When you were you it was determined you were a psyker. You were taken to Holy Terra on a Black Ship of the Inquisition where you were tested. You proved yourself resistant enough against the Ruinous Powers and were given the Sanctioning Brand. You begin play with a Psy Rating of 2 and count as a Bound Psyker for the purpose of determining Psychic Strength

Starting Wounds: 10

Scum:
These are the criminals of the Imperium, they are often self-taught street-smart individuals. Though being lawless does not mean useless. Some of them are recruited by guild, syndicates or even by the Inquisition.
Starting Skills, Talents and Gear:

Characteristic Bonus: +3 to Agility and Fellowship

Starting Skills: Awareness, Charm, Common Lore (Underworld), Deceive or Intimidate, Dodge or Parry, Security or Sleight of Hand, Stealth

Starting Talents: Weapon Training (Primary), Weapon Training (Las) or Weapon Training (SP)

Starting Gear: Autopistol or Las Pistol, Underhive Leathers, Knife, Rebreather, Coverall or Street Ware

Starting Wounds: 12

Tech Priest:
The guardian of the machine spirits and preservers of the traditions of the Adeptus Mechanicus. It is the Tech Priests that maintain and create the arcane machineries that keep the Imperium running.
Starting Skills, Talents and Gear:

Characteristic Bonus: +3 Toughness and +3 Intelligence

Starting Skills: Common Lore (Adeptus Mechanicus), Common Lore (Tech), Logic , Operate (Surface) or Operate ( Aeronautical) , Parry, Tech Use

Starting Talents: Weapon Training (Primary, Las)

Starting Gear: Las Carbine, Mono Axe, Mechanicus Robes, Multi Tool

Special Trait: Mechanicus Implants
The characters was granted a set of holy Mechanicus implants upon his induction into the sect. For more details see page 144 of the Black Crusade Core Book.

Starting Wounds: 12

Life as an Acolyte:
Acolytes are the secret agents of the Inquisition. At first they will be expendable, they will not carry any credentials so that they can be easily disavowed. Later when they have proven themselves they will receive better pay, credentials and greater power.
Perks of being an Acolyte:

Bonus Skills: Linguistics (Acolyte Cell Ciphers)
Bonus Gear: Encrypted Micro Bead, Nondescript Clothing, Flak Vest, Las Pistol or Stub Automatic, Mono Combat Knife (1d5+2 R, Pen 2)

Finishing Touches:
The final stage of character creation is personalising your character, you can do this by spending 1.000 experience points graciously donated by your GM.
Additionally you may pick two pieces of Equipment with and Resources Modifier of +10 (So technically 2 Scarce Items).

Spending Experience Points:
During the course of the campaign you will gain Experience Points. Experience Points will be awarded at the end of each session. This will be somewhere around the lines of 250 to 500 point depending on the session.

Raising Abilities:
Increasing your stat-bar can be quite expensive but will affect any test you make with the given ability. Obviously you must first buy WS +5% before you can buy WS +10% or even +15%
Ability Costs
Increase +5% +10% +15% +20%
Cost 250xp 500xp 750xp 1.000xp

Buying Skills:
Buying more skills will make your character more versatile. You must first buy at +0% before you can raise it.
Skill Costs
Increase +0% +10% +20% +30%
Cost 200xp 350xp 500xp 750xp

Buying Talents:
Talents will quickly make your character stronger and more powerful. Depending on the level/tier of the Talents the cost will vary.
Talent Cost
Level 1st Tier 2nd Tier 3rd Tier
Cost 250xp 500xp 750xp

@ Santiago

It's a pretty solid piece of work with a few exceptions.

Point buy is terrible and makes everyone the same boring mirror image of everyone else of their type. Moving on....

Base 25 characteristics is pushing acolytes too far above the masses for what the game was intended. Combined with other things, you seem to be trying to turn DH into RT.

Everyone starting with a mono weapon is a bad idea. You are taking away the first tier of weapon upgrade from the GM and a basic sense of accomplishment from the players. I was excited the first time I got a Mono knife in DH, it was a special item and something that was not on everyone we came across.

Only two archetypes out of nine have 10 wounds. That is punishment, not balance. Base everyone at 10 wounds. Guardsman, Sororitas, and Arbities are logically the only ones that should get 12 wounds to start, based on archetype. Two wounds is a BIG deal. The other archetypes need to get something to balance this, extra equipment, extra skill, extra resource points, something. An alternative would be to grant everyone 10 wounds with a choice of a +2 to resource, +2 wounds, upgrade one piece of gear to good quality, or add mono to a common quality weapon.

Archetype skill selection, specifically lore skills, are pigeonholing backgrounds more than needed. An "or" choice for all common lore skills should be in every archetype except Sororitas and Psyker. These two are very specific, the rest need more flexibility. Adepts aren't all from the administratum, not all assassins are criminals, not all guardsman were in the Imperial Guard, etc.

Starting gear needs more flexibility. How come psykers can't keep their clothing in better shape?

Characteristics Bonus needs flexibility. Pick one specific bonus per archetype and one "or" choice. Assassins and clerics are like this, everyone should be.

Starting talents need more flexibility also. Grant "or" choices for weapon proficiencies in all cases.

Hopefully you find something useful in here.

What is your scale of what the Resource stat represents? Is 20 too high to start?

Hi,

I did some revising by know. My entire group hates random stats and the system works pretty well, it is not perfect mind you.
The equipment is going to be revised a bit more, making a bit more flexible. You also gain a bit of equipment from your Inquisitor, such as nondescript clothing.
The countless throne counting, while, fun needed some revisions so I currently working on a lower tier version of the Fame/Infamy.Acquisition System.

25 points start might sound a lot and it does invite to min maxing, good for me I have adult players who love balanced and "real" characters.
The characters with 10 wounds have 500xp extra in skills and talents.

As I said, it is still very much work in progress, a more final version will be posted once completed.

Oh yeah....thank you for the feed back, truly appreciate it.

Edit: Also mono is not that impressive anymore with the new Lasgun variable settings rules and I dropped the mono combat knife...

I have to agree with ItsUncertainWho, points buy is a horrible homogenising system that just leads to all characters of the same 'class' having the same stats. Every guardsman will have maxed Ballistic Skill, every Assassin maxed Weapon Skill, every Psyker maxed Willpower.
It detracts from the flavour and variety of the Imperium, it promotes min-maxing of attributes and it ultimately focuses too much on the mechanical rather than narrative side of the game.

I honestly think if you are allowing points buy, to drop the starting attributes down to 20, or even 15, and give a few more points to allocate out. This would at least see a more human ‘average’ stat line – too many 30s and higher and you are no longer an average guy working for the Inquisition but already of heroic proportions.

I think the GM can decide for himself if he wants to use 20 or 25 base, it depends on the specific campaign your playing.
We often have small groups (3 players), in such a case the pc's are more versitile if beefed up a little bit.

as for the point buy?
My group, me included, have always hated the "random starting stats" even we started playing MERP in '94.
Some people always rolled extremely well while others had truly crappy characters. Point buy is the only way for all characters to start equally powerful of sucky.

When we make characters we sit down, most players actually build in strengths but also weaknesses, and they play their weaknesses too.
Perhaps I'm just blessed:P


But nonetheless you point is taken, I will edit my document:

Base
20 Toiling in the Dirt
25 Hero Level

I prefer point-buy systems as well from a simplicity point of view and people can make up things as they want.

Anyone get a chance to have a look through mine?

I'm just in the process of finishing up a conversion over to Black Crusade rules. I've been running a DH Ascended game for about three months now, and I've found the base DH rules a little clunky, compared to my previous gaming experiences. Ascension only made the problems worse. BC seems to really clear a lot of things up. I've also learned that I can pretty much just ignore Ascension with the revised rules, and that helps cut out a high number of the problems we've been facing.

Please share your work! We haven't quite decided what to do yet, and if your solution is elegant, it might just be what we're looking for.

I'll still ironing out some last few kinks, as I've also drastically changed how Backgrounds and Alt Classes (Elite Advance Packages, in my house rules) work. I've changed things around to be much more free form (particularly in the realm of Bacgrounds and Alt Classes), as that's the style of game and mechanics I work with best. It's not likely a system that would work for everybody, as the more specific and crunchy style of DH seems to be preferred by a fair amount of the community. But I'll gladly share it when finished in the very near future.

MKX said:

Sorry MKX, I wasn't able to download it to look at. Bad Internet-Fu I guess.

My Fate3.0 has now reached a playtest version. If my gaming buddies ever sort their sh#t out enough to be available on the same day then I'll let everyone know how it went. My concern is that it will require much more 'player-participation' (read creativity) than the 'MMO Wasted' seem to possess these days.

I'm thinking of setting my first adventure using the Rogue Trader fan made adventure Throne of Iron and on a world of my own very much inspired by the album 'Floodlands' by the Sisters of Mercy. (are you reading this Adrenochrome?)

Maybe that's too ambitious and we justneed to kill some stuff the first time out.

Read through your porting of the rules MKV and I have got to say what a streamlined and well rounded set of rules. I shopped it around with the little feedback was generally positive. Only one naysayer who is against any sort of house rules and thus dismissed.

I will likely use it as a jumping off point for my next game of DH as well I had some suggestions or other bits I had kicking around.

One thing I noticed right off the bat was that the Void born homeworld was nixed under your revision and as someone who played a long campaign I can see why it could be considered disruptive or unbalanced. Having gotten my share of 9's in a row allowing multiple fate points to recycle or being ruled immune to a number of situational modifiers. I however present a more refined homeworld in tune with this redux. as follows

Void- Any of the Civilian, Naval or Rogue Trader fleets or Orbital platforms that house large sustained populations. You were born in the void and may have never even set foot on a planets surface.
-5 Strength +5 Willpower Starting Wounds 2 x Toughness Bonus +1
Skills- Operate(Spacecraft) Navigation(stellar) Trade (Any x1) Talents: Resistance (Any x1)

Trait- Void Accustomed
Due to a strange and unnatural childhood you are used to the varergries of changing gravity.
Reroll any failed test involving moving in Zero gravity or Low gravity as well sickness from space travel and rentry.

I dislike the potential infinite loop old righteous fury or charmed provided. As well the situational ability is less of a straight up ability to ignore ship conditions. Finally the ability to pick a single resistance talent provides flavor representing a certain hardship or hazard present on the vessel you hail from. Also the penalty for being a Voidborn Scum, Arbitrator or Cleric is severe in the form of a -5 fellowship penalty to interacting with non voidborn. While at the same being largely unnoticed if you do not have a wide range of fellowship abilities.

I like how a lot of the career are cleaned up as it were but some feel as though they could use a little flavor. I use the guardsman as an example of where you could split the Uplifting Primer, Mercenary License and Armed bomb collar into a background and tangible game mechanic. A rough suggestion being the Primer is just a minor charm, The mercenary license gives you a bonus to influence but only for arms and armor but a negative penalty when dealing with actual imperial guard as you are a profiteer. The collar giving you jaded and a handful of insanity points along with a live bomb on your neck.

However the guardsman ability to pick one weapon group and get a substantial bonus to said weapon group. Makes him immensely powerful when combined with the BC talents. The ability to tack on WS or BS first number as bonus damage combined with the RT style career ability is going to quickly escalate into a lasgun going from 1d10+3 to 1d10+3+2+3/4 damage each shot on top of a really high initiative and to hit bonus. Possibly downgrade it to a +5 to hit with all weapons and +1 damage to all non launcher and grenade weapons rather then specializing right off the bat for min maxing? Allowing you to still cover the muscle angle and buff it up with specific combat talents down the road.

Possibly a bit more options on some equipment I.E. Lasgun or autogun and laspistol or stubpistol ect. Otherwise this is really solid stuff.

In regards to DH itself and porting it over I think after reading the Black Crusade and other books a fair bit. I feel the armor system needs a serious overhaul to keep it both relevant and free of odd and redundant gear. Specifically stuff like how the Flak Cloak is AP 3 all locations and weighs nothing when a piecemeal set of flak being AP 2 head and 3 all other locations and is quite heavy. Parting out partial suits like guard flak into helmet, vest, Coat/jacket with arms coverage and pants. As well perhaps adding in a primitive armor rule that still keeps them relevant. Perhaps something like any non primitive penetration against them gets half again rounded up more penetration? As well most either need to be knocked down about a point at least in protection Putting most armor at only a point or two with heavier gear like metal plate in the 4 AP range. Else they need to again follow the old half AP rounded up when hit by non primitive weapons.

This would allow for a more concise and modular approach to non full suit armors and with a few rare or unique types worth using. Possibly the errata to say the firedrake scale armor so that it actually is one of the few things you can wear and survive a melta hit as per its description rather then a waste of several paragraphs. As well a organization of armor upgrades.

As an example of the earlier Flak Cloak which is as of 3.0 Errata AP 3 all locations, It would instead be AP 2 arms, body and legs with the flak special rule for AP 5 vs blasts not centered as well by its nature of while common not looking like obvious armor allows you to conceal weapons from casual observation I.E. +0/-10 (normally impossible) to notice you are holding a basic weapon or +10 or more to conceal a one handed pistol or melee weapon.

New stuff would include for instance a workman helmet which would provide 2 or 3 AP primitive head protection. Poor models are cheap and bulky while normal models come with one of the following built in at half cost of the additional item, respirator, rebreather or photovisor and a slot to secure a lamp pack. Good or better may incorporate more of these features on the same helmet. A photovisor version is just a grimdark welding mask while a respirator or rebreather model is a armored gasmask for cleaning hive vents full of biting vermin.

Or as simple as a basic 1 AP flak cowl to keep the water off and possibly hide your face. Best quality is of course AP 2 and maybe even in fashion

Both are basic and slightly fluffy without straying into the realm of always wearing a 4+ AP military helmet at social functions or walking around the hive or wherever the basic investigation is taking place.

As well some of the weapons need to be adjusted and codified a tad. Off the top of my head the Blackhammer single shot giant shotgun only does 2d10 and should bump up to 2d10+4 to fall in with the RT shotcannon. I see the Warhammer from RT has been showing up in DH and BC armory lists with its 1d10+2, AP 1 and no penalty such as the hammers unbalanced or being a two handed weapon. I can easily see it going to two handed to compete as a footmans hammer or going down to 1d10+1 I with the reverse head being a ravensbeak giving it a second profile of1d10 R and AP of 1, 3 if mono possibly with the unbalanced rule to allow other weapons to parry better as a trade off.

Glad you liked it mate and hope you have some use for it in future games, any addition/modification to suit is always up to the pervue of those who have to run and play it to where they're most happy. (Its 'fluff-lite' as that material is in the basic books and reproducing it might get me in trouble.. plus its a lot to type even for someone who can do 60-70wpm!)

Overall with the characters I've seen made with it so far, they're a lot more 'capable' than the stock standard DH ones which IMO isn't a bad thing as one of the biggest complaints I used to have was that starting DH (and to some degree RT characters) are fairly templated and mostly terrible at doing very much. Which often led to people being disenchanted as a first impression of my games, plus its just a pain having to delay adventure until they have requisite levels/skills, this way they can evolve to the campaign by learning things they need to succeed in whatever environment they're in.

Apologies for a threadomancy but MKX would you be so kind and reupload your rules? Link is dead and I´d love to read them for inspiration. I´m currently formulating some points of how to update the Dark Heresy for my games:

1/ update Talents, Traits and Skills according to the Black Crusade (would need massive rewrite of all origins, careers, backround packages..)

2/ rewrite the core careers to a single path and add some downgraded RT ones (Astropath, Voidman,..)

3/ expand character creation with Prides, Disgraces (need to rename them) and Demeanours (personal, something like Spirit of Humanity, and given by fate, nothing else then Imperial Divination)

4/ update Insanity and Corruption with Radical´s Handbook and Ascension

5/ made Investigations similiar to the Endeavours, Missions and Compacts

6/ forget Thrones, add Influence (not sure if more as in Ascension or as infamy in Black Crusade)

7/ expand Resources from Radicals Handbook, and add/merge Followers and Contacts

8/ blackcrucify combat, movement and many little rules I cant remember now..

Is it really necessary to create starting packages for careers and home worlds? Isn't it possible to just have the character purchase whatever is most appropriate to his/her background with a block of starting xp?