Hey guys, relative newcomer to the setting here, a few things have been bugging me about the setting that maybe some more wise can answer. Most of them have to deal with psykers.

Ok so first off how common are psykers? I mean of all classifications. Going by what the book says millisions of psykers for the billions of billions in normal society. Just for the sake of argument lets assume one psyker for every 100,000 imperial citizens. Perhaps the number is even less but we'll go ahead and work with that figure for a moment and work with it. This leads to serious imperial worlds producing thousands of psykers between culling. Based on the Imperiums doctrinal fear and mistrust in psykers and the very real threat they pose of warp breach I'd imagine life is going to suck for many of these guys and gals even more then it sucks for a lot in the imperium at large.

Now normally I'd presume that because of their inherent danger most psykers would be killed if they were born during a time when a black ship was not expected. But a couple of things that prevent me from believing that are as follows. I havn't found any hard numbers on how many psykers are required to be in the astronomicon but the number given on the wiki is 10000 who are likely seeing significant turnover as they burn themselves out so lets put the numbers at somewhere ranging in the 3k per day range. Maybe all the bodies removed from the chamber smell vaguely of flowers and have a beautiffic smile on their face, who can say. The other is the bit of the lore that the two things the imperium is absolutely inflexible on with planetary governors are tithes of men and materials and tithes of psykers. All this leads me to the belief that every major imperial world will have some form of government facility likely administered by the Imperial Cult and guarded by the Arbites that houses psykers between black ship pickups. Given the time involved in travel to planets it's quite possible that during some periods psykers spend their entire lives in these facilities.

Now here's where it all starts to break down for me. This leads my minds eye to the requirement for literally millions of black ships circling segmentums before making the long pilgramige to terra a period of time that even by warp time might take a psykers entire life span meaning entire generations of psykers might give birth to new generations in the ships holds. Actually this makes a fair bit of sense as if the condition is genetic it might lead to the psykers that are eventually dropped off on Terra being stronger in power.

And here's where things start to shake loose for me. Once the black ships arrive on Terra they are seperated based on function. Some are sent to the astra-telepathica of those some are given over to the astronomicon itself and others become astropaths (whether the astropaths are the "Rejects" or those who are stronger has been left deliciously vague by what i've seen). Then of the rest of the pool goes on to train for other sorts of psyker duties throughout the imperiums structure. BUT this means that every single psyker in the Imperium had to make the long trip to earth and the long trip back to wherever they are. Now transit times change depending ont he writer but consistantly that should take hundreds of years real time and at least a good 20-30 years ships time if not more. That just doesn't seem workable.

Then the final question of course is where do Librarians fit into all this? Does the implantation process just tend to force the emergence of psychic powers and since they already fall under the space amrines purview their exempt? It's hinted that the black templars screen and deny initiatiates if they have psychic potential which means there must be some sort of test.

In my never ending quest to preserve the rule of cool in the setting but make it work on a day to day basis I've come to the conclusion that what likely happens is the black ships run a cycle amongst the planets, this means a governor likely knows well ahead of time when ones coming by. During the run up to a Black Ships arrival psykers are held in some sort of warded temple containment facility instructed to fear and shun their own power and having their spiritual needs ministered to by stern but forgiving priests backed up by completely unforgiving Sister of Battle. Now as these facilities would be target numero uno for heretics and a danger to the local population they are likely heavily guarded, isolated and to some extent secret operating under the authority of the inquisition. During a period where no black ships are expected the facility would likely train low level stable psykers in the use of their gifts dubbing them safe enough to be released to other organizations (Imperial Guard and temple orders would be big ones).

The reason for all this thought is I plan on having one of such facilities feature in my KT's next mission on Castobel as some strange occurances in the countryside might be tied to an escapee from said facility getting a heretic/chaos force together and animating the bodies of imperial and tyranid alike as well as his conveyance of choice a shot down tyranid kraken that fell to the planet during the initial attack and now re-animated by dark sorcery. In a future mission I want to send the KT to a space hulk that may contain a black ship borrowing elements from a Dark Heresy adventure..

i think your giving the travel to terra too much time, also there are alot of black ships running around. Psykers being common means someone has ability 1 in a million. we have 6 trillion on earth at current so 6k people with major talent, possibly triple that in latents? latent being not capable of combat casting but just enough to be part of a choir to amplify a real casters. ussally psykers are killed on discovery. those noticeable are drawn either by a local navigator house or black shipped to be part of the astronomican, also you need to remember the imperium is impossibly large so the math can just kind of force its self to work beacuse if a ship left terran orbit every 5 minutes, it would still fit into the realm of how large the imperium is.

space marine psykers are identified before they take their tests to be worthy of implantation and as the adeptus astartes are basically atonomus they deal with the sanctioning of their own. the black templar refuse those with psychic potential becuase psykers are against the law laid down by the emperor and apparently everyone forgot about nikea. its always been my major beef with 40k that the biggest reason the thousand sons are tratior marines, is just glossed over like not really anything that matters to imperial forces....

the idea that theres a centralized location is well highly supported by navigator houses, those that can see how to fly thru the warp make money, and can arrange for those born on their planet to remain in their service with a little greasing the wheels, so it would exist and be heavily defended. that said navigatior houses are typically very very vain and would not stand for having a site not in down town hive city. were navigatiors were kind of a big deal.

hope ive been helpful.

Well my understanding is that psychic powers are fine but sorcery is not and that was the big problem for the thousand sons. A psychic is powerful a psychic sorceror is a god walking.

I may have to go looking in rogue trader or elsewhere for transit times but my understanding is most of the time transiting the enite length of the imperium takes years unless it's handwaved as necissary (for example the Grey Knights deploy from their base in Sol anywhere in fairly short order because they have some of the "fastest ships"). It's been alluded to crusades and pilgrim ships leaving for a far flung destination only to have many generations later of descendants arrive at the final destination.

Yeah, the psyker dilemma is a fun conundrum, when one takes into account how large the Imperium is supposed to be. If rolls go well, and for Black Ships, they often will (they have all the best twinks) shouldn't be too long an affair. A trip across a segmentum is 100+ days, so cross the one you are in, and Segmentum Solar, to reach Earth, should be 200+ days, assuming good rolls by the Navigator. If we just assume the Imperium bends its rules as is convenient, the Black Ships probably have runecasters, or an archaeotech equivalent, which makes the checks blissfully easier, AND halves the travel time, so we get back to 100+ days. If we assume they stop off every so often, to hit the next planet on route for their psyker tithe, they lessen the risks of warp disturbances, which helps.

Figure something like this (here's hoping I know what I am doing ): The Navigator [int 50, Per 50; Awareness +10, Nav (Warp) +20] estimates 150 days to cross Seg. Obscurus, and reach Seg. Solar. Two degrees of success (Awareness check) gets it down to 75 days. His warp checks are +50 (combo DofS from Awareness check, skill bonus, and easier check), without the runecaster (some GMs cap skill boosts, so failure can still happen), so a safe voyage, and if they drop out at other worlds, the likelyhood of the Warp being a tool is lessened. You could, relatively easily, reach Earth in 160 days (giving a bit more leeway) from almost anywhere, and do so with relatively smooth sailing. Work in other ship augments, and flubbing that psykers can use Corpus Conversion to boost a Navigator's senses (one of the books alludes to it in their description of ship-born psykers, and their place among the crew), and the time, accuracy, and safetly of most trips becomes cake. Yes, it does say that the Black Ships usually visit once a generation, and so they would have to hold some, kill others, and miss a few, but okay.

As for psykers, some kill themselves, some probably turn themselves in (they grew up with the same "programming" as everyone who fears them, and "do the right thing"), and some make a fight out of it. Those who make the sojourn, and survive the Black Ships, get to become Sanctioned, become Astropaths, feed the Emperor, or feed the Astronomicon. If you grew up on a Space Marine world, they look you over. If you lack the skills to be a Marine, they either kill you, or send you on the ships, same as everyone (they aren't required to pay a tithe, but I assume they would contribute to the effort). If you are suitable to become one of the few, they run you through rigorous testing, and if you pass, implantation happens, same as every Marine, and higher Librarians educate you.

Should you slip through the cracks, you either give yourself up, or fall to taint, and die, grow strong, and/or attract my favorite people, the Inquisitors.

Psychic powers are not seen as fine, but they are seen as necessary. Without psykers, the Imperium that hates them so much would die. Without astropaths to be living comm satellites (often groups as a choir), worlds couldn't talk to each other, and Navigators couldn't fly them between those worlds. Though they don't know it, their greatest champions, the Grey Knights, also couldn't fight the worst of the daemons, and keep them safe. That being said, many often detest, but still grudgingly accept psykers. Sorcerers are another story, and all must be killed. Every psyker MIGHT be a warp incursion walking, but every Sorcerer is already on the phone, ordering pizzas from Papa Nurgle's. That's why the Inquisition hunts them relentlessly, and they must grow strong, for they have no other allies than those who have already damned them, and often no sympathy for those who wish them to stop.

lurkeroutthere said:

the thousand sons were hung out to dry and called scorrcers by their peers and were accused of "unclean magics" by the space wolves they served next to for a couple of campaings. the "Trial of Magnus the red" happend on Nikea and the Horus Heresy novel covering the leigon has a good coverage of the event. That said my big point is in that novel version of the event the emperor said that humanity as a whole space marines included were not yet ready and that all were to set aside psyich powers or be an enemy of the imperium. this was probably thematic to set up the conflict and the use of the space wolves as executioners against Magnus and sons for trying to help.

Or it could have been that it was a really bad piece of fiction that is out of synch with the canon as a whole and not the defining step for the canon. I mean you can like the book book but the one end point that was like pretty well set down even before that book was written was A) There are psykers in the imperium B) The emperor was a psyker and used psychic powers.

Interesting take on the math Venkelos. I have to say that I still think that Psykers unless they are actively and regularly using their powers will self identify and await scooping up by the black ships.