Moribound for attachments

By berto, in 2. AGoT Rules Discussion

If character with attachment is killed and goes to moribound state can I use Response on attachment? I think attachment is discarded after character is killed as passive effect so leaves play until response can be used. Am I right?

The attachment becomes moribund in step 4 of the action window, when passive effects resolve. Like all all moribund cards, it stays on the table through step 5 (Responses) and is discarded in step 6. So yes, you can trigger its Response.

berto said:

If character with attachment is killed and goes to moribound state can I use Response on attachment? I think attachment is discarded after character is killed as passive effect so leaves play until response can be used. Am I right?

berto said:

If character with attachment is killed and goes to moribound state can I use Response on attachment? I think attachment is discarded after character is killed as passive effect so leaves play until response can be used. Am I right?

The attachment becomes moribund in the passive step just after the attached card becomes moribund. As it is moribund, the response can be used normally in the response step (unless it would make it leave play as a cost or as an effect, because of the rules about moribund).

Does the attachment "unattach" in step 4, though, as it becomes moribund (before a response could be triggered)? If it's effects gave some property to the "Attached character", or required some property of the attached character, would it no longer be attached and therefore be unable to trigger? Or does it remain attached until all cards leave play in step 6.

It stays attached to the character, it just entered a moribund:discard pile state. There can never be an unattached attachment in play, I think.

Ratatoskr said:

It stays attached to the character, it just entered a moribund:discard pile state. There can never be an unattached attachment in play, I think.

Indeed, otherwise Nymeria, Lightbringer et al would be pretty useless.

Well no, because they are save/cancel responses, and therefore happen in step two (before the attachment becomes moribund in step 4)

Yeah, Nymeria and Lightbringer are pretty useless once the characters they are attached to are moribund. Entering moribund on the way out of play is a one-way trip. You cannot go from a moribund state back into play. Nymeria and Lightbringer save the characters so that they never become moribund in the first place.

But Rat has the right of it. The moribund card is still considered to be "in play." In order for an attachment to be considered "in play," it has to be attached to something. So the moribund attachment is considered to still be attached to whatever card it is on (which is often moribund itself). So if a moribund attachment has some sort of "attached character gains" or "attached character gets" or a "kneel attached character to..." cost, that will still be applicable because the moribund attachment is, indeed, still attached.

-Istaril said:

Well no, because they are save/cancel responses, and therefore happen in step two (before the attachment becomes moribund in step 4)

You misunderstand me; I meant only that any attachment whose only purpose to interact with the attached character would be pretty useless if it could become unattached and yet remain in play through certain effects. It was silly to pick two save effects but in my defence it was 8am and I couldn't think of any others ;)