How would you handle a more powerful null? Such as the Omega Minus embryo that was used in one of the novels to kill psykers by just being exposed to it.

Letrii said:

I hate to be a smart arse, but I think you've answered your own question. If it kills psykers just by being exposed to it, then that's a great place to start for mechanics.

To be a bit fairer to PCs though, you might want to give it an effect radius, and perhaps saving throw. Do not use willpower, because they'll all have a really high save. I would recommend toughness to reprsent 'system shock'.

When a psyker approaches the radius they being to feel very sick, weak, disoriented, and cannot sense the warp. If they don't take that as a hint and proceed regardless, then given the level of power you have described, it's time to make your toughness save every round the psyker is in the area of effect , or die.

If this this too harsh, you may wish to allow burning* a fate point to postpone a toughness test for one round.

(*spending a fate point will still give you a reroll though)

Any suggestions for power scale of varying ranks of nulls?

And what rank would the standard null from DotD fall into?

Personally I wouldn't even try to quantify that. I'd go for something like the Omega null having that power as a narrative plot device and use mechanic similar to what I've described.

You could spend an awful lot of time creating rank mechanics etc, but I don't think this sort of thing should ever be given to the PCs, so it's okay if the details ara bit vague in my opinion. It's all about bang for your buck at the end of the day, and GM prep time is very precious to me.

Finally, a null is a null. In my interpretation is that they lack something, not that they have a power, so ranks don't really make sense. This omega null would of course be an exception as a narrative tool.

I say keep it simple and dress it up.

Perhaps the effects could be worse depending on the power of the psyker too.

IE: the higher your psy rating, the more you hurt.

Instant death throws, make sure to pick a save they'll be bad at?

If you want them to die, just kill them and be done with it.

I'd have such a super null deal damage to psykers equal to 1D10 + the psyker's psy rating - psyker's willpower bonus. Toughness and armor don't protect unless the armor is specially sealed.

In addition I'd have that damage be tearing if he's sustaining any psy power.

How often that damage was dealt depends on the proximity to the supernull.

Hodgepodge said:

Hi Hodgepodge. Thing is I agree with you. However, I think you've been too quick to take a contrary position.

Please note I built provisions for fate points into the mechanic I described. I grew up playing D&D and don't have a problem with Save vs Death, because there are ways around it, which in Dark Heresy is spending or burning fate points. It wasn't my point to screw over players, any GM can do that at a moments notice, rather I wanted to create a mechanic that reflected the power levels described by the OP WHILE still being fair to the PCs. What I have described is very survivable. Maybe read my post again if that wasn't clear.

p.s. My GM is a bit of a newbie, and doesn't want to kill any PCs. It's getting so I take it for granted that I will survive every fight, which takes the edge-of-your-seat element out of the game completely.

Your solution does make sense, but DH is great for having mechanics for that sort of thing that flesh out the gap between "you survive" and "instant death" in an interesting way.For example, a roll on the shock table, which is basically critical hits for fear rolls.

Hodgepodge said:

Yeah, I hadn't thought of the shock table, you might be on to something there.

Burning a fatepoint to postpone the test one round? Save vs Death are so cheesy. Hated AD&D for having those. It always gave me the imprssion that no matter how good you play. If the adventure feels like it, it can just kill you like that. Or the horrible leveldraining by various undead. Roleplaying your ass of to get a few extra xp. One touch from a corpse and its gone. Please more D&D mechanics in Dark Heresy

Our DM tried to balance it out by making every encounter completely survivable. No danger at all. And I agree with you, it's even worse.

Letrii said:

If you are going to use a superpowerful null that kills psykers, at least give the acolytes a fighting chance. Give them opportunities to find out about the null so they can prepare. Maybe some form of shield for the psyker that also nulls his powers but at least protects him. But make it difficult to obtain. And If they mess that up? Well to bad... happy hunting gm

Reference the Radicals Handbook (pg. 38) sidebar note titled "the Untouchable and the Profane" as far as any potentials for nulls increasing their power levels as it clearly states that in ALL cases it is left to the GM to decide how they are handled. IF your GM wants something in writing for the game to use as a baseline or as the general "new" ruleset for the ideas mentioned for growing power for a null then you can reference dark reign site for the untouchable class as someone has already written a decent supplement for it. ( essentially expanding on existing rules for them by allowing the PC to "purchase" higher levels of "NULL" ( like psykers purchase higher psy ratings ) that only allow the area of influence where their uneasy effect and warp distortion/nullification effect can be felt ( IE..rank 1 is disruption radius of the WP bonus in meters..rank 2 is WP bonus x2 meters and rank 3 is WP bonus x3 meters and so on..allowing a null to have greater and wider area of influence over warp use distortion to aid his fellow PCs by disturbing all psy abilities within the area.

On another note with them i would also increase the associated penalties on psykers within these "stronger distortion" affected areas accordingly ( describing it much as the null learning greater control and mastery of their unique status/ability as they grow in the area..so too does the difficulty rating to ovecome their influence within it to cast their psy abilities ) As psykers have 6 effective ranks..then so too the nulls have 6 ranks to describe their distortion levels of skill/ability...something as follows

Psychic Disruption: level 1) radius equal to nulls WP bonus in meters / Threshold for all psy abilities increased by 10 + any associated tests by psyker by -20 / entities subject to warp instability suffer double damage while in area of effect.

level 2) radius equal to WP bonus x2 in meters / Thresholds increased by 15 / any tests increased by -25 / warp instability suffer x3 damage

level 3) radius equal to WP bonus x3 in meters / Thresholds increased by 20 / any tests increased by -30 / warp instability suffer x4 damage

level 4) radius equal to WP bonus x4 in meters / Thresholds increased by 25 / any tests increased by -35 / warp instability suffer x5 damage

level 5) radius equal to WP bonus x5 in meters / Thresholds increased by 30 / any tests increased by -40 / warp instability suffer x6 damage

level 6) radius equal to WP bonus x6 in meters / Thresholds increased by 35 / any tests increased by -45 / warp instability suffer x7 damage

While these numbers seem a bit excessive..think that over time the psykers the null is facing will grow in power as well able to manifest abilities easier so the null growing like this will keep the playing field level. Also a strong idea is the application of a actual Fear rating for when the null decides to assert the full power of his ability against any foe...since everything about in the official game mechanics and fluff indicates a null is feared by everyone due to their natural uneasy presence...id personally go with something like as follows

Psychic disruption: level 1) initial Fel penalty of -10

level 2) Fel penalty increased to -20

level 3) Fel penalty increased to -30 / ability to focus or diffuse the effect of overal unease to as little as initial -10 or moderate -20 to full -30

level 4) gains Fear rating of 1

level 5) Fear rating increases to 2

level 6) Fear rating increases to 3 / greater focus / diffusion ability for the effect from as little as initial -10 to full Fear 3 or any of the levels in between

These penalties will seriously balance out the nulls taking the levels since it will adversely affect all social interactions making some skills totally useless ( carouse ) and others supremely effective ( interrogation / intimidation for instance ) at higher levels