Blood Pact said:

You might be mistaken...

Remember, chapter trappings are small things... a bike is frankly a bit big and character-defining, when other chapter trappings are simple melee weapons, robes and little icons that adorn your armour. Also remember that the White Scars are defined by their attitudes and traditions... that bikes suit their preferred style of warfare well is advantageous, but they aren't just "White-armoured Space Marines on Bikes".

Oh believe me, I know there's far more to them than being Space Marines on bikes, I just figured that one of those two things would include a bike, Trappings because they're so much more accessable, or Relics because I'm sure the White Scars have many bikes with a long and storied history of use.

What I really like about the White Scars is that (to oversimplify things) they're space Mongols. I haven't studied them or anything, like some of the others, but am an avid reader of military history of all sorts, and from there began to delve in to other aspects of the subject. Not to mention, the movie Mongol by Sergei Bodrov is epic!

And then there's the Hunt for Voldorious, which I think did a really nice job on them, even if I think doubling up on the word "Moon" in the name of Kor'sarro Khan's sword and bike was a bit clumsy writing.

Are the Raven Guard anything like the unofficial package available online? Namely, are they still good at sneaking and stuff?

borithan said:

VERY good at it. Like do not get a penalty in power armor and other stuff good.

Nice.

Is that a Solo Mode ability, some sort of Talent, or just someone they inherently get?

(and do the other Chapters in the book have something like that of their own?)

I know the Imperial Fists didn't get Advanced Specialties, but did the Black Templars? Kinda' blows if neither one of them got anything. Seems odd. I'm not too up on the lore for them, but I DO suppose the DW Champion specialty kind of fills in for the obvious Champion of the Emperor possibility.

There's a Disctinction for that in Rites of Battle too.

I suppose it could also be represented by Honour Guard, though that's a bit of a stretch.

Captain Ventris said:

Black Templars aren't in the book, they're a Second Founding Chapter. So no, they didn't either. Short of the Rites of Battle Stuff.

Oh derp, that makes sense. Still, sucks to see no Advanced specialties for the Fists either.

So for followers, the active ones are a copy/paste out of Black Crusade, and the passive ones are like contacts from DH?

I'm a little bit dissapointed by the Wargear-Section. Unless you use the optional Weapon Stats from the errata in your games most weapons are pretty useless.

Is this another attempt to sell us the optional rules as the new official ones for Deatwatch and if this is the case why use all the NPCs the old stats in this book?

Why is there no consistency in the new supplements?

If the optional rules are now the official ones it would have made sense to print these including the missing Weapon stats from the MoX instead of some adventure at the end of this book. The argument "Everybody knows the errata rules!" won't work here or why did they at least print the 'Proven'-Quality?

Oooooh.....can't wait for my own copy to arrive.

As a fanatically devout Son of Sanguinius I'd love it if somebody could give me some details on what the Blood Angels get.

Read the previous posts and must say am steaming that the Furioso Dread got put in instead of the desperately hoped for (by me anyway) Sanguinary Guard. I mean yeah Dreads are fun to play but for the covert ops type missions that Kill-Teams usually get sent on they stick out like an Ork in a ballerina outfit.

*sigh* Is it just me or are the Blood Angels the ones who always get the bad end of the deal? Space Wolves get to play with Fluffy, my best friend (and huge Ravenwing fan) is delighted to finally be able to join that distinguished organization and have his own Watcher in the Dark butler, and the Smurfs (and I use that as a term of endearment) get the Tyrannic War Vet (at least one of my wishes was granted) and the Honor Guard.

Oh one last question in the Armory section is there any new chapter specific weaponry (please say Angelus-pattern bolter)?

Carnage1138 said:

I play a BA Librarian and this remark is an eyebrow raiser. In fact imho the Blood Angels have been so far the best chapter to pick, followed by Ultras. Great characteristic bonuses and great advances, good psy power, great solo mode ability, decent squad mode (too pricey), relics are fluffy but not too flash admittedly - but otherwise? They are awesome gods of melee.

Alex

I think the DA are the ones that get stiffed a bit as all of the higher options (Ravenwing, Deathwing) straightjacket them into the anti-Fallen game which isn't necessarily what I want out of them. At least their new Solo Mode Ability is pretty solid if not terribly exciting.

Not necessarily. The Ravenwing may be about hunting the Fallen but their skill on bikes and land speeders in pursuit of such missions is legendary and they can use those skills to hunt xenos just as well as the Fallen. As for the Deathwing I don't think they are straightjacketed into an anti-Fallen game because....well.....walking tanks aren't exactly good if the traitor decides to leg it. In a Deathwatch setting its more of their being an elite Terminator unit when compared to other Terminator units that makes them ideal. Also you guys get your own Watcher in the Dark butler! Until somebody informs me otherwise us bloodsuckers don't have any specific lackeys.

Another reason I disagree is that you don't have to listen to your buddy holler about how excited he is that he can finally join the Ravenwing every two weeks when you go to play Rogue Trader.

HappyDaze said:

Carnage1138 said:

Yes, that one is definitely in there. They also get some good fluff I seem to recall about being extra good at a Stormbird or something else, it's a type of flying vehicle the BAs are one of the only ones to know much about. There might even be a rule, can't recall offhand.

HappyDaze said:

Fallen are exceedingly rare though.

Alex

YAY!!!! Now all i need is a Relic Weapon, Artificer armor, and the Sanguinary Guard jetpack relic from Rites of Battle and I'm a Sanguinary Guard in all but name.

Dulahan said:

Doesn't Rites of Battle feature Sanguinary Guard as a Distinction? Just take that and talk to your GM about acquiring the wargear. Taking either Deathwatch Champion or a modified version of Honor Guard would work/help.

Dulahan said:

I have yet to own a copy of First Foundings (as the shipment has not reached my FLGS). According to current BA codex, the BA have the Storm Raven Gunship. From what you're mentioning it seems to be the Storm Raven.

From sources on warhammer wiki that it was rumoured to be based on a design of an STC rediscovered by a BA techmarine. It seems to be smaller than a Thunderhawk as it can only carry upto 12 Tactical Marines, or 6 assault marines and a Dreadnought.

Seems to be suited for smaller insertions for fighting in built up areas/ urban ops. The Stormbird on the other hand was a pre heresy design which was superceded by the thunderhawk. Stormbirds were larger than the thunderhawks and were able to ferry the strength of an entire company of legionnaires.

That's the one. It's mentioned as being well liked by the Deathwatch because it suits them well.

Carnage1138 said:

It's just you.

BAs are disgustingly good.

And the book itself recommends use of the Ultramarine Honor Guard template for the SG. So that's free relic armour and a nice upgrade on something else.

The new Space Wolves trapping that gives them Frenzy is sure to be a hit.

How are followers acquired, anyway? I assume they have renown Thresholds, so do they cost Experience? What kind of prices? 1500-2000? Highly variable?

Captain Ventris said:

Either 500, 1000, or 1500 xp depending on the power of the follower. The big wolf is 1500 xp whiel the Watcher in the Dark is 500 xp.