Im a bit confused

By MyNeighbourTrololo, in Arkham Horror Second Edition

Why Ghatanothoa has this -1 succesess ability? Why designred didn't just increased his combat modifer by -1?

Lets do math with, say, 10 combat parameter of investigator.

Combat modifer -5.

5 maximum successes against this.

Combat modifer -4 + this ability.

5 maximum successes against this.

What was the point?

I don't know. Variety's sake?

Investigators rolling fewer dice are distinctly at a bigger disadvantage than those rolling more. I don't know from theme's sake, so I'll say variety.

MyNeighbourTrololo said:

Why Ghatanothoa has this -1 succesess ability? Why designred didn't just increased his combat modifer by -1?

Lets do math with, say, 10 combat parameter of investigator.

Combat modifer -5.

5 maximum successes against this.

Combat modifer -4 + this ability.

5 maximum successes against this.

What was the point?

They're not mathematically the same. Lets look at a case where you have a combat check of 8, and his combat modifier is -6. If you increase his combat modifier to -7, you'd roll 1 die, and have a 1/3rd chance at a success. As written, you'd roll two dice. You'd have to roll two successes to get one hit. The odds of getting two successes in two dice is 1/9th. His ability is much stronger than an additional -1 to the combat check.

Furthermore, this would impact the effects of items like the shotgun. Lets say you roll one die with the current modifier with a shotgun. You still have a chance to get one success. If you increase his combat modifier instead, no dice are rolled.

So for at least those two reasons, they are mathematically different effects. That's the point.

The argument of shotgun is the only valid from two of yours.

MyNeighbourTrololo said:

The argument of shotgun is the only valid from two of yours.

what? jack21222's other argument is mathematically sound for all but the case where you have 7 combat (and -6 deals you one die and if it's a success it's substracted, compared to not rolling a die - e.g. you cannot gain a hit).

additionally, the skill where you exhaust to gain a combat success isn't as good, and when facing the epic battle card "everyone who doesn't roll a success gets devoured" you don't automatically succeed on it.

Yeah, one fewer success is very different from--and much worse than--one fewer die, for the simple reason that each die is going to to produce a success 1/3 of the time.

It's true, as in your example, that that the maximum number of successes is the same, but the odds of the various other success-giving outcomes are far lower, because it's a lot easier to roll, for example, one success on two dice than it is to roll two successes on three dice.

MyNeighbourTrololo said:

The argument of shotgun is the only valid from two of yours.

You're living up to your name.

jack21222 said:

You're living up to your name.

And you're to proud of yourself to open your eyes wide enough to see the truth.

Not so sure I get the point of names or no names, but yes, they are different. Even if it's true (shotgun case aside) that the maximum number of successes you can get is the same, the odds of scoring this maximum are different. Besides, the shotgun thing works perfectly, if you're allowed to roll one die and score a 6, then the 2 successes becomes 1; if you have an extra penalty of -1, then no dice to roll, no chance of getting a six, thus no way you can score at least a single success.


As Taurmindo and the others said, it works perfectly

In a Low Luck universe, one less success equals to 3 less dice (w/o bless or curse). It never equals 1 less die. The problem is we are not living in a Low Luck universe.

It is the exact same thing with each monsters' toughness points and combat modifiers points. Each toughness point equals to three dice in average and each combat modifier point equals to one die, so each toughness point equals to -3 combat modifier points. In a Low Luck universe (and without blessing or cursing) there would be no difference between one toughness point and -3 combat modifiers.

In a Low Luck universe, a Ghast and a Proto-shoggoth would both need exactly 9 points of combat rating to be defeated (without blessing or cursing). In real life, a proto-shoggoth is slightly more difficult. Modifiers are worsening the odds of a needed result, while successes needed are worsening the actual needed result. Very different things.

Orbiter dictum: In Axis and Allies online games, some people are using a Low Luck system to minimize the luck factor of dice-rolling. It makes the whole gaming experience much more chess-like. One could do the same in Arkham Horror: For example, when fighting a Shoggoth and rolling 7 dice, just auto-deal 2 hits without rolling the first 6 dice, and then roll one die. If a success, the Shoggoth is dead, otherwise the battle continues. That means of course you can never kill a Shoggoth with less than 7 dice.

I don't think Arkham would be as fun in a low-luck universe, though.

I prefer to think of it as a high-Lore universe

Tibs said:

I don't think Arkham would be as fun in a low-luck universe, though.

I think so too. On the other hand, Low Luck is essential for contemplating strategy "routines", untainted from luck- or the lack of it.