It would be arguably the worst card advantage card in the game - that's my issue with it. It's just not the type of solution to card advantage that is going to help Targ.

I would literally play Court Advisor over it. At least Court Advisor gives an icon and can't be Paper Shielded or He Calls it Thinking'd.

It seems on par with dragon's tail in my book. Except you aren't also giving your opponent two cards, but you are having to wait until the challenges phase to compensate.

And how many people play Dragon's Tail?

I've seen quite a bit of it around here

I've put two copies of it in my Targ deck the last few builds of the House I've made. I usually play a melee with two other people and it helps when one of them are about to win and just neutered myself and the third player from stopping them from winning. So giving us each a few extra cards in hopes we'll draw stuff to fend them off with isn't necessarily a bad thing.

I'd rather see a -1 terminal burn event that allows you to draw 2 cards if you killed target character kinda like Insidious Ways or Beware of the Sphinx.

It would also increase value of shadow pits and other non-terminal burn cards.

That's quite a good idea, actually. Maybe kneel 1 influence to give a character -1 STR and that character is killed/discarded if its STR is 0 until the end of the phase. If that character is killed/discarded this phase, draw 2 cards. Of course, the draw could be some other mechanic like Crown of Meereen if they want Targ to have a distinct flavor of card advantage.

Burn + card advantage... isn't that a bit much, given burn is already very hard to save from?

How about making some additional low cost (or no cost) ambush attachments to better fuel Xaro's?

I would also like to see some sort of discard/manipulation to strengthen the ability to play x2-3 of unique tech. Maybe a Daenerys that can discard a card to look at the top five cards of the deck, place one in hand, and put the rest back in any order.

Ambush is a "put into play" mechanic, it won't trigger Xaro's Home.

We have a good Daenerys (the +1 version), your proposed card would make sense as the Green Grace from Dance with Dragons.

Tokhuah said:

Tokhuah said:

That would be an insanely great ability (and I'm assuming you'd limit it to once per round).

Toss attachment -> Dig for good character -> Play good character -> LDChambers to put the attachment back in your hand -> Possibly Xaro's Home after playing the attachment, just to prove some kind of point.

In other words, that'd be a Dany who cost 5.

And people would complain that she was too cheap.

And yet, it wouldn't be a card that is clearly better than the new Doran Martell, who people are saying is too expensive for his ability.

A 3 STR Bicon with Vengeful (which, along with Vigilant, is the best house specific keyword in the game), No Attachments, and that makes your opponent discard EVERY time you lose a challenge as a defender is ridiculous. Add in the noble crest and Lord trait and you have the ability to guarantee he's alive for at least 2-3 turns.

One thing that bothers me a bit is people who keep talking about Targ cards that are too good or proposed cards that would be too good. Maesters are too good across the board, even post-errata, they have everything you could possibly imagine. Ellaria Sand is too good. Red Viper is too good. Ser Arys Oakheart is too good. Arianne Martell is too good. Venomous Blade is too good. Viper's Bannermen is too good. Burning on the Sand is too good. King's Landing Robert Baratheon is too good. Defenders Melisandre is too good. Knight of Flowers is too good. Smuggler's Cove is too good.

My point is that the power of a house is determined by much more than a single card in its pool being too good. It's not a big deal if a sub-par house gets a single card that is too good. Right now we're having houses with too many too-good cards getting cards that are too good.

Replace too good with practice and I'm Allen Iverson.

/rant

Stasis said:

Well then. how about not Ambush but cheap and awesome to fuel Xaro's?

Daenerys is a nerf from her ccg 3 cost+not limited to Targ for the bump version. It would be nice to see her with a bit more active and/or interactive ability. Both her 4 cost versions make her feel more like a location than a person.

The version of her I came up with should be 4 not 5. At 4 she is really good and will make a difference in the game. At 5 she seems really good but cost makes the card scry ability too slow... The point being that you play the card at 4, you have a better chance of playing something else drawn with the deck manipulation on the same turn. If the card costs 5 it will raise the difficulty to take immediate advantage of the ability... Anyway, this is a huge hypothetical because they will likely not ever make a card like this...

Tokhuah said:

It would help if next good card we get had a different name than Daenesys or Khal Drogo

I still think this game needs a Mad King Aerys or Rhaella character. Or at the very least, an event named after The Mad King. As for a card that could deal with recycling attachments how about Doreah and Irri? Dany's two handmaidens? They could be a 1STR, 3 cost card. One with intrigue, the other with power icons. And the ability "If you win a challenge in which they participated, search either the top 3 cards of your deck, dead pile or discard pile for an attachment with printed cost 3 or lower and put it into your hand." It would allow for recycling attachments easily, opponents would have to be forced to block it or else risk a Targ attachment returning into play this or next turn, and the cost for each of them while high would certainly be worth the option of searching the top of your deck, dead or discard piles. This could also, somewhat, help with the draw for Targ too in a sense by removing the attachments from your deck quickly so you can draw your characters/locations/events constantly to keep yourself protected.

Rogue Cypher said:

Targ does need more of those.

Tokhuah said:

You can only fit so many attachments in a deck, and we already have some decent 0 and 1 cost attachments. For example: Bones of a Child. A 1-cost non-Response attachment that reduces claim and can be recursed and used every Round. I see no reason this shouldn't be run 3x in every recursion deck, yet I feel like it rarely sees play.

LoneWanderer said:

Did you forget a ~ on this comment? We already have some pretty decent 2-3 cost 1-STR characters with good abilities... Street Waif and Maegi Crone come to mind. Why would we need more characters that get hit by TftN and VB? We need more 3+ STR affordable characters with decent abilities.

I only said 1STR/3 cost because of the ability to easily recycle attachments, slowly eliminate a type of card from the top of your deck so you're drawing more of the other types (better draws to protect yourself), and it somewhat makes your opponent have to try and block it or else they're risking you getting cards which means they might have to over-commit if you have any buff cards. Hell, make it 3 cost, 3 STR and only allow it to search the deck then. It does the same thing, still moderately affordable and it has good STR on it. Instead of making two for each icon, make one and turn it into a bicon of Intrigue/Power.

I do like that idea, I just really did think his comment was missing the ~
---Edited b/c the 2nd half of my comment made no sense---

Thematically speaking, Targaryen in the books right now is the weakest house.....So they should be the weakest in the game.....but they are getting stronger and that can be shown in the new Ser Selmy......The dude is nuts. He just screws up your opponents combat math.....Im building a deck around him. I see myself wanting my opponent to go first almost everyturn.....just daring them to come at the most honorable kight.

That being said, there are many deficiencys.....My biggest complaint is the lack of saves...I was buiding that targ deck but could find very few save abilities....

Any suggestions on saves for a targ build that focuses heavily on Selmy?

Thanks

Unburnt + recycling attachment's + pentos

Thecheese said:

thats some pretty questionable logic, House Stark barely exists right now i would put the house with dragons and the last Targaryen (probably not) ahead of the house with a burned out castle, bones and children.

jack merridew said:

... and some big ass wolves, and a lethal assassin who can switch her face at will, and a psychic who can see through the eyes of ravens and speak through the voices of trees and also see into the future, and Azor Ahai (soon) risen from the dead (curiously free of several inconvenient oaths), and a vengeful zombie with a band of ruthless bandits roaming the Riverlands, and a girl who (is probably gradually learning that she) controls the heart of the new lord of the Eyrie.

Sure, the castle is ******, but the pack ain't dead yet.

LoneWanderer said:

+1... FTW.

Thecheese said:

Stealthing or kneeling Selmy might hurt you're strategy a little, too.