Since this has been quite an issue lately, I have decided to add my view, as I have been playing the scenario some deal. Mostly solo with a Rohan-theme deck. I won on my first atempt thinking it was all due to Sneaky Gandalf opening hand. Throughout the games I have strengthen the belief that the opening hand - and first few encounter/shadow cards - are the most important things to win. However, I have realized winning the scenario is not as desparate feat as I had originally thought.

Basically, I much require Dunedain Mark and/or Unexpected Courage to be attached to Dunhere very early. I often mulligan for these. Sometimes I mulligan more than once, counting it as a loss whenever I do. I rather start with good odds and experience an interesting challenge than a sound thrashing.

The deck starts on 25 threat. The idea is to get rid of the Wolves before I reach 27. With the Mark, I get rid of them on round 1 if I do not get a nasty encounter. The Captain is bad, but if I discard I can still hang on 26, Ruins are worse and I can usually do nothing against them. The deck is Spirit/Leadership plus Gandalf. Rohan allies (only + the Grey Wanderer, no Tracker), Sacrifice, Tomb, Mathom, that kind of thing. The Horses could take care of the Ruins. Scout can handle the Wolves.

I do not want to call myself a genius strategist but I was very positively surprised how well the deck performs once it gets going. I like the scenario for the threatening finale. But in all my games, all of them, when I hit the last stage I won the game, often destroying the Witch-king as I try to collect 2 Sneaks and a Gandalf over the course of the game, and then play him three times in final two rounds to hit the giant Threat for 12.

I have almost abandoned Dunhere throughout these months of game-playing. I played him from the start but then he seemed less and less valuable in some of the quests (and decks). He really benefits greatly from a proper deck-building. He will not be a major force in Dol Guldur, likely, but in Osgiliath he really tends to take the reins. Even in a 2 player game, when he's got the Courage and Mark, he hits two biggies for big in a round. In coop though, the second deck has to be low-threat as well, to make him effective.

Ancient Mathom and Dwarven Tomb is a great combo. Especially in a Rohan deck that benefits from the Horses, Scout and Ride to Ruin. Stand and Fight helps to cycle, recycle this train.

I've only attempted it twice so far. In solo I used a pure Spirit deck and breezed it easily though I think I was lucky in what the encounter deck through out. Then a two player game I used a Spirit/Leadership deck but we failed to get off the first stage due to the number of enemies we drew. I think it's a tough quest but so far it seems doable when solo.

@lleimmoen

I think you are robbing yourself. Basically what you have said in all of this is, "If I have the perfect draw I have a better than decent chance of winning." I think most of us who play "Seriously", like the event deck is your mortal enemy, can say this same thing. It is what your deck can do with a not so good draw that really counts IMO. That is the measure of Osgiliath. If you can win better than average odds with less than ideal draws then you know you have a good deck.

lleimmoen said:

So, you basically just continue to restart the game over and over until you get your "ideal" hand, then in a back-handed kind of way call yourself a "genius strategist" because you win every game when reaching the last stage (using multiple sneak attacks with Gandalf nonetheless...) I mean, you might as well just not draw/mulligan at all, just put whatever cards you want in your starting hand and win every time...seems like a very fun and challenging way to approach the game.

You are really missreading this, if you're even trying to read it at all. I said sometimes I mulligan more than once, meaning I lose a game early on. I think I've done this about once or twice in ten games, meaning not executing the game to its fullest extent in about 15% of cases.

Are you two trying to say that you never give up even though you know you're gonna lose. Ok, then good for you. I do because I don't take the game so seriously that I'd have to suffer through all the thrashing.

"I mean, you might as well just not draw/mulligan at all, just put whatever cards you want in your starting hand and win every time...seems like a very fun and challenging way to approach the game."

Are you really serious about this, actually? I am certainly having fun playing it and I am not cheating. So what exactly is your problem? I was looking forward to some discussion about the game/scenario, I did't expect to get mocking because of that.

Dwnhmcntryboy said:

This I understand. I am yet to see a deck that could beat Osgiliath every time. Or anything close to that. Can you provide such? I think the initial idea is that Osgiliath will be challenging, Level 9 is supposed to be tough. Then, you're saying one is supposed to win against it with a bad draw and unfavourable encounters? I am really wishing to see such a deck. Moreso, I do not deckbuild with a particual quest in mind, that I actually find not fun at all.

lleimmoen said:

I'm not saying that I've never thrown in the towel when a loss is iminent, but I've definitely never quit after an opening hand. I mean, if your deck relies almost exclusively on a particular card, or combination of cards, in your opening hand to win, then in my opinion it is a poorly constructed deck. Either that, or maybe you should try playing it out in hopes of getting those cards that you need. Granted, there are certain cards that you may need to beat a particular quest, but I think it's kind of silly to just continue using mulligans in order to get said cards. I just feel its a poor approach to the game.

This is just my opinion on the way you are approaching the game. You are free to feel differently, I just dont find it to be a very challenging or interesting way to play, that's all.

@ lleimmoen

I am sorry you misunderstood me. I have no problem with you. I just commented that you are robbing yourself of valuable experience buy just doing a muligan when things weren't ideal as your post implied. Personally I don't see how in good judgment you can mulligan and chalk it up to a loss to restart with a new hand. I propose you would have a better compass for your deck if you only mulligan once.

Of course I have thrown in the towel on the turn I am going to lose but only when it was obvious I was going to lose via threat or hero death never on the first hand.

xBeakeRx said, "Granted, there are certain cards that you may need to beat a partIicular quest"....

I don't know about ever needing a single card to win. There are situations where the right card at the right time would have turn the game but no card is ever needed especially so bad that you have to mulligan 3 times. I think he was also a bit harsh on you but then when I am not medicated or drunk I can be harsh too. In this case I was not trying to be critical of you.

lleimmoen said, "This I understand. I am yet to see a deck that could beat Osgiliath every time. Or anything close to that. Can you provide such? I think the initial idea is that Osgiliath will be challenging, Level 9 is supposed to be tough. Then, you're saying one is supposed to win against it with a bad draw and unfavourable encounters? I am really wishing to see such a deck. Moreso, I do not deckbuild with a particual quest in mind, that I actually find not fun at all."

I understand you got your panties in a bunch at the prospect of being jumped on so I will let this slide, after all you perceived an attack. No deck out there is perfect. NONE I don't care what Glarrung says..Friendly stab.. I am saying that if you play, not as you described, and can break 50-50 on lvl 5 or higher you have a **** good deck. Osgiliath is a pain in everybodys ass and I have yet to beat it solo but come **** close every time in 2 player. We have played it 20+ times. We play every Tuesday 3-4 times a night and then move on before the headaches fully entrench.

I feel that when you post a subject such as this one you would expect to get SOME heat from avid players or else you are doing it just for the drama. If the former is true than take all of this for what it is...opinions and unfounded judgments upon you, your play style and firstborn.

Dwnhmcntryboy said:

Try these combination of Decks for 2players:

Tactics/Leadership

Heroes

· Gimli

· Brand son of Bain

· Theodred

Allies (22)

· Beorn (x1)

· Descendant of Thorondor (x3)

· Faramir (x2)

· Gandalf (x3)

· Gondorian Spearman (x3)

· Landroval (x1)

· Radagast (x1)

· Snowbourn Scout (x3

· Veteran Axehand (x2)

· Winged Guardian (x3)

Events (11)

· Feint (x3)

· Quick Strike (x3)

· Sneak Attack (x3)

· Swift Strike (x2)

Attachments (17)

· Celebrian's Stone (x2)

· Citadel Plate (x3)

· Dunedain Mark (x3)

· Dunedain Warning (x3)

· Horn of Gondor (x2)

· Song of Kings (x1)

· Steward of Gondor (x2)

Spirit/Lore

Heroes

• Eleanor
• Eowyn
• Beravor

Allys (22)

• Lorien Guide x3
• Northern tracker x3
• The Riddermark's Finest x3
• Daughter of the Nimrodel x3
• Gildor Inglorion x1
• Gleowine x2
• Henamarth Riversong x2
• Haldir of Lorien x1
• Miner of the Iron Hills x2
• Gandalf x2

Events (19)

• A Test of Will x3
• Dwarven Tomb x3
• Fortune or Fate x1
• Hasty Stroke x3
• The Galadhrim's Greeting x3
• Will of the West x1
• Stand and Fight x3
• Lore of Imladris x2

Attachments ( 9 )

• Unexpected Courage x3
• A Burning Brand x2
• Protector of Lorien x2
• Song of Wisdom x2

These Decks are close to perfection and can beat any scenario (including Nightmare mode).

trick is to let the Tactics/leadership Deck go first quest for 7-8, 1st player draw a Wolves From Mordor and let 2nd player pass (so 2nd wolves will go to 1st player as well). Me and Glaurung have played them against MaO more than 10 times and did not lose even a single time, yet. I dont say you can win 100% (i dont think there is a deck that can handle drawing 2 more wolves on the 1st round and then 1-2 captains on the 2nd ), but you will be close to it. BTW the Spirit/lore deck can beat MaO solo for more than 50% (I would guess 70% and above but didn't try it that many times to be certain) as well.

Dwnhmcntryboy said:

I am also sorry that I did not make myself clearer upon the stupid mulligan point. I've done so much more in the beginning of this Osgiliath experience to find out what strategies are good here, what cards are more essential than others, what combos are required to deal with certain situations. That helped me learn and understand quite a few things whithout which knowledge I think I would not be able to be nearly as successful with the quest.

For instance, at first I had thought the obvious combo was Sneaky Gandalf, later I have found out many different combos to be more effective, especially in the beginning of the game.

I do not mind experiementing. Quite the opposite. I do not perceive games as sacred. When I am not feeling like finishing a game, I stop. However, I now see it may sound strange to stop after an opening hand. I just sometimes had a notion that I wanted to see a particular card interact with the encounters given. I didn't feel bad about it. That's why I wrote it down although I see some people pick a little detail and claim it as the main point.

I am very glad for your kind words and I am sorry if I myself acted heated toward your response, it was mostly to the other mr. It is far fetch to give up a hand or two, or to play with 6 cards you choose. Even though that can also help you learn. And I doubt very much that the person would do perfectly well against the deck even if he chose 6 (different) cards of his liking.

Border line, I think I have a jolly good deck for Osgiliath. As I said I did not build it with Osgiliath in mind but it does well against it. Out of the ten tries, I think I can beat it more often than I lose to it (nevermind the double-mulligan, after this discussion I will have ceased this altogether, haha). That is what made me excited enough to post a bit of a strategy behind it. Because at first I had thought I might beat it once in a long while. I am sorry the strategy got kinda lost in the translation. I can see losing to Rhosgobel almost every time with it, so I do not call this a magic deck. I would like to have a deck that works for each quest and I think I could build something like that but I began to enjoy most the thematic decks, like this is being all Rohan pretty much.

Enjoy!

@OP:

Interesting that you don't play the Tracker. I considered it when building my latest Spirit/Leadership deck, seeing how strong the whole Rohan theme has now become. But I just couldn't bring myself to drop the Trackers for one more Mustering the Rohirrim or Riddermark's Finest. In any of your Osgiliath games, have you ever thought, hmm I wish I had a Tracker in play? Or did Ride to Ruin, Escort from Edoras and Riddermark's Finest deal with locations well enough to not miss them?

Have only played Osgiliath twice so far as I prefer the Mirkwood cycle for now, but I was definitely thinking along Rohan deck lines for it.

ClydeCloggie said:

Spot on. Northern Tracker shines in Osgiliath. I have begun to think that he is not as great as he used to be in the core set scenarios or Hunt for Gollum but in Osgiliath he really helps a great time - I played him in a different deck a few times.

However, I was really tempted to have Rohan allies only, plus Gandalf. And as I said, I did not deckbuild for this quest only. Tracker would certainly help things out some deal but the Horses, Snowbourn Scout and Ride to Ruin are also very effective against the locations you cannot travel to, or that pop up in staging for a threat of 4.

The Escort is also great to boost questing, I use Musterring the Rohirrim, Stand and Fight and Dwarven Tomb to get him out more often.

My group won a 3-player Osgiliath scenario last night... which is why I found and posted in this thread!


In regard to the original post (OP), I can see how Dunhere would be key in 1-player, but not really an option in 3-player.
I drew Gandalf, Sneak Attack, Ever Vigilant in my opening hand and play with two Leadership heroes. My team mate also drew Gandalf, Sneak Attack.

We started on 29 threat each and removed 3+ Wolves From Mordor and 2-3 Snaga Scout from staging and engagement, first turn.
I believe we had two Wainrider Captains in staging but were able to use Gandalf and optional engagements to defeat enemies in steps/multiple turns so that we were careful not to reach 2A of the quest deck.

From here we had a number of allies and had basically built-up enough that weren't re-playing turn 1 over again.

- We used Protector of Lorien and Eowyn to complete 2B on the turn that we first quested against it. (ie. one turn)

- Two players each discarded a Ranger of Ithilien while the third player quested with no characters, instead using Gleowine and Beravor two draw three cards and use them with Protector of Lorien.
We completed 3B on the turn that we first quested against it.

- At this point we faced the Witch-king, Denethor absorbing the blow, and kept him in the engagement area of the player with the lowest threat.
We then quested with ABSOLUTELY everything and drew/tried not to play so that we could maximise Protector of Lorien, winning the game.




We potentially had a lucky draw in the last quest phase. On the flip side, we had just re-shuffled the encounter deck at this point.
Obviously Gandalf four times in the opening turns was huge, like Dunhere, allowing damage to be applied to enemies without engaging to defend.
We basically flew threw the quest as quick as we could but also pretty quick by any game standards, in my mind.




OTHER NOTES:

- we had two Morgulduin in the staging area for the majority of the game. We had some wounds on characters in the first turn, leaving them with 1-2 hit points. They were later healed, healing only really saving one character during combat.
I don't know if i'd say healing was as important as I had previously thought.


- Cut Off seemed to carve us up!
I discarded four allies (out of five cards) the turn I played Daughter of Nimrodel. We faced Cut Off as a shadow effect undefended as well as defended, and cancelled the when revealed effect at least once.
This card makes me want to increase the proportion of allies in a deck, for this scenario.

- Uruk Vanguard and The Witch-king seem like the only enemies that are just a bit too big, given everything else that's going on in this scenario.
I guess that should give some peace of mind when facing the remaining enemies.

- Beravor and Denethor died, Landroval bringing Denethor back, on the second to last turn. Possibly not a game changing play. Beravor wasn't totally missed thanks to Song of Wisdom first turn.

- We played no location hate cards. Northern Tracker was packed in an Aragorn song deck containing no spirit heroes, but was not played. I believe we only travelled to Emyn Arnen Overlook.

- HEROES were...

Aragorn, Gloin, Denethor
Boromir, Thalin, Eowyn
Prince Imrahil, Theodred, Beravor

- Imrahil and Boromir readied a reasonable amount. They were definitely good. Imrahil some times didn't do much with his ready because of how enemies were assigned. We had no ranged heroes.

- Gloin had little impact beyond stats, his ability not really being used.

- We had spirit cards in the Aragorn deck and Eowyn deck. We could cancel some things and played Unexpected Courage, but weren't held back by spirit's weakness in combat.



Again, we completed the last three stages in three turns, so losing Beravor for example wasn't a huge deal as she'd been used to the near-max as it was. We probably finished with 4-5 locations in staging.



@ Kobby

Your Leadership/Tactics deck has 15/50 cards that cost four or more. That seems a touch steep with all the other cards plays like Sneak Attack and Feint being a priority as well.
I understand that some times you need to 'even out the draw' by having plenty of high cost cards for times when you seem to just build resources with no way to use them.
In Osgiliath, I feel you need a large amount of allies because of Cut Off. An early ally can also remove Wolves from Mordor.

I wonder if The Galadhrim's Greeting is maybe too expensive in Osgiliath. With all the doomed and cards that add doomed, I wonder if you're paying for something that just holds threat back for a short while rather than reducing your threat for multiple turns.

My group's decks were far from perfection, but possibly played to perfection!
I'm interested to see if we can do it again on a different draw and see if our combat version or the spirit version you have works better. (Generally spirit seems to be the dominant sphere in the LotR LCG right now!)



Thanks for reading.

Congrats!

I have never done Osgiliath with 3 players but I had thought it would be nearing impossibility as I noticed how much harder it is to beat with 2 players than solo. I can honestly say I am beating it with the above deck (clearly) more than I lose to it but in a coop we struggle to win once in five attempts. And I feel it gets worse.

You're totally right about Dunhere. He can be great but he needs a total commitment, I mean in a coop, he would need the other deck to compliment him as well. Perhaps I shall do such a deck just to prove he's worth it in a coop, too. Here, in solo games, he really rocks, at least in the beginning, if I don't get Rangers I let him guard the crossing at the river, the finale is doable with Eowyn and Theodred.

Again, well done doing this 3-playered. Boromir and Imrahil might really shine in this one, if the company survives the opening. Those first two rounds are (as often) quite crucial, I feel.

[edit] Have you had Dunedain Cache? I think it is a card to have in such cases. The Gondorians would benefit greatly from it.

I would be interested to see your 3 player deck you used. I have not had the opurtunity to play 3 player, but would like a nice deck combo in storage for when/if I ge tteh chance to suck a new player into teh game!! havn't see nmany 3 player decks posted at all.

@ Ileimmoen

In regard to Dunhere, I have played him in a 3+ player game where I was using at least Dunhere, Thalin... the third hero may have been leadership, or at least someone in our group was leadership. I had Dunhere at 7+ attack at one point, destroying enemies in the staging area, however, he has problems...

(No doubt you'd be aware of these... I don't know the answer is more my point.)

- in multi-player games you're team mates are going to have varying threat levels and draw out enemies you'd probably rather leave in staging.
- on the flip side, there are more cards coming up, so more chance you're going to see higher threat level enemies.

- you need to be able to pass and get other players to optionally assign enemies that you would otherwise face. This isn't exactly cool on your teams part, and sometimes it can mean they are getting nowhere, defending constantly with no attacking back.
- Wandering Took can really help here as you can provide a warm body for a team mate who's taking your attack while also making assignment easier.

- some times its kind of hard to decide what to do with him. Should I quest because he may not have an attack option? If i'm not taking enemies because of Dunhere, what do my other heroes do in regard to attacking, etc.


I really like him as I feel somewhat bored with spirit as they don't seem to have much teeth, but also, I don't want to be the puppet master type playing all the time, jumping in with cancel, etc.
He needs a lot of focus. Fortunately, he could just generally fit into a Rohan deck regardless of his ability. He would be great to move an enemy that has been attacked back into staging, with A Light in the Dark, and have Dunhere finish him off but I think the FAQ mentions that each enemy can be attacked once, not once per player's engagement area.



The above is somewhat off topic, however, knowing what enemies are going to pop-up in Osgiliath does help Dunhere. I think he could work well with an early Gondorian Spearman.



@ booored

We didn't build cohesive decks. Outside of not doubling up on heroes, we don't confer about anything in advance.
When making choices to play cards though, we do attach Unexpected Courage, Protector of Lorien, etc, to the best choice on the table. (Even Steward of Gondor at times.)



My deck was;

Prince Imrahil
Beravor
Theodred


3 Common Cause (Imrahil readies Beravor)
3 Campfire Tales
3 Ever Vigilant (ready Gleowine)
3 Sneak Attack (Gandalf, draw 3)
3 Valiant Sacrifice
3 Gleowine
2 Gandalf's Search (can always draw 1)

3 Keen-eyed Took (not sure if REALLY helps drawing, but there to activate Imrahil and Valiant Sacrifice too)

2 Protector of Lorien (can arguably not send Beravor questing, then use her to draw and add two to Protector to effectively quest after the fact)

3 Gandalf

23 other cards, mostly a toolbox approach.

Sometimes you can draw and/or have 12 cards in your hand which can destroy 3B for some quests when combined with Protector of Lorien.

You can occasionally dig for cards like healing when the game turns sour, or Sneak Attack combos, Landroval being a favourite as a way of healing as well as pretty handy through Osgiliath.

I had planned on using Keen-eyed Took with Erebor Hammersmith but I soon realised that if you don't play and return Keen-eyed Took on the same turn, you have no idea what you're next card is!
That being said, the Took was played when I was the first player, allowing another player to see they had a Gondorian Spearmen as their next draw, Beravor giving them that card and allowing them to play it in the Planning phase, killing a Wolves from Mordor!


I had a different version using Unexpected Courage and Westfold Horse-breaker, but found that leadership resources were a bit scarce.
Sneak Attack, Gandalf, Ever Vigilant/Valiant Sacrifice being the main leadership combo.

Thanks for the discussion. Your points are very valid. I would love to combine the Rohan deck with an Eagle deck that deals with the staging area, based around Descendant of Thorondor (and even Beorning Beekeeper perhaps). I have tried Thalin only once or twice and never liked it.

I know it was not me who was asked but I can provide heroes of the three decks that perform quite well against the Shadows of Mirkwood cycle. But have not tried Osgiliath like that.

Rohan Deck: Dunhere, Eowyn, Theodred (obviously)

Northern Deck: Glorfindel, Beravor, Frodo Baggins

Gondor Deck: Boromir, Eleanor, Prince Imrahil (quite fun but low on questing)

The first two quest well, can draw and get rid of locations, the third fights well and boosts resources, and can help others questing with Faramir.