Does the Surge keyword on a creature encounter card that was revealed during Staging resolves if Thalin is questing and so, deals 1 damage to that creature and kills it? Same for Doom, etc.
Questing Thalin and cards with Surge, Doom, etc
ppsantos said:
Does the Surge keyword on a creature encounter card that was revealed during Staging resolves if Thalin is questing and so, deals 1 damage to that creature and kills it? Same for Doom, etc.
I would say that they do resolve because if you look at the rule book page on 24 under the heading Keywords, it says that both Doomed and Surge are resolved if the cards bearing them are revealed. Thalin's ability also resolves as they are revealed. Therefore becuase the encounter card has to be revealed in order for Thalin's ability to resolve, The keywords also must resolve because the card has been revealed.
Seriously, FAQ, page 1:
"Thalin CORE 6
When an enemy card is revealed from the encounter
deck, Thalin’s ability resolves before any keyword or
“When Revealed” card effects on the encounter card."
Sadly, there is currently only the Eastern Crows for Thalin to take out, but killing them before they surge can be very nice.
Oops! my Bad... I stand corrected. 
Thalin's ability fires off before the surge or doom does. If the enemy dies, the surge or doom does not trigger.
I would like to humbly retract my previous statement.
The official FAQ says:
"When an enemy card is revealed from the encounter deck, Thalin's ability resolves before any keyword or when revealed card effects on the encounter card".
I take this to mean that Thalin's ability resolves before any keyword or when revealed effect resolves, It does not say that Thalin's ability resolves before any keyword or when revealded effect triggers.
Therefore I interpret the process to occur like this:
1. Eastern Crows is revealed from the encounter deck and surge triggers, simultaneously with Thalin's ability.
2. Thalin's ability resolves, killing the crows.
3. Surge resolves.
silverhand77 said:
I would like to humbly retract my previous statement.
The official FAQ says:
"When an enemy card is revealed from the encounter deck, Thalin's ability resolves before any keyword or when revealed card effects on the encounter card".
I take this to mean that Thalin's ability resolves before any keyword or when revealed effect resolves, It does not say that Thalin's ability resolves before any keyword or when revealded effect triggers.
Therefore I interpret the process to occur like this:
1. Eastern Crows is revealed from the encounter deck and surge triggers, simultaneously with Thalin's ability.
2. Thalin's ability resolves, killing the crows.
3. Surge resolves.
May I ask what, if anything you think the Original Purpous was of that FAQ statement?
If, the Prupous was to have the Effects in question actually HAPPEN, wouldn't it have been easier to just say that Thalins ability resolves AFTER the Effects in question?
I'm just saying, I think FFG actually have more sense than trying to explain something backwards to us in an FAQ.
(ps. that Actually means alot comming from me, since I normally don't give much credit to FFG FAQ's in general.)
/wolf
silverhand77 said:
I would like to humbly retract my previous statement.
The official FAQ says:
"When an enemy card is revealed from the encounter deck, Thalin's ability resolves before any keyword or when revealed card effects on the encounter card".
I take this to mean that Thalin's ability resolves before any keyword or when revealed effect resolves, It does not say that Thalin's ability resolves before any keyword or when revealded effect triggers.
Therefore I interpret the process to occur like this:
1. Eastern Crows is revealed from the encounter deck and surge triggers, simultaneously with Thalin's ability.
2. Thalin's ability resolves, killing the crows.
3. Surge resolves.
Zed's dead baby
Which means( if you are not a pulp fiction fan) The crows are dead, the card is gone, there is no surge, baby
GhostWolf69 said:
silverhand77 said:
I would like to humbly retract my previous statement.
The official FAQ says:
"When an enemy card is revealed from the encounter deck, Thalin's ability resolves before any keyword or when revealed card effects on the encounter card".
I take this to mean that Thalin's ability resolves before any keyword or when revealed effect resolves, It does not say that Thalin's ability resolves before any keyword or when revealded effect triggers.
Therefore I interpret the process to occur like this:
1. Eastern Crows is revealed from the encounter deck and surge triggers, simultaneously with Thalin's ability.
2. Thalin's ability resolves, killing the crows.
3. Surge resolves.
May I ask what, if anything you think the Original Purpous was of that FAQ statement?
If, the Prupous was to have the Effects in question actually HAPPEN, wouldn't it have been easier to just say that Thalins ability resolves AFTER the Effects in question?
I'm just saying, I think FFG actually have more sense than trying to explain something backwards to us in an FAQ.
(ps. that Actually means alot comming from me, since I normally don't give much credit to FFG FAQ's in general.)
/wolf
Personally, I think that FFG's purpose was to clarify the sequence of events, and in my opinion they should have worded this FAQ better. Effects do no t just resolve, they have to trigger first. and as discussed in other threads, there doesn't seem to be any ruling on when keywords actually trigger, only when they resolve. Also there doesn't seem to be a rule aroung what happens to an effect when the card bearing it is discarded. does it contiinue or fizzle? I think it continues.
Troymk1 said:
Zed's dead baby
Which means( if you are not a pulp fiction fan) The crows are dead, the card is gone, there is no surge, baby
+1
And for those who don't know. The quote could (should?) have been, "Theoden's dead baby".
silverhand77 said:
/.../Effects do no t just resolve, they have to trigger first. and as discussed in other threads, there doesn't seem to be any ruling on when keywords actually trigger, only when they resolve. Also there doesn't seem to be a rule aroung [sic] what happens to an effect when the card bearing it is discarded. does it contiinue or fizzle? I think it continues.
Ok friend, here's a pickle for you.
Can you please explain, by applying the logic you are trying to conjure here, the Actual Effect of cards such as:
"Hasty Strike
Response: Cancel a shadow effect just triggered during Combat."
or
"A Test of Will
Response: Cancel the "when revealed effects" of a card that was just revealed from the Encounter deck."
Because it seems to me that applying your logic, will make these card completely useless, according to you they have already Triggered, and will there fore resolve no matter what happens.
Let's face it. You're wrong about this. And I'm done talking here.
/wolf
GhostWolf69 said:
silverhand77 said:
/.../Effects do no t just resolve, they have to trigger first. and as discussed in other threads, there doesn't seem to be any ruling on when keywords actually trigger, only when they resolve. Also there doesn't seem to be a rule aroung [sic] what happens to an effect when the card bearing it is discarded. does it contiinue or fizzle? I think it continues.
Ok friend, here's a pickle for you.
Can you please explain, by applying the logic you are trying to conjure here, the Actual Effect of cards such as:
"Hasty Strike
Response: Cancel a shadow effect just triggered during Combat."
or
"A Test of Will
Response: Cancel the "when revealed effects" of a card that was just revealed from the Encounter deck."
Because it seems to me that applying your logic, will make these card completely useless, according to you they have already Triggered, and will there fore resolve no matter what happens.
Let's face it. You're wrong about this. And I'm done talking here.
/wolf
Ok, it works like this:
1. A shadow card is revealed.
2 the shadow card triggers
3. Before the shadow card resolves, Hasty strike is played.
4 Hasty strike resolves, cancelling the shadow effect before it has a chance to resolve.
Because there is nothing more to the shadow card, nothing else happens. However there are three parts to a card like Eastern Crows, there is the creature, the keyword and the ability. By my logic I am viewing the three parts as separate yet interdependant. All are valid parts of the card, but they don't all just trigger and resolve at the same time. On page 2 of the official FAQ says that Surge, doomed and guarded keywords should be resolved any time the card on which they occur enters play, including during set up. I take this to mean that they resolve immediately the card is revealed, which implies that they also trigger immediately since they have to trigger in order to resolve. The Forced effect on Eastern crows triggers when it is defeated. So you see there is a sequence by which these things occur.