Avoiding a Navigator’s Gaze

By Ki_Ryn, in Rogue Trader Rules Questions

Posted at

Just ran our first session of Rogue Trader and suffered two PC casualties because the PS Navigator used his (Adept level) Lidless Stare in a melee. The book has the following:

The Lidless Stare will affect anyone, friend or foe, that looks
into the Navigator’s third eye when this power is activated.
This has an effective range of 15m (reduced to 5m in fog or
mist) and has no effect on unliving targets, Untouchables, and
daemons or other entities from the Warp. Those forewarned
can look away, though even then being within line of sight of
a Navigator is dangerous. The power of his eye is persuasive,
and looking away only grants them +30 on their rolls to
resist its power. Those who are unaware of the Navigator’s
presence gain this bonus as well.

My question is whether "line" of sight takes facing into account. I would think that if someone is back to back with the Navigator, then they don't have a chance of being affected (neither is looking at the other). Is that right, or is there no accounting for facing at all?

If facing does matter, then what about someone with the Navigator standing behind them looking "over thier shoulder" so to speak. Is that a 0% chance of being effected, just the +30 mentioned above, or something in between?

When someone is in melee with just a single foe, it's clear which direction they would be facing. In other situations it is not clear. Is there an official stance on facing? We're using miniatures so it would not be too hard to tell roughly which direction someone is looking (more or less).

Posted at

The rule is fairly clear.

1) Those in front of the Navigator and in the cone are the only ones effected (whether they are looking at the navigator or not).

If you're not using a map this may be a bit more confusing during times of combat, but you said you where using miniatures and thus I am assuming you're using a grid as well so facing shouldn't ever be an issue. If they are engaged with an enemy in melee then of course they are looking towards that enemy as looking away would mean a sword in the back (which should translate to an attack of opportunity if they turn to say, shoot someone or something of the sort as any non-braindead foe would take the chance to run someone that braizen through). In the case of multiple foes it would be whichever they attacked (or defended against such as a parry) last in my opinion as that is who they had to face to strike.

2) If you're looking over the Navigators shoulder (assuming you're behind them and not doing like a hug motion) then no, you are not effected. If for any reason you are not facing the navigator but are still in the cone then you gain +30 to resist.

Posted at

I guess I missed that. What page are you referencing?

Posted at

Not suer which part of my comment you're refering to. If you mean how to determine which way a person is facing there isn't any such reference, just common sense that a person would be facing where they last turned their head based off their most recent actions during combat (after all if you just swung a sword at someone, parried their strike, shot at them, etc, common sense would say you'd be looking at them and thus that would be your facing).

As for the lidless stare cone and how you have to be in it to be effected or how if you're not facing the navigator you get the +30 resist that would be in the power itself. (in fact you even quoted those rules)

Posted at

Ki_Ryn said:

Just ran our first session of Rogue Trader and suffered two PC casualties because the PS Navigator used his (Adept level) Lidless Stare in a melee. The book has the following:

The Lidless Stare will affect anyone, friend or foe, that looks
into the Navigator’s third eye when this power is activated.
This has an effective range of 15m (reduced to 5m in fog or
mist) and has no effect on unliving targets, Untouchables, and
daemons or other entities from the Warp. Those forewarned
can look away, though even then being within line of sight of
a Navigator is dangerous. The power of his eye is persuasive,
and looking away only grants them +30 on their rolls to
resist its power. Those who are unaware of the Navigator’s
presence gain this bonus as well.

My question is whether "line" of sight takes facing into account. I would think that if someone is back to back with the Navigator, then they don't have a chance of being affected (neither is looking at the other). Is that right, or is there no accounting for facing at all?

If facing does matter, then what about someone with the Navigator standing behind them looking "over thier shoulder" so to speak. Is that a 0% chance of being effected, just the +30 mentioned above, or something in between?

When someone is in melee with just a single foe, it's clear which direction they would be facing. In other situations it is not clear. Is there an official stance on facing? We're using miniatures so it would not be too hard to tell roughly which direction someone is looking (more or less).

The Lidless Stare is pretty rough, I've avoided using it for that reason. An omnidirectional 15 meter radius blast is almost certainly going to hit allies.. and they will be unhappy to have it happen!

I think that a GM would be well within their rights to say that only the front 180 degrees or so are covered, but as the rules for the game dont specify this it seems that it goes in all directions by the RAW. Considering what it is and how powerful it is I'd say that going in every direction is actually a 'balancing' factor, oddly enough.

Having a signal for the party when it is being used is very important if the navigator wants to use it. Getting some sort of sanctified armor or maybe some gellar field like runes (all houseruled as far as I can tell) that would count against the damage would be a huge step in the right direction for wanting to use it often.

Posted at

On the subject of targeting people, what happens if someone looks into a mirror that the eye is reflected in? Or does the mirror just instantly break and rebel at the breach of reality?

Posted at

I'm fairly certain it's not a burst but a cone as it implies the Navigator needs to see the target. As for the mirror situation... umm... I guess it would reflect. Depends on if the GM thinks the energy would "physically" harm things and just shatter the mirror or not.

Posted at

Nerdynick said:

On the subject of targeting people, what happens if someone looks into a mirror that the eye is reflected in? Or does the mirror just instantly break and rebel at the breach of reality?

The stare doesn't do anything to objects. It doesn't really leap out anywhere, people look into it for a moment and that moment is enough to kill.

The reflection is likely a gm call though. If the person is within 15 meters but behind a wall or something with a mirror going around the corner.. well.. a gm could rule either way and not be going against any raw that I can see.

Posted at

Coldshard said:

The Lidless Stare is pretty rough, I've avoided using it for that reason. An omnidirectional 15 meter radius blast is almost certainly going to hit allies.. and they will be unhappy to have it happen!

I think that a GM would be well within their rights to say that only the front 180 degrees or so are covered, but as the rules for the game dont specify this it seems that it goes in all directions by the RAW. Considering what it is and how powerful it is I'd say that going in every direction is actually a 'balancing' factor, oddly enough.

There has already been an official statement on this, from one of the FFG staff. (Stewart, if I'm remembering correctly.) The Navigator's gaze is the front 180 degrees. This was months ago, and I don't feel like digging all the way through the forum archives, so kindly excuse the lack of link.

Cheers,

- V.