Staton said:

How can you QFT when he basically blows up your entire complaint about the restricted list and the way FFG is approaching it.

He is saying print more tier 1 and you at least seem to want them to print none or take all of them off the restricted list.

I get you wanting to have a discussion but there is something about the way you frame the entire debate that just doesn't sit well with me. I'm not sure what it is, and I freely admit that it may be me and my own bias because I think the list is brilliant and I think it is a far more elegant solution to rotating cards.

Perhaps it is the implicit sentiment that you know better how this list should be used than the people who made the game and manage it when literally hundreds of other CCGs have failed, and this game is the strongest it has been in years, and the restriction list by all accounts seems to be doing an absolutely marvelous job of keeping things balanced without having to add to the banned list or printing dozens of silver bullets.

If you really want to take an unbiased look at the game and the banned, errata'd, and restricted cards, lets compare the lists over the last four years to M:tG and see how the two compare, knowing how much larger and imbalanced the CCG environment is compared to the LCG environment and size of the design/development/playtest teams. Is this really a problem or is it that you just don't like it?

Not liking it is perfectly fair, but if FFG is even in the same ballpark as WotC I think it seriously undermines most of your assumptions, and really just boils the entire thing down to personal preference.

Well first of all you probably don't like the way I construct my arguments because I generally present them from a presumed superior stance. Also I'm a bit of an arrogant *******, but meh. That's just me.

Now I never said I wanted them to print no tier 1 plots. I said that FFG should not use the restricted list to promote plot deck diversity, they should print more plots of a comparable power level, ie tier 1 plots. So his sentiment that you should print more tier 1 plots seems to be exactly what I was wanting. I'm not sure where exactly you think I said I wanted them to print no tier 1 plots or take them all off the restricted list, but if you can find a quote I'd like to see it. ~In the mean time I'll sit up here on my pedestal.

Also, because I just had a thought, I don't think there is a problem with the list. I love the list, and I have called it an extremely elegant solution to the problem of balancing a card game. What I've been trying to say is that A) I don't agree that the Fury plots should be on the restricted list and B) I don't want a card put on the restricted list merely due to it being in everyone's deck regardless of power level.

Staton said:

And a large, cuddly, hunk of a man. Don't ever forget it.

Have we met? lol I mean I know I like to cuddle, but I usually like to lose to someone first!

Staton said:

Sadly, I'm going to have to break it to Kennon that you do not listen the 2 Champs and a Chump podcast. He is going to be broken hearted that such a good friend as yourself doesn't listen to our incredibly insightful, humorous and time-wasting effort.

I don't have time because he makes me play City of Heroes!

Fear of Winter was the sword in the darkness, it was the watcher on the walls, the fire that burns against the cold, the light that brings the dawn, the horn that wokes the sleepers, and the shield that guarded the realms of men. It was not Robb the boy, it was the Kraken, son of salt and sea wind. It paid the iron price. It was the meat and potatoes of the midwest. The bane of darksbane and the "Non!" to Kennon. It dabbled over dabbler and brought death to deathjester. It fattened up the mouse. It was a cat of a different coat, thats all the truth I know.

I admit that most people talk about the restricted list without knowing what it is (beyond preventing them from including multiple items from the list in their tourney decks). To me, this is like listening to skydivers complain about why they need a secondary 'chute. (Most don't. 8D)

That said, I have only two related comments to the RL. First, there's been three months of complaints regarding Venomous Blade, and the complaints continued even after it went to the RL. I say that if VB is painful to your deck, rework your strategy! I find a Targ-burn tactics infinitely harder to deal with than VB (for, hopefully, obvious reasons).

Second, I'd be curious to see what happens if certain cards were pulled off the RL, just to see if they'd immediately return to decks or if people would continue without them. Of course, there's really only a tiny few that I'd consider pulling from the RL... I suppose it's a mute point. dD

@Greg- Yup.... this revelation saddens me.

@Staton- And yet I never see you on!

@Mathais- BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. It is known. Or at least, my loathing of that card is known.

Mathias Fricot said:

+1.21 gigawatts

Also, would reducing Valar to 0 gold do anything for it's playability? What about giving it negative gold... (or a gold boost for your opponent)? Whoa, I'd never thought about the concept of a negative gold based plot before. My mind is awhirl, as Hedley would say.

Maester_LUke said:

What do you think of a plot thats like 6 gold, 0 initiative, and 2 claim, and your opponent counts 2 more gold in marshalling as the text.

Fieras said:

Hrmmm... compare that with Summoning Season in a joust... you and your opponent both net 6 gold, a character in hand, they'll have initiative and you'll have 1 more claim... interesting.

Its functionally a Retaliation!

+4 gold for you (since they net 2 as well)
claim 2
zero initiative, which is a little like going second, but worse since it might be advantageous for them to go second.

I would run it over Retaliation! for the chance at dropping another Frozen Outpost or Scouting Vessel.

Kennon said:

~Getting ready for prom season... (it never gets old)

~I'll be taking your wife to the prom this year Rings!

Mathias Fricot said:

Of course you would - there is really little downside, and in a high-draw, higher-cost deck it wins for sure. It woudl be power creep for sure (an auto-include, replaced by another auto-include - many people running both).

~And Stanton, please do! It woudl be quiet around the house for a change