I feel totally stupid asking this, so please forgive me. Also, I have a feeling that this must've been discussed before, but the Search function crapped out on me again.

So, what kind of effect is The King's Law?

Is it a lasting effect? Does Forgotten Plans help against it?

I guess that, yes, it must be a lasting effect, and no, Forgotten Plans doesn't help against it at all, because the effect of The King's Law triggers when the plot is revealed in the plot phase, and the fact that it is blanked at the time the effect is resolved doesn't change anything anymore.

Am I right? Oh Lord, I hope I'm not.

Seems like a simple passive effect to me, initiating in step 4 of the "end of phase" framework action window (of the Marshalling phase). So Forgotten Plans should help against it.

Yeah, I guess you're right. If Forgotten Plans doesn't help against The King's Law, it doesn't help against Battle of Oxcross or Valar Dohaeris either. If it was like I was thinking, the effect of King's Law would go off even if the plot had been changed in the meantime. Don't quite know what I was thinking there.

The important thing is, Forgotten Plans does help against TKL. Good.

Ratatoskr said:

A "lasting effect" is one that initiates at one point, but has effects that persist beyond the action window in which it does initiate.

A "passive effect" is one that initiates at a prescribed time whether you want it to or not.

So "The King's Law" clearly does not initiate until the end of the Marshaling phase. That makes it passive. If it were something like "When revealed, put a card into Shadows from your hand. Then, at the end of the marshaling phase, discard all cards in Shadows," you would have a lasting effect (from the "then" part of the passive "when revealed" effect).

My guess is that you were mixing up the mechanics for revealing a plot with the actual initiation of the plot's text. A lot of people do. For example, people tend to think that the "when revealed" text on plots is considered a triggered effect rather than a passive effect because you choose which plot to reveal. The trick, though, is that in choosing which plot to reveal (and revealing it) is the initiation/resolution of the "reveal plot" effect (whether framework or effect-generated like Bran). You are not initiating/resolving the text on the actual plot card when you reveal the plot. At least not directly.

My guess is that you were thinking the mere act of revealing "The King's Law" initiated the "at the end of Marshaling, discard all cards in Shadows" effect - which would have created the earlier "point of initiation" that is required for a lasting effect. But it does not. Getting to the end of the Marshaling phase is what initiates "The King's Law."

ktom said:

Yes, this is exactly what I was thinking there in a short moment of mental incapacity probably caused by lack of sleep. it is all totally clear now, and I feel duly embarrassed.

Move on, people. Nothing to see here.