My copy of the Inquisitor's Handbook seems to be updated with the errata 3.0 but I can not find the description of the Hellgun Capacitor Upgrade I only find that it says it is 50 thrones/full clip and that it is rare but not what the item itself does different then a regular lasgun ammo clip.

I believe that the hellgun capacitor is actually the required charge pack to even load the weapon. Hellguns don't load charge packs (and if they do, they specify how the ammunition capacity of the weapon is lowered).

Ok, but the primary questionis were is the description of the item? I can assume that it is a hellgun charge pack, but at the same time I can assume that it is an upgrade to the ammo type that would allow a hellgun to have a full charge on an ammo pack.

Well, I believe the intent with that is that it is actually the ammo listing, not an upgrade. It is showing the cost/rarity of a hellgun capacitor over a standard charge pack.

Also of note, is that hellgun capacitors are worn as backpacks. I do find it odd that it has no weight listed, but I always accounted that as being included in the hellgun itself.

The RT rulebook gives a weight of 10kg for their hellgun/pistol charge packs though they are of a different pattern so if you are looking for a weight there's one that should be fairly accurate. They provide power for the weapon's listed clip size. Though one would almost be better off getting a proper backpack charge pack I think as carrying around more than one of them if necessary will quickly add up.

The IH though just says that they are feed from the capacitor which is worn as a pack (and lists no weight as already mentioned) or powered via standard las clips at various reduced capacities.

could you do me a favor and give me a page reference for theIH book were it describes the capacitor as a backpack. I seem to have missed that in the errata and my copy of the Inquisitor's Handbook I need to for reference with my group. Thanks for the help.

Its not in the IH (or if it is, would fall under the description of the hellgun, not the capacitor).

The notion that hellgun capacitors are backpacks are a general 40k convention, and is seen and read about in tabletop, visible on the IG stormtrooper models, and covered in most of the fluff.

thanks, would it be strange or out of the question to think of hellgun capacitors as oversized charge packs.

Some patterns, such as the D'Laklu pattern from the forge world chapter of the IH, do actually allow chargepacks to be used (in which case it halves the ammo capacity of the weapon). Generally, I would say if it is not worn as a backpack (for an assumed reduction in weight), there should be an appropriate reduction in ammo capacity.

If you goal is to just not force it as a backpack, or to allow for a more "useful" ability to carry spare charge packs (while keeping the same weight issues), then I'm less certain. I would probably make it 3/4 to 4/5 ammo capacity, just simply to keep in the spirit of what the backpack is for, but to benefit the use of a heavier/bulkier charge pack.

got it, in my opinion take it for what it is the bakcpacks in the stormtrooper models and kasrkin are more then just the capacitors itself. I think the backpack is just the frame were the cartrige is held. I personally think of it as holding the equivalent of a car battery and running wires from it to the gun. When I say oversized charge pack is keep the weight and all that and shift the bulk from the back pack istelf and place it on the gun frame. It would still take the same stats as listed but just shift the looks and feel of the weapon. Worst case it could be considered a different pattern but mechanically identical to the rules. just my thoughts but I understand the point after taking the time to look at it.

I will ake on elast point on the backpack, like I said earlier I see the backpack as a frame or harness that carrys the charge pack or in this case capacitors. The capacitor is independent from the physical backpack itself what you do is if you have more then one capacitor is switch the wires from one to another unless you have the double ammo clip upgrade. This would be closer to what I think the GW models have with the large backpacks framing two capacitors and all the additional upgrades like the targetor cogitator and supplemental upgrades.

what do you guys think on this point.

I would look to the Ascension book for your last point. On page 145 they have the backpack/power pack option for weapons. It weighs 15kg and holds half the amount of weight that a standard backpack can carry (25kg down form 50kg). This is because "the other half is take up by ammo storage." That certainly falls into you last comment about the backpack being seperate from the energy cells. Considering that the other 25kg of storage could hold another back pack, I would assume you could just merge two without much trouble at the cost of all your storage. But...

The hellguns on page 136 state the small power packs that allow for the listed amount of standard ammo and recharge rates weight 10kg. So some poor planning or very little of the 15kg backpack weight is used on the frame work. 10kg gives you 30 shots while 15kg gives you 150 hellgun blasts. In the core book page 146, the standard just carry backpack weighs 1kg. We could do a price break down, but ascension lacks prices. Maybe they are denser storage packs.

It gets even stranger with the core Las Cannon which has two backpacks. With a total weight of 55kg, I wonder how much the back packs make up? They also state under the ascension back pack that heavy weapons would drain it in 1 shot. 2 double back packs would give 4 shots, so I guess they Las cannon sort of works out with 5.

As far as hellgun/pistols are concerned, the Voss-Pattern in Inquisitor's handbook (War Zones chapter) can utilize basic/pistol charge packs as well (but quarters the clip size down to 10 for basic and 5 for pistol) like the D'laku Crusade-Pattern, as has been mentioned, (from 40 down to 12). The Cadian-Pattern Hellgun/pistol cannot use basic/pistol charge packs due to it's refinements and specialization that force a reliance on backpack power supplies.

With heavy las weaponry, the ammo requirements are like going from a .75 caliber bolt to a 1.0 caliber bolt so you can't use one with the other. The heavy las weaponry power cells that are backpack-sized already (roughly 30kg each that's already calculated into the weapon's weight). I can't say I know of a man-portable multilaser, the man-portable anti-infantry/light vehicle weapon of choice for the imperial guard is an autocannon. It might have the same reasoning it being restricted to vehicle or terminator mounts like the assault cannon due to high recoil as well as that it can't use the same high-discharge MP Lascannon packs (which are basicly 5 separate packs linked together and one drained per shot). So it's relegated to being mounted and hard-wired to the vehicles internal power generators on a Chimera or a Sentinel Walker.

Sigismund said:

I understand the hellguns are different in ascension, but was commenting on the previous post about "switching the wires", the ammo being seperate from the back pack itself, and the ability for the back pack to carry additional gear (ie hellgun stuff).

Sigismund said:

I understand the las clips are different, but the particular backpack will actually power a MP lascannon for one shot as per the ascesion book. It is interesting you then go on to point out the MP lascannon actually has 5 backpacks that are each drained with one shot. Seems pretty similar to me except for the weight (5 x 15 verse 30kg total) and efficiency/energy density.

Are some of these descriptions from the minatures game? I play warhammer fantasy but have only used my friends 40k figures a few times for a battle. I checked both rogue trader and dark heresy descriptions of the MP lascannon and did not find backpack weights anywhere. Currently looking to build one in game. Possibly build a unified power supply for the hellgun backpack and MP laser using the whole 25kg of additional capacity and GM allowed higher quality effects for things that don't have a listed effect. I see alot of comments on the forum about minatures crossover info and just want to make sure I am not missing something from the RP books.

Well, the large packs in the Dark Heresy books state one "heavy charge pack" for an MP Lascannon is good for 5 shots and tabletop says that an MP lascannon eats a whole one per shot. It's an attempt at rationalizing it in that the "large charge pack" (roughly 30kg weight) for Dark Heresy is rather 5 (6kg each) of them linked together and hauled by the other conscript in the case of an Imperial Guard 3-man heavy weapons squad (third carries a tripod).

Yeah, standard backpacks are 50kg of storage if there's nothing else. Backpacks with space on the frame given over to ammunition only holds half the regular backpack's load (25kg) of anything else you wanna haul around. Usually the ammo containers/capacitor banks could be separate (with the listed weight of 15kg) if one was to strip out the misc. carrying capacity and wear it as is I suppose you'd have to adjust the straps that came with it to make it comfortable to wear.

Sigismund said:

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