General impressions:

Pre-FAQ: Hated the agenda, hated the uber-maesters. Super Joff, Super Robert, super lame. I love combo's, but not instant gratification auto-win every game combos. Awful.

Post-FAQ: Love it. Using natural maesters makes the set work much better together. There is a ton of variety of Maester builds available. I've built Dragon Maesters out of Targ, Raider Maesters in GJ, Asshai Maesters in Bara, OOH Maesters using Oldtown Raven in Neutral House, Maester Control in Stark, and Archmaester Ebrose out of Martell.

Every one of those builds "feels" like the house its built in, and is totally different from each other. I disagree with the nay-sayers and declare, post-errata, that this is one of the best CP sets to date.

Sansa Award (Worst card in the set): House of Shadow
Balerion Award (Best card in the set): Maester Luwin
Ned Award (Most thematic card in the set): Jaqen H'ghar
Shagga Award (Card with the most jaw-dropping effect in the set): Archmaester Ebrose
Renly Award (Card with the best art in the series): The Archmaester's Wrath
Hot Pie Medal (Granted to an adorable but utterly useless card): Daven Lannister
Jaime Medal (Granted to a very efficient card that ends up ultimately being hated): Copper Link
Kettleback Medal (Granted to a card that was greatly hyped, but ultimately had very little impact): Doran's Game
Tyene Medal (Granted to a seemingly innocent, but very deadly card): Ghaston Grey
Euron Medal (Most controversial card in the set): The Laughing Storm

Twn2dn said:

i am more interested in "balance", although i don't know why it was put in quotes. In this game if the choices are underpowered neutral theme with less cards dedicated to it in a cycle or overpowered neutral theme with a lot of cards dedicated to it in a cycle i choose underpowered every time. and im not sure how you can say that maesters feel different in each house because every time i play them its a voltron deck built around a central strong character. And finally yes maesters feel strong and efficient, most overpowered decks do, in fact, before the ban wildings felt the same way.

I tend to agree with Jack here. Brotherhood was certainly quite popualr for a whiel, and you have to think baout Beric in deck building tot his day. Tehy didn't domiante, tehir exisitnce didn't compel you to adjust to their mechanic and they had a Nedly appeal. I think FFG handled them just about right - and maesters were a little to much out of the gate - it looks htey have been wteaked to eb just about right now.

Which House or Houses got all the love? Stark and Martell
Which House or Houses got the shortest stick? Lannister
Did you find the Maester-centric theme interesting? Why? I liked it as a concept, but I can definitely understand why people don't. When it first came out it was an interesting idea with a lot of deckbuilding possibilities. Never before could you remove cards from the deck to create a hyper-efficient deck. It also created some cool combos. In retrospect, these are near game-breaking, but just like wildlings before them, maesters will likely be errata'ed into decline. It will take a couple more tourneys of maester dominance to do so, specifically out of house maester. Ironically, the latest erratas have made Martell summer and KotHH builds less viable, and imo will create a flow toward maester builds.
Do you lke the direction that the game has develop in this CP set? Nah, I'd love to see the game go back to the basics like they do with the big box expansions. I'd like to see development of current themes and support of existing traits and keywords. this includes development of some neutral-tended things such as kingsguard.
Are you more or less hyped about the next CP set, than you were about this one? Why? I think there will be some serious powercreep based on some of the spoiled cards, which will change the paradigm of card efficiency. I hope it won't break the game...

Card Awards and Medals

Sansa Award (Worst card in the set): Without His Beard
Balerion Award (Best card in the set): The Prince's Plans (pre-errata), The Laughing Storm (if it weren't restricted), The Conclave (all things considered)
Ned Award (Most thematic card in the set): Ser Gerold Hightower
Shagga Award (Card with the most jaw-dropping effect in the set): Dragon Lore or Baelor Blacktyde
Renly Award (Card with the best art in the series): Ghaston Grey or Daven Lannister
Hot Pie Medal (Granted to an adorable but utterly useless card): The Mad Mouse
Jaime Medal (Granted to a very efficient card that ends up ultimately being hated): The Laughing Storm - it was hated before it even came out and FFG wussed out and didn't let it see play.
Kettleback Medal (Granted to a card that was greatly hyped, but ultimately had very little impact): Gilbert Fartwind and Baelor Blacktyde - I predict these will see more play in the future, though.
Tyene Medal (Granted to a seemingly innocent, but very deadly card): Rickon Stark
Euron Medal (Most controversial card in the set): Apprentice Collar

1.Which House or Houses got all the love? Stark, Martell
2.Which House or Houses got the shortest stick? Baratheon (really why the learned stuff when no in house learned...), Lannister
3.Did you find the Maester-centric theme interesting? Why?

I as many others found the idea interesting, but I don't like how the chains were made. Currently we have some of the best repeatable utility cards in neutral chains that do things better than their in-house counter parts which I don't like.

4.Do you lke the direction that the game has develop in this CP set?

Now that all the weird in-house stuff (at the gates, maesters path) have been fixed I like this set a lot more, at first I hated this set since we had first at the gstes for OOH maester which for me didn't feel like AGOT anymore and the über maester builds were out of place. It's nice that combo surfaced some, but while playing with uber bob/joffrey it never felt like combo since I wasn't looking for keycards I had them already. Also the fact that the apprentice collar gives +1 str for each chain made these combo decks feel like too powerful aggro combined with alot of utility from the chains. So like the set now, hated it before.

5.Are you more or less hyped about the next CP set, than you were about this one? Why?

Yes I am. I have never liked neutral heavy sets and from all the spoilers we have gotten there hasn't been a single neutral card revealed, love it! Also hoping that there is some chance that we can get the ccg champion cards in that set reprinted since it is "a tale of champions"

Card Awards and Medals [Optional - Feel free to nominate any/all/none]

•Sansa Award (Worst card in the set) Without His Beard
•Balerion Award (Best card in the set) The Prince's Plans
•Ned Award (Most thematic card in the set) Ser Gerold Hightower (what is this a kingsguard that interacts with kings?!?)
•Shagga Award (Card with the most jaw-dropping effect in the set) The Laughing Storm
•Renly Award (Card with the best art in the series) Widow's Watch
•Hot Pie Medal (Granted to an adorable but utterly useless card) Ser Jon Fossoway
•Jaime Medal (Granted to a very efficient card that ends up ultimately being hated) Apprentice Collar
•Kettleback Medal (Granted to a card that was greatly hyped, but ultimately had very little impact) Jaqen H'ghar
•Tyene Medal (Granted to a seemingly innocent, but very deadly card) Ghaston Grey
•Euron Medal (Most controversial card in the set) The maesters path

Ire said:

Except for Thoros of Myr

Saturnine said:

oh you are right. but that is a good example of an awesome neutral card

Danigral said:

Just make sure you don't confuse him with Garth the Gross :-)

I don't hate the Maester agenda as it is today. It is a clever idea. Brotherhood agenda and Maester agenda create two very distinct styles of play.

At the start, it was a clever broken idea. But it's been errata'ed to be manageable. Too many agendas are just boring " you lose ____, you get _____", wow, really?

The chains are interesting too, and fit into different decktypes. Steel Link for example seems near worthless in a lot of decks, but in a Greyjoy deck, it's pretty killer. My only gripe is I don' t think being able to make a 48 card deck is good for the game (though I do have a lot of fun with it at present)

This is why I like Damon as designer, he isn't afraid to make wacky stuff like this. I'm stoked to see what is coming in the Lannister box.

Rave said:

Lannister box and the new chapter pack block should be amazing.

I'm not gonna comment on rules and card power due to lack of experience but I find it extremly dissapointing that so much card space were wasted for neutrals and angle that is marginal in books (at least till DoD which i'm still waiting for translation into my language) while one of major houses still didn't have it's own box and important parts of book plots are completly unexplored (Arryns, Tyrells) or badly underepresented (Night Watch, Wildings).

michaelius said:

Honestly compared to Brotherhood cycle and the Night Watch/Wildling cycle the neutrals were much more in control here. All the neutral maesters were fine really. 2 uniques and 3 non-uniques in weak, moderate and strong. Then chains with the agenda or even without are easily playable out of any house. Leyton fits in nicely with a similar feel to the older Jon Arryn card (though isn't Leyton the Lord of Oldtown? Where is his Lord trait?). The only real neutrals here I didn't like were the Faceless Man and the Prolific Statesman. Personally I felt that the biggest failure in this cycle was the lack of both a unique and a non unique maester for every house. I suppose I can see the lack of one for Targ, especially as they have a legal Targ house Aemon (but he can't take chains), but where are the non-unique maesters for Baratheon, Greyjoy and Lannister? Those three cards are the ones who's lack I feel in this set most clearly.

And as for a marginal angle... if you are reading the books and are not seeing maesters behind everything going on in the kingdoms or involved up to their eyebrows in every plot you are not reading between the lines. Take a look at house Stark - before all the troubles they run into as the story progress probably the sterotypical Westeros lordly family (if at the higher end of the spectrum). Maester Luwin their house maester is the educator of every single one of the children, excepting the boys military lessons and the girls lessosn in dancing, deportment, and sewing and such. He is the family physician. He is Lord Eddard's primary advisor. He is the "mailman" for the keep itself, almost all communication in or out goes thru his hands via the special Citadel "homing messenger ravens." Many of them he probably writes himself at Ned's instruction, certainly he probably reads most of them. At their best maesters are the forsmost servants of the various lords of the realm, but how true are they to the ideal, and how much are they actively manipulating? Aemon tells Jon that maesters give counsel not commands but look at Pycelle instead of Luwin and all the plots he was involved in. Except for those lords that ignore their maesters or do not use them for messages the maesters are essentially involved in everything that goes on in Westeros. Not the driving force perhaps, but often the advice behind it.

Westeros has all these "sworn" orders: The Kingsguard, the Night's Watch... and the Maesters of the Citadel. We've seen just how well the first two keep their oaths. Should we assume a quiet parallel with the third or are they different? Or is it all about the individuals and the sides they choose?

Freerider said:

Brotherhood was out of control? please tell me how?

jack merridew said:

Lightning lord, taste for blood (x times), flaming sword and not enough cards in card pool to remove attachemnts or bounce charachters made brotherhood for a very short period really strong..

@Jack: I think the point Freerider was getting at here (and I don't mean to put words in Freerider's mouth, sorry if I got this wrong), is that the Brotherhood neutral characters/mechanics felt like they really dominated the set. For example, when you sit down against a Brotherhood deck, it doesn't seem to me it matters all that much what the house card is...the deck is going to feel similar to most other brotherhood decks (at least if it's running the agenda).

In contrast, with the Maester's Path and the block in general you see A LOT of the same neutral attachments (chains), but there really aren't all that many similarities in how the game actually plays out with different houses. Playing against a Targ maester deck feels very different from playing against a Stark maester deck. The maesters each house puts into play with At the Gates, the combos and chains each focuses, etc. are very different. The decks simply just function very differently. This is especially true post-errata, when the powerful characters like no-shadows Robert can't benefit as easily from the agenda. So even if you *see* the same neutral cards (chains) in every maester deck, those chains don't really override the natural feel or flavor of that house; in fact, they tend to supplement it. (Again, this is all post-errata. Pre-errata, you had Robert Baratheon burning characters with Threat from the East, and that felt kind of wrong.)

Again, I may be misrepresenting Freerider and I'm definitely throwing my own opinion as well. But the basic point is that Brotherhood didn't really add that much variety to the houses...it felt more like it's own house than a set designed to boost other houses, at least in my opinion. In contrast, the maester block really has added quite a bit of complexity and variety to each house...even if FFG didn't get the balance quite right at first.

You think Maesters adds variety?

I think its like playing the same deck over and over again.

If I am playing an attachment heavy deck, I see tin link first turn every time, then they build up some chains, then they use lead link with threat.

I am so over playing maesters. It's gotta be the most boring/annoying thing to play against ever.

Thank you Twn2dn that's basically right though mostly it's just that I remember so many people complaining so much about the neutral focus with Defenders of the North (and honestly it's my least favorite cycle so far by far as well) and then Brotherhood started coming out with a bunch of unique powered neutrals not to mention a neutral House Card and the complaining started up all over again. So no I don't think Brotherhood totally overdid the neutrals and I really liked all the house themes they expanded upon (well except maybe raiders and sand snakes - but that's a how issue not a what/theme issue). But at the time a lot of people were saying the sky was falling and it was gonna be just like Defenders - all neutrals all the time, even though it really turned out not to be. So I was talking about the repeated perceptions that so many blocks are over neutral heavy when really the only block I really felt that way for was Defenders. I don't always like all the neutrals that come out in a cycle but every cycle should have at least some, and some characters would fit no other way.

And I'm sorry John but that was the first time I'd ever even been able to build a deck and play with the Maester agenda so I still find it fascinating. Maybe I won't after a while, but then I also never played it or played vs it pre-errata and thank goodness for that errata. It was clearly needed and I like the feel of the theme more now. I do feel that each house can give them their own flavor and that with the agenda you really do have a fair bit of options. That said it is a pretty strong effect and I get how it can be annoying to play against.

I've been playing a long time and there always used to be a lot more maester characters around and not a lot but at least a number of maester effects and I'd missed having that around. That said I am really looking forward to the next cycle though I'm still not sure how I feel about Joust and Melee traits coming back. At least it looks like they will be much more careful about balance this time around, and I have great faith in Damon. Even the Gencon pre-errata maester deck had nothing on the Old Lanni Tourney Ground Story Event decks. Or the Bara Jousting decks that won 90% of games 1 round. Or those Harrenhal Tourney Grounds Warhorse decks. Worst NPEs ever.

Yeah, they don't feel different to me in the least. Have to side with Fieras on this one. I see them trying to do the exact same thing, and the same thing they did before on uber-characters now just on Maesters (most of the time). *shrug*

~Jeff, you need to get out and play more

rings said:

Maybe I'll come around after Black Friday, when I get to play against more than just the local meta

rings said:

This is certainly true. I don't really have a good feel for the environment and game meta as a whole when I only get out and play one tourney per chapter pack cycle release. Of course means I don't get sick of it all so fast either. I guess that's good right?

But seriously, my Bara maesters vs Joey's Greyjoy maesters? Nothing alike. **** that deck was evil. Burned and Pillaged combined with Winter is just evil, the maesters were mostly there to provide gravy and sneak attacking Ice Fishermen.

Which House or Houses got all the love?

Pre-errata = Martell and Greyjoy

Post-errata = Baratheon and Greyjoy

Which House or Houses got the shortest stick?

Targ mostly due to lack of any really solid in-House cards during Maester cycle. I can instantly think of great in-house cards for every House from Maester except for Targ where all the in-house cards kind of sucked big time compared to cards like Burned and Pillaged, Slander and Lies, Maester Lomys, Riders on the Red Fork and Prince's Plans.

Did you find the Maester-centric theme interesting? Why?

Interesting concept. Implemented in a way that was too broken'

Do you lke the direction that the game has develop in this CP set?

Not entirely, although I do like where Damon is trying to go. Too much neutral love and not enough good in-House cards for all the housess.

Are you more or less hyped about the next CP set, than you were about this one? Why?

More because of the Champion card reprints and hopefully more a focus on developing in House themes rather than neutral

Lessons from this set?

1. Rush is not dead. In fact, Rush is becoming the dominant archetype

2. The errata did not "nerf Maesters". It only nerfed apprentice collar on non-Maester builds. Maester builds out of Bara and Greyjoy are still dominant.

Freerider said:

Your Bara Maesters deck is just as evil as Greyjoy Maesters, they are just evil in different ways.

Hmm. Looks like I never got round to actually tabulating the results from the Poll from the last CP cycle. Before I put up the questionnaire for the new one, I think I should put this one up, as a reference and for those interested.

*WWDrakey grabs book on Necromancy*

*WWDrakey gives Fiery Kiss to Thread*

So, here they are. I had to do some guesswork regarding some answers, and use some free interpretation on others, but I guess it should be okay as it is. (Seeing where the Jaime Medal went is pretty interesting, in retrospect...)

1. Which House or Houses got all the love?
Stark 8
Martell 7
Neutral 2
Greyjoy 3

2. Which House or Houses got the shortest stick?
Lannister - 6
Baratheon - 4
Targaryen - 2

3. Did you find the Maester-centric theme interesting? Why?

No - 11
Yes - 4

4. Do you lke the direction that the game has develop in this CP set?

No - 10
Yes - 4

5. Are you more or less hyped about the next CP set, than you were about this one? Why?

No - 3
Yes - 11

Sansa Award (Worst card in the set):
Deep Den - 1
House of Shadow - 3
Lucky Bones - ½
Without His Beard - 2½
Royal Favor - ½
Maester's Path - 1

Balerion Award (Best card in the set):
The Prince's Plans - 2½
Maester Luwin - 2
The Maester's Path - 2 ½
Ghaston Grey - ½
Laughing Storm - ½
Conclave - ½

Ned Award (Most thematic card in the set):
Guardian Wolf - 3
TMP Agenda - 1
Jaqen H'ghar - 1½
Burned and Pillaged - ½
Ser Gerold Hightower - 2

Shagga Award (Card with the most jaw-dropping effect in the set)
Dragon Lore - 1½
Slander And Lies - 1
The Maester's Path - ½

Burned and Pillaged - ½
Baelor Blacktyde - 1½
Prince's Plans - 1
Archmaester Ebrose - 1
The Laughing Storm - 1

Renly Award (Card with the best art in the series)
Widow's Watch - 2
Ghaston Grey - 1½
Oberyn's Guile - ½

Guardian Wolf - ½
Magister Illyrio - ½
Oldtown Raven - ½
Shireen Baratheon - 1
The Archmaester's Wrath - 1
Daven Lannister - ½

Hot Pie Medal (Granted to an adorable but utterly useless card)
Ser Jon Fossoway - 3
Laughing Storm - 1
Shireen Baratheon - 2
Daven Lannister - 1
The Mad Mouse - 1

Jaime Medal (Granted to a very efficient card that ends up ultimately being hated)
The Prince's Plans - 2
The Maester's Path - 1½
Ghaston Grey - ½
Apprentice Collar - 2
Copper Link -1
The Laughing Storm -1

Kettleback Medal (Granted to a card that was greatly hyped, but ultimately had very little impact)
Lucas Blackwood -1
Jaqen H'ghar - 2½
Stormlands Bastard - 1½
Maester Luwin - 1
Doran's Game - 1
Gylbert Farwynd - ½
Baelor Blacktyde - ½

Tyene Medal (Granted to a seemingly innocent, but very deadly card)
Apprentice Collar - 1 ½
Ghaston Grey - 5½
Rickon Stark - 1

Euron Medal (Most controversial card in the set)
The Maester's Path - 5
Laughing Storm - 2
Apprentice Collar - 1

This is pretty cool to look back on Interesting to see what people liked and didn't like.

It makes me wonder if Laughing Storm would remain on parts of these lists after the most recent FAQ update.