So here's something that's been worrying me for a while:

Would you say it's better to throw new enemies at a kill-team as soon as you think they can handle them, or would you rather keep some enemies up your sleeve so that the players don't face every threat the galaxy has to offer right away?

An example:

The way my players are going I could throw a few Chaos marines at them and be reasonably sure of avoiding a TPK. However, it's still early days and the characters are all still Rank 1. I would like to give them some CSMs to fight as an end battle for their next mission, but on the other hand I feel that having the players kill a few CSMs at Rank 1 takes away the fear of seeing them at later ranks.

How do you guys handle this kind of thing?

Lex1nat0r said:

If you feel motivated, bring them on now. You got to tap into the enthusiasm you're having.

For later, you can bring more difficult CSM. Grossly mutated, iron skinned, armed with heavy bolters, multi-meltas, daemon weapons, surrounded by a 100 cultists. They will be scared still if they have any senses.

Alex

I tend to roll with whatever the story demands. If your players have worked their way into a situation in which Traitor Astartes are a likely occurance, well there we go, let them have it. If there is little reason for them to find Traitor Astartes then they probabley shouldn't. Let theme and mythos of your game guide you and you cannot go far wrong.

I agree with Moirdryd

If there is a good chance that they will find a CSM and it helps the story then they should find them. I use a old GM trick called "saving the day" where some external factor, say a natural catastrophe or another NPC interrupts the fight between and the players are saved. This way you can add iconic enemies and even trade some blows with them with a secret safety net.

I do suggest to pack as much punch and DW feel into your encounters, make a list of 2-3 key actions you would love to see players perform within the encounter and set the stage.

example: It would be great if a player would turn a Rihno over and use the guns on the horde, (the action)

(the stage) "You notice an overturned Rihno at the edge of the battle, the turret guns are smoking they might still work"

There is enough material between books and supplements to keep the game exiting.

cheers

Walt

As others said. If the story demands it go for it. In each mission its the trying to accomplish the objectives that should bring the challenge, not a single encounter. And unlike a D&D game here a chaos marine can be scary (and kill you) even if you are at rank 8.

Also another thing to remember is the difference between troops, elites and masters. While troops and elites are seen fairly often its the masters they should be scared of. they are the end of level nasties. Since chaos marines (at least the generic ones) are fairly common . Especially in the Acheros salient, its not that uncommon to encounter some.

Walt said:

That's a Deus Ex Machina. You should NEVER use a Deus Ex Machina, they are a story telling device that basically tells people that know better that you're being lazy or you screwed something up. Whether a group of players succeeds or not should depend entirely on the players, not the GM.

Obviously making things forced or very linear narratively speaking can get frustrating for many players, but setting up situations and letting players take advantage of them, especially if they take the time to ask what environmental features they can exploit, is probably fine. Never is a word I prefer not to use in rpgs.

For me enemies are entirely story driven, if a specific encounter is going to occur there has to be a reason for it. Primarily I've had them fighting Orks cause they're wading hip deep into the beginnings of a Waaaaaaaagh!!! but the Orks don't have the normal numerical swell they should have to launch a good Waaaaaaaaagh!!! so the Inquisitor tasked them to protect the Agriworld where the guardsmen have been driven back to the edge of the planetary capital and are holding a live in their heavily entrenched positions while the orks run rampant in the uncultivated land (Jungles).

I have a few other twists in there like it's exclusively Snake Bitez Orks, but they are fractured with a few different Warbosses, instead of under the banner of one united Orkboss, but are still working in conjunction with each other.

So to recap, we got orks of all types

Shootas, Boyz, Nobs, Wartrucks, KillaKans, Stolen/Salvaged Imperial guard equipment, and you can't forget the grots.

Then for NPCs; a guard Commissar-Captain, a few guard sergeants, a IG Tank Commander, and some normal guardsman who have a forward outpost in the jungle that was overrun and they were left for dead.

So far the players have killed one Ork Warboss, discovered a mysterious Inquisition convoy that was destroyed and its cargo taken by something, and had one of their own killed fighting the warboss.

So obviously my story position hasn't called for anything but orks, orks, and more orks...I still did throw a variety of orks and their associated technology at the players though.

DaedalRogue said:

I would do something similar, but then the problem becomes that you start running out of new stuff to throw at the players. And don't they get tired of fighting Orks?

I understand the need to use enemies as appropriate to the story, but I always like to keep a few enemy varieties up my sleeve. That way I don't burn through them too quickly.

I've found with my players its less the variety and more the situation. One of the fights I had them in was a sapper's tunnel large enough to drive a tank through. It didn't have any light, but there was intense weapons fire coming down the tunnel from the orks. They pushed through this adverse environment to find a key position for the orks and a minor plot point, then they blasted their own exit and climbed out into a clearing that was going to be used as an extraction point where orks came swarming in from the surrounding jungle and from within the tunnel itself.

If you throw just a-typical combat situations at them it's very likely to keep their attention.

I gotta agree with daedal on this. The enemies the PC encounter should always be story driven. DW has the capacity of becoming bogged down in combat encounters if you arnt careful and this soon becomes tiring for PC's and the GM. it also means if you only have one evening a week to play and only really 3 and half hours of game time in that, then story progression is really slow. I have just introduced chaos marines in to my campaighn, sethahar from Emperor protects. But as a story mechanic and not a combat encounter. Im also a fan of the deus ex machina. Although it isnt that if it fits with the story. PC's dont always succeed and need to be saved or pointed in the right direction sometimes.

As far as chaos marines go. Get a good story and stick em in but remember to focus all the action and events on the player characters. Get some basic Chaos Marine archetypes in your head and then let the PC's figure em out!! This will get your guys much more engaged and you will get plenty of opportunities to hang stories off events, or modify things from week to week.

The most important thing is that the whole group has fun!!!!