This might seem a stupid question, but its something thats bothered me in read and playing Deathwatch.

Namely, my issue is that the majoirty of Space Marine Chapters dont regard the Emperor as a deity as such. Rather, he is a legendary father figure. He's great, but mortal and not divine. However, its obvious that religion plays a huge part of their everyday.

Well, thats great and all, but, at the end of the day, whom do they pray to then? Praying to someone you consider mortal and a family member seems a contradition. What is the Space Marine religion exactly? What do they believe in, if not in a divine figure? What do they put their faith in? How have other GMs tackled this?

I'll be out of the country for a couple weeks, but this question was bugging me enough to post it before I left. Would appreciate any comments.

Thanks!

Seems to me they pray to the Emperor, dear old grand dad, as they know that he is the only thing standing between humanity and extinction...they know (by on large) he's no 'god' in the sense that we use the term, but they also know that he's uber powerful enough, even in death, to hold back the four 'gods' of Chaos. The reasoning behind the prayers, it seems to me, is to aid/fortify the Emperor's will by aligning their personal will with his (via prayer). Thus, they see their prayers as directly boosting the powers of the Emperor to maintain his ceaseless vigil. As far as I can tell. But, yeah, any other idears would be hot...

I think of the Space Marine's religion as a form of "ancestor worship" -although they would probably prefer the term "reverance" to "worship".

Beilial said:

Have a look at the custom chapter section in Rites of Battle, there is a section on beliefs.

Alex

Beilial said:

This isn't a bit of fluff I like, so it gets ignored.

My Marines, lead by their chaplains, are as Emperor fearing as any citizen of the Imperium.

From what i've read over the course of the years from various 40k books and such worship more or less depends on the particular chapter. Some do regard the emperor as a god such as the black templars or white consuls. Others revere him. In fact every space marine who isn't a traitor loves the emperor and regard him like a god but, still stick to the emperors creed that there is no such thing as a god or religon and they work to destroy religon like in the days of the horus heresy. It really all depends on the chapter and if they believe he's a god or not. Though all love him and their primarch.

Space Marine religion is unique to what the standard Imperial citizen may believe. They do pray to the Emperor and their Primarch, hoping in some way that the power and strength of these figures will guide them in dark times. They believe in the power of the Emperor, his ideals, and that is what they pray to. It seems to me that the Space Marines use prayer and ritual to focus and center them selves, drawing on the image and wisdom of heroes past to give them selves something to fight for. Chaplains exist to remind the Space Marines who and what they are and the spiritual gravity that brings with it. Chaplains remind the Space Marines what and who they are fighting for and teach the wisdom and power of the Emperor and Primarch. With belief in these figures and ideals, the rituals gain power.

Of course not all Chapters follow such a system. Some of them have very different rituals and rites for their spiritual needs. The Moritifactors are a good example. The Moritifactors definitely believe in ancestor worship, using blood rituals and trances to commune with the dead and gain their knowledge.

In the big picture, though, it means that fundamentally the Adeptus Astartes are not beholden to the Ecclesiarchy in the way that the rest of the Imperium, sans the Mechanicus and, of course, the Inquisition, are. While individual Space Marine chapters such as the Black Templars may have a very close relationship with the Imperial Faith, there are obviously others like the Space Wolves who worship the Emperor in ways that would be called heretical were they anyone else (even though they still do), and others like the Salamanders and Ultramarines who simply to do not care to have the Ecclesiarchy calling the shots for them.

I always thought of it like this:

• Space marines are very religious: they have a set of customs, rituals, convictions and guiding principles they hold to be sacred. This set of rituals dictates their day-to-day life and helps them concentrating, focussing, fighting, handling hierarchy, contacts with other chapters, contacts with other humans, contacts with other parts of the Imperial bureaucracy and war-machine. You can find many description of these rituals and convictions in the 40k background, the Horus Heresy series for example has tons of them (the oath of the moment and various other oaths seem to have an important position in these customs).
• Space marines can be believers (depends on the chapter): some chapters believe in the Emperor as a God, some chapters (and this is how I prefer them) see the Emperor, the Primarchs and heroes of their chapter as examples would should be remembered and revered for their extra-ordinary deeds and life. So, there is no real need for a god here. A space marine can meditate (= think about) the life of his Primarch, the Emperor, or one of his chapter's heroes for inspiration, strength or guiding in the same way that another space marine would pray to the Emperor or his Primarch.

Astartes Faith and Religion ultimately comes down to "Understanding"

The apotheosis of the Emperor is held as sacrosanct by some (Black Templars, White Consuls ect) and a pointless expression by others (SpaceWolves, IronHands ect).

The Ecclesiarchy is built out of a Popular cult that came into prominence after the Emperor's Ascension to the Golden Throne. These were people who had always had beliefs and use dthe Emperor's actions as a mirror to the Millenial faiths that had proceeded the Unification and the Great Crusade. This is the Faith of the Common man of the Imperium (and almost everyone else too).

The Aastartes Faith is differant all together. It is based entirely on how the Astartes saw the Emperor before the Heresy and His Ascension to the Golden Throne. He was a father figure to the Primarchs and held as sacred by them although not as a God. His personal power in terms of Physical Presence, Charisma and Psyker abilities was Immense. His existence was utterly central to the lives of the Astartes as they were made by him as His Angels of Death. Their rituals, structures, rites and strictures are all based off those of the original legions and the primarchs who knew the Emperor. It is all based from a series of personal experiences given gravitas by Millenia and re-inforced by the power of the Emperor in his Post Mortis state.

"The Emperor protects" is a common phrase throughout the Imperium.

When said by the Imperial Guardsman, the factorum Worker or the Preacher and Confessor it is a blessing to call the sight of a God down onto those the blessing is given by or upon to delver them from harm. Inspired by Pure Faith built on Hope, Wishing and desperate desire. This is what they have been taught and everyday a Billion Trillion souls pray that it remains true as it was they day before.

When said by the Astartes it is intoned as a simple, cold, hard, solid Fact. Because that is Exactly what the Emperor has been doing since the Unification and Especially since he was interred in the Golden Throne. They KNOW this, their Primarch and Ancestors where there (not to mention those Venerable Dreadnoughts), just as they KNOW the Emperor has never faltered and never will. After all, the Emperor's name is Death.

Within and from those two examples are born the diversity of Faiths that mark the Imperium of Man and it's Adeptus Astartes alike.

You also have to remember that Astartes are the Angels of Death. I feel the term "Angel" is very apt here. If you look at Christianity, angels are not objects of worship. However, they are the children of God (though not His direct son). If you apply that to 40k -> God= Emperor, Jesus= Primarchs, Satan= Fallen Primarchs, Angels/Demons= (Chaos) Space Marines

I've always found that analogy to help me see things from the Astartes perspective.