Ok. I get that a lot of the 40K stuff is supposed to be cheeky.

Noise Marines? Man...I just can't wrap my head around them being cool in any way.

Slaanesh puts out Noise Marines? Really? Lancers Rockers, anyone?

Really? Is it because they were trying to keep it PG-13?

Help me out here guys. Why do I not completely write them out of existence?

When I think of warior servants of Slaanesh, somebody sporting a high-tech one-man-band get up does not come to mind.

I can come up with all sorts of R rated fallen marines...any ideas for alternative PG Salaneshi marines? Body sculpters?

I can only assume you've not read "Fulgrim" then - the Noise Marine instruments do some totally messed up things, entirely in the spirit of Slaanesh.

They're probably one of the scariest things out there, because they are turning what I personally love (music) into a destructive force that drives people to insanity and violence.

So, their music makes you crazy?

I thought their music was sonic waves of obliteration.

Are they like bacchante (in practice)?

Depending on what music, etc, they do, it has a different effect. In "Fulgrim", it caused some people to tear their eyes and skin off, where as it drove others into savage acts of violence against other people. Other instruments literally shook people apart, or made their heads explode.

Each instrument is unique to the Marine that made it, and therefore has it's own effect. It's just that tabletop rules have to be unified and simple, unless you want everything to be an exception.

Noise Marines are one of the few things in 40k that actually legimately scare me.

Hey now, I like Noise Marenes. The whole "Slaanesh is just sex" thing is so tiresome, and its nice to have a basic troop choice that doesn't reinforce the "I AM THE LORD OF ALL WEINERS" schtick of Slaanesh.

It is also important to remember that Noise marines are just one cult of the many that follows Slaanesh. I really think GW have watered down the setting when it comes to followers of the dark gods. Now they make it seem like every marine who is dedicated to Khorne is a berzerker, to Slaanesh a noise marine, Nurgle a plague marine and Tzeentch a socerer or a hollow piece of armour.

Chaos used to be (and should imo) be all about diversity.

Noise Marines? Man...I just can't wrap my head around them being cool in any way.

It was the late 80's, early 90's and young men who bought miniatures probably also bought Judas Priest, Metallica and Van Halen albums. Now, having survived that era with only partial deafness in one ear, metal isn't cool. Its popular, funny at times and it'll probably always be around in some noise or another, but it'll never be cool!

The other aspect of the whole thing is as suggested, you can't really sell Captain Buggery and the Sodomy Biker's Chapter to the general public, well you can and roughly 50% of the population will laugh (nervously) the other half is probably going to ban their kids from going in there for its other, alternate use as 2hrs of cheap childcare while they run off to do the shopping. Or if its America, which doesn't really have much of a sense of humour about sex, they'll probably firebomb it and lynch the employees.

MKX said:

Yeah, because that sort of thing totally happens in America.

Yeah, half the reason for the Sonic Weapons is that they are the only thing left that can give the Noise Marines any real pleasure... that's how overdone the Noise Marines have made such a simple thing.

So in a nutshell, it was more a case of "what can I play to actually feel anymore?" Sonic Weapons, only, they weren't weapons yet. Just suddenly, WHAM! "Holy crap that felt awesome! Oh... whoa, so it blew up the wall too? We might really be onto something!"

Seriously? Seriously? Are you saying this guy is not cool?

Man, Axe Slash McSix will school you in cool with some totally radical licks from his bodacious axe of chaotic disobediance to your parents! Ya!

@MKX, please don't confuse the talking heads on Fox News or the crazy religious nuts from the bizarre sects and churches as being indicative of Americans on the whole. We're pretty damned hard to sexually offend and if we happen to be (and aren't a red neck who's on his 12th beer and the object of offence is less then 12 feet away) then we as Americans usually won't have much more energy or drive then to change the damned channel, maybe write an angry blog perhaps. Now, if the topic is abortion or gun control, well, things change then, but not sex.

Jackal_Strain said:

The only khorne spesific unit on the Table Top are khorne berserkers, who are berserkers who undergo a procedure that makes them constantly rage and eager for batlle. But if you paint a regular CSM red he's still technically a khorne worshipper, just not a berserker. And the others aren't the only ones worshipping said gods, but it's their patron legions from the first heresy. However having a tabletop with a zillion units and stats would become a chore to play.

Also, noise marines fit into the role that the other two don't fit. Khorne have melee, plague toughness and noise marines have range. If your GM will allow it I'd go far out with the sonic weapons, allowing modifications like wave selector and the like. One could rupture a spleen or other organs while others crush enemies outright etc etc. It won't work in a tabletop setting with the amount of units often on the table in a 40k game, but for an RPG with a character I'd say it's a great way for a person to roleplay a specific character and let it evolve with the archetypical weaponry that defines it. Just like it'd let a plague marine use infested ammo and such.

Then again I tend to enforce RP, you get bonuses for making and sticking to an interesting character playing their flaws and what not (if you smoke/do drugs I expect you do smoke and do drugs, spending money and taking all the fun stuff that comes from withdrawals etc etc. You can choose not to, but I'll give out negative modifiers for powerplaying).

Deinos said:

That's 'Merica to you bub.

Deinos said:

*cough*

Numerous attacks on abortion clinics, including murder, arson, kidnapping and torture

*cough*

Yes, that sort of thing totally happens in America - all the time.

Ok ok, can we get back to the discussion at hand and not go down this road ?

MILLANDSON said:

Which is Abortion nutters, not sexual content nutters (or which there are far fewer and much less motivated). Please don't lump all our varying cults into one one giant crazy pot. We like to keep the flavours separated around here.

Thank you.

MILLANDSON said:

8 killings over 18 years is not anywhere close to "all the time," and also has literally nothing to do with the conversation at hand.

As to the topic, I'll say it again -- I like Noise Marines and Lucius the Eternal because it makes Slaaneshi followers seem more diverse and entertaining; Slaanesh even encompasses something so innocent as music, yet his followers use this beautiful human creation to kill. Even though noise marines are silly (and yes, silliness is a part of 40k), once the initial WTFery wears off, you look at them and realize that they represent the use of art, TO MURDER PEOPLE.

Also, people tend to overestimate the role of sex as far as Slaanesh. Normal levels of sexual desire have little to do with Slaanesh, just like ordinary, pleasing music has little to do with Slaanesh. Its when you take something ordinary and warp it into something horrible through unnatural levels of obsession, that it has to do with Slaanesh. Its been said that ****, for instance, has little to do with lust and everything to do with power. Perversion is defined as twisting an urge until it becomes antithetical to its purpose. Humans could never have given rise to Slaanesh, because to reach that level of perversity, a human tends to wind up crippling or fatally injuring himself, and its telling that the birth of Slaanesh was by far the most destructive of the four gods.

But also, everyone can imagine how sex can be turned into something horrible because most people are very picky about sex. Turning something you cannot really imagine being something harmful sums up what Slaanesh is about much easier, and twisting music into something that kills is a nice, subtle way about it, even though noise marines are anything but subtle.

@MKX: don't forget mate, over here in good old Australlia we have people like Fred Nile and the South Australian Attorney General (don't remember his name) that feels that R rated computer games are too naughty for us, and therefore no state can have them.

As for the origional topic, I remember when noise marines first came out. Inspired by bands that used at least 17 cans of hair-spray each before each set I always felt, also know as (hmm, how not to swear...) "Male-chicken-that-makes-a-lot-of-noise"-rock. My memory might be failing me, but didn't Daemonettes go from one breast to no breasts on the models at about the same time? So deffinatley could have been part of a PG-13 rating push...

I find the concept of them fine, for a small sect within the Emporers Children. But in any game I run of BC that may involve contact with Slaaneshi CSM's, there will be drug-marines, piercing-marines, michellin-star-food-marines, and many other types (and for anyone that has ever encountered that wonderfull game Hol, there will always be sodomy-biker marines!). I can see them moving from sect to sect as one particullar pleassure begins to get a bit jaded and they decide to club together to try something new. It would make an interesting dynamic for how squads are formed in that legion.

Hygric said:

Australia don't have that anymore though, 18 rated games have been authorised now, and the rating will come into force (allowing stores to sell 18 rated games) before Christmas.

But yea, the Noise Marines are just one small aspect of Slaanesh's Astartes followers - even "sodomy marines" are bored tropes (because what's so amazing about sodomy?), they're much more likely to be sado-masochistic rapists who torture people over many years, much like the Dark Eldar are want to do.

MILLANDSON said:

Really? That went through? About time! Last I heard the R rating got squelched, again. I really need to pay more attention to the news. If I may be so bold to ask, are you Australian Millandson? Otherwise I am feeling real embarassed right now!

I agree with the "bored tropes" comment. That I think should be the key idea to role-playing a 10,000 year old Slaaneshi marine. He (it?) has done and experienced nearlly everything by that time. That is the fundamental catch-22 of Slaanesh, pleassures become less pleasurable with repeated exposure. Hence the drive to be a noise-marine or any of the other types of *insert word here*-marine. Heck, I can even invision the stamp-collector-marine as being a valid follower of Slaanesh... for a while...

As for the inclusion of Sodomy-Biker marines, that is purely a nod to the history of my personal RPG group, that was shall we say scarred by the RPG Hol (Human Occupied Landfill, nasty game to play, but a fun, and cathartic read).

Just banter I used to tease my US friends with after they used to keep asking if I rode a kangaroo to work, don't get too cranky.

Besides, its 40K, anything remotely fun or colourful at some point has been black-listed by the Imperium leaving the majority of the inhabitants fearful, self concious and miserable bastards. HOL was ******* terrible in a funny kind of way... probably not as genuinely terrifying as Kult, which inspired a plethora of scary NPC's and a couple of PC's over the years.

Hygric said:

Nope, I'm a Brit - I just happen to be a law post-grad (currently doing my Masters (where my dissertation is on IP law, digital rights, and computer gaming) and very much involved in political activism, especially in the area of digital rights and freedom of information and the like.

I'm also quite good at using google and wikipedia

https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Australian_Classification_Board#Classification_of_video_games

It only got passed at the end of July, so not noticing it isn't that bad - they probably won't start talking about it much in Oz until it's actually being used by games and the ratings board.

Slaanesh is about taking normal things like sex, music, art...etc. and cranking it to 11. Sex starts off as a swinger thing, then eventually turns into an orgy, then a blood orgy, then massive blood orgy **** scenes...etc. Slaanesh worshippers are looking for that next high, and eventually become dulled to what use to drive them so they go to more extremes to get that high.