Lightdarker said:

Core Set + Summons of the Deep AP + Dreamlands AP

Secrets of Arkham (Deluxe) + Yuggoth Contract AP

Order of Silver Twilight (Deluxe) + Rituals of the Order AP + Ancient Relics AP

Then there's the Forgotten Lore AP, including reprints from before the Core Set.

The ratio here is two AP cycles for each deluxe expansion.

Anyway, regarding the number of player cards in the Khazad Dum expansion, I strongly doubt there will be more than four cards per sphere. Adding the two heroes, that would be 50 cards. If there are 10 quest cards, 105 cards will be left to distribute over nine encounter symbols. That's 11-12 cards per symbol. That's close to what the Core Set had: There was an average of 12 cards per symbol.

I don't think that previous LCGs provide a good for the LotR production cycle. Two sets worth of APs would mean a whole lot of scenarios relying on an overused set of common encounter cards. I think the game needs a big box between each cycle to stay vibrant.

Well, okay. I guess I came to my "conclusion" solely based upon glancing at the Warhammer Invasion products page (which lists the core set, 3 deluxe expansions, and shows that they are currently on the 4th expansion pack cycle), and the assumptions I've pieced together from this forum and LOTR articles. We'll have to see what it ends up being, but in any case, so long as they're pumping out new cards I'll probably be satisfied.

It's the same way for the AGOT LCG.

Bohemond said:

Yup, that's the way I see it, too .

I was looking at card numbers on some of the previews to try and figure out whether we'll be seeing 4 or 5 cards per sphere. With Khazad! Khazad! being 8, Zigil Miner being 9, and adjusting for the 2 heroes, looks like only 3 per sphere.

Good eye/idea! I didn't even think about checking the card numbers. I suppose it's possible (yet highly unlikely) that the cards alternate spheres as the numbers go up, but I think 3 per sphere seems likely.

So let's see:
2 Heroes
36 Player cards (3 copies each of 3 per sphere)

That leaves 127 cards. I'm hoping for a few neutral player cards as well.

What about the Encounter/Quest cards we've seen. Perhaps the numbers on those can give us some insight into how many neutral cards or quest cards we might be getting.

So from reading the previous comments-am I to understand that the Khazad isnt an entirley new CORE SET in itself? Where I had to purchase 2 of the original Core to play more than 2 players. I am new to to LCGs, and LoTR is my first! I LOVE Lord of the Rings, and so I had to purchase this game!! I want to love it as much as I love the history behind the novels-but I'm ambivalent about whether or not I am playing it the right way. My friends have never played LCG's before-so this is all new to them as well, and of course I want them to love it as much as I do so I have people to play with. Thanks for your response!!

This is not a core set. You will still need a copy of the core set. This will add new quests, encounter sets, and player cards, but not enough player cards to build decks. There WILL be 3 of each player card, unlike the core set, so you will only need a single Khazad Dum expansion. Current estimates are that there will be about 3 new cards (and 3 copies of each of those cards, for a total of 9) for each sphere. There will also only be 2 new heroes.

Svenn said:

Awesome! Here I was thinking this was a bran new core set in itself and I would lose out on the money and time I put into playing the original. Im excited now!! Now all I have to do is convince my brothers and friends that its a fun game!

Svenn said:

According to this preview here: www.edgeent.com/v2_fr/edge_foros_discusion.asp there will be at least one sphere with less cards than others (I can't divide 11 new cards by 4 sphere.....)

But I can divide 8 by 4 if there are 3 neutral cards...

CastorJo said:

Maybe.

Remember that there will be only two dwarf heroes. So my bet is that the spheres that will get new heroes will get one less card than the others.

On the Edge site (the french provider for LOTR LCG) it was talled that :
- There will be 2 heroes
- 2 spheres will get 2 new cards x3
- 2 spheres will get 3 new cards x3
- 1 neutral card x3

- 3 new scenarios (first you enter the mine (level 3), second you go trough the mines (level 5), third you get out the mines without getting lost (level 7))
- 9 new encounter set that will be used for the next adventure pack too

- New goblins, trolls and something "bigger and older"

Shiv@n said:

ENTS!! at least i hope...

Shiv@n said:

Wow??!?!

Just went from pre-order status to wait and see.
If it is true, it will be a major disappointment for me. Was expecting to get enough player cards for me to decent deckbuild (casual gamer) without splashing on extra AP's. That is a paltry ~20% player cards in the set.

Hope it ain't true.

reno1051 said:

Not many walking trees inside mines

A Balrog, on the other hand...

reno1051 said:

Bigger and Older in the mines of Moria?

It's for sure a Balrog.

My opinion is the that we'll see Ents later, after Moria and his APs

koraldon said:

The primary purpose of the big box sets seems to be providing a sufficient variety of encounter cards to serve as the basis for the quests in the next arc of APs. The sales strategy seems centered around the assumption that consumers purchase the monthly packs.

koraldon said:

This is exactly what people asked for though, 3 copies of each card. This is going to limit the number of different cards in the pool since they can't do a bunch of cards with smaller quantities each and they also need to be able to fit in new quests and encounter cards.

Honestly, I don't see a reason not to buy the APs. They are so ridiculously cheap and you get a new adventure with each one.

Bohemond said:

LOTR isn't PvP

It's a coop. So the most important thing is to have cards (location, enemies) to beat. This is, for me, the main assumption that lies beneath the APs.

Svenn said:

That is subjective and I respect it.

I did hope that FFG will also give support to customers who don't intend to buy every AP.... The yearly cost is 240 USD (Retail), which is roughly my yearly gaming budget.... and with all due respect, i'm not going to spend all of it on LotR LCG.

koraldon said:

How do you get 240 USD? $15 retail x 12 (1 per month) = $180

Also, you don't have to buy all of the APs. You can pick up a few here and there. You can easily get them for well below the retail price if that is an issue as well.

Either way, what is it that people expect out of APs/expansions? Unlike most card games it's not ALL player cards. They need to keep a fresh pool of encounter cards and quests to keep it interesting, which means it's a lot harder to pump out tons of player cards.

koraldon said:

The intel is from one of the french corrector (re-read after translation) of the game. It's pretty much reliable...

Svenn said:

You are forgetting the 2 deluxe packs a year, which are 30 each.

I agree that most of the cards should not be player's cards, but we did get in the core set 3 scenarios with encouner sets for the mirkwood cycle, using roughly 90 cards. So I think it is reasonable to expect at least 60 player cards in the expansion and even 70 should be doable. However, 35 (3*3*2 + 3*2*2 + 3*1 +2) is very low in my opinion, and makes the product not worth it.... and as a result the product line.

Which is sad for me, and the reason why I'm writing here.