When playing above Agenda do I take it that Jon Snow's response is void or active. I say this because in the deck notes for LOW expansion it reads ;

THE SIEGE OF WINTERFELL, MEANS THAT YOU CANT CLAIM POWER FOR DOMINANCE OR UNOPPOSED "INT" OR "POW" CHALLANGES, BUT YOU WILL CLAIM 2 POWER FOR EACH WON "MIL" CHALLANGE.

Which does not mention responses, but, Agenda reads ;

YOU "CANNOT" CLAIM POWER FOR YOUR HOUSE EXCEPT DURING A "MIL" CHALLANGE.

Am I to take it that due to Agenda stating " CANNOT " I cant use Jon Snow's response.

Cheers

M

The power claimed by Jon Snow is put on the character, like power claimed due to renown would be. SoW does not interact with Power claimed by characters at all, only with Power claimed for the house, i.e. Power that comes from out of play and is placed on your house card.

While we're talking about SoW - make sure you understand the difference between Claiming Power and Moving Power (see FAQ, page 22).

EDIT because Ratatoskr knows his stuff and is quicker than me anyway:

Ah-ha. The for your House is the key, evidently. I was wondering something similar with a friend playing SoW a few weeks ago. Thanks for clearing it up.

Starblayde said:

Siege of Winterfell: "You cannot claim power for your House except during a Military challenge."

The important part here is "for your house".

If you win a military challenge unopposed, does that mean 3 power in total?

Siege of Winterfell is a very common cause for confusion among new players. It comes up fairly often around here. For a brief overview, I'll refer you to this post.

Starblayde said:

You claim one power for winning an unopposed challenge, and can claim 2 power via the agenda's response. Be careful not to simply add up all the power you think you're entitled two, because you claim them at different points in the timing structure, and some effect might prevent your from claiming one or the other.

Thanks mate, like in most my questions its a failure to read the cards/text correctly. I'm just currently reading page 22 FAQ and trying to digest the final paragraph, hmm.

You can, however, move power that is already in the game onto that house card by, for example, winning a power challange.

But if you win a Power challange the house card automatically takes the power unless you have an effect, ie The Seige of Winterfell that stops you claiming on your house for non military.

I can't make sense of last paragraph.

Oh got it. Just put book down made a coffee and re-read.

So its just telling me if I have an effect that stops me claiming power for my house I can still move the power already in play onto my house card by winning a power challange.

I hope thats right anyway.

Mykel The Vile said:

Correct. So even if you play the Siege of Winterfell agenda, nothing changes for you about the claim of a power challenge.

Mykel The Vile said:

That's right. The important question here is: Does the amount of power in the game increase or not? If yes, that's claiming power. If no, that's moving power. SoW puts restrictions on claiming power for your house, not on moving power.

It's confusing because fulfilling the claim of a Power challenge is moving power, not claiming power.

Power that is claimed by characters, not by your house card, is never affected by the SoW agenda. Examples are renown, CS Jon Snow's ability, or CS Joffrey's ability, among many others.

To make matters even more complicated, look at the Brotherhood Without Banners agenda. It forces you to place power that is claimed for or moved to your house on a Brotherhood character instead. Note that, although in this case the power ends up on a character, it is still subject to the restrictions of SoW.

Specifically, "claim" means two different things in this game:

1. When you "claim" power, you take power out of the power pool and put it onto a card in play (House cards are "in play")
2. The "claim" number on a plot card is the number used in resolving challenge results.

It's important to note that when you resolve a power challenge, you do not meet definition #1 because the power tokens are not coming from the power pool. Shifting power tokens from one card to another is not actually "claiming" power by definition #1. It gets confusing, though, because #2 has generally encouraged players to call the resolution of challenge results "claim." But that is a colloquialism, not a game definition, so SoW doesn't see the "claim" of a power challenge as "claiming power for your House."

Hmm, ok. Just looking at " The Brotherhood Without Banners "

And digesting.

Thanks for help.

Ratatoskr said:

If you find a way to play both agendas at once

Ok, so if 2 be the claim value for power challange, 2 is the amount of power a player can move onto House card ?

Mykel The Vile said:

More to the point, 2 is the number of power the winning attacker MUST move from the losing defender's House card to their own - unless the defender had less than 2 power on their House card to begin with. (Meaning that if your claim value is 2, you cannot choose to take 0 or 1 power instead.)

ktom said:

Dear God,

Despite my eyes being now somewhat more open than before (thanks almost entirely to ktom, ratatoskr, saturnine et al), this game still makes my brain hurt. It's like the great fun had while having alcohol, only with a much quicker time before the hangover appears (the first dive into the FAQ, usually). Couldn't you have got FFG to make this game out of the Eragon series? Because I wouldn't be playing it if you had, saving me all these attempts at Rules Maestering - my link appears as far away now as it ever has.

Seige of Winterfell now actually appears even more dangerous than it did before. **** those frosty Starks.

Kindest regards,

Starblayde

EDIT nevermind

Can I take 1 power off an opponents character in a successful power challange with a claim of 1 and put on my House card as well whilst using SOW ?

Cheers

M

Mykel The Vile said:

Of coarse, I'm now malfunctioning. I think I've learned enough today, cant squeeze anymore in.

Digest more Tomorrow. Think I'm going to just get ready for tonights melee.

Cheers

M

Starblayde said:

Well, don't give up. Understanding the rules of the game is like a separate meta-game apart from actually playing the game. If you take it a bit at a time, it can be a lot of fun. And because of that, these forums make for great diversions. I'd much rather read the AGoT rules forum than my Twitter feed or nytimes.com....

schrecklich said:

It feels like the game as presented by the rulebook (which, barring some events and response timings, I had a handle on) and the game as presented by the FAQs (whichs is another thing entirely) are actually two completely different games. I very much enjoy playing it, just may not master it quite as quickly as I expected!

Starblayde said:

Same here, you know I really need to write down the predicaments as they happen, there was another couple of issues that came up tonight and because I didnt write down as game was playing with a view to later copying onto forum, thus, I've now ended up not being able to recall.