...or 'fan'- had to try for the alliteration. Anyway...

Generally speaking, I dislike multiplayer in CCGs. I've played Lord of the Rings TCG (Decipher), Warlord CCG, Star Wars CCG (No real multiplayer format), some Magic and a couple others, and in nearly all cases I've found a distaste for the multiplayer system. I am not certain what specifically I dislike, but I will try to spell it out as well as I can. I think in a lot of cases, the thing that bugs me the most is the way that a 'threat' (whether real or percieved) is dealt with can cause a player to be ganged up on- whether it is that that player has an early lead, or that player is simply playing a faction or card that is hindering the other players, it seems that in almost all cases, that player is targeted by the other 3 together and eliminated quickly and ruthlessly, with little recourse.

Now, I assume since this is, of course, all ABOUT politics to a degree (the Game of Thrones itself, if you will), that it is still somewhat like that in this game- don't piss off the other players early or they will take you to task. But I'd really LIKE to like this game better than others in this area, as several of my friends who play have extolled the virtues of Melee. So, sell me on it if you can. Is it possible to come back from or survive multiple players targeting you? How much of the game play in a Melee tournament is about one's skill in deckbuilding and playing the game, and how much is about one's skill in saying the right things and not being the 'target' of everyone else?

Just play with your friends and try it out.

I don't think any amount of text is going to really give you what you need to determine whether you like it or not (but based on your statements, you probably won't). It's like someone who doesn't like cheese asking people to convince him that he should really enjoy that slice of Edam

If you do like melee it will be because the titles allow for a level of manipulation of who can and cannot attack you. When you see others perceive you to be the threat you start choosing titles to protect yourself.

Another thing to consider is that if you build decks that are frequently being seen as playing threatening cards that annoy all players then you need to rethink the way you build multiplayer decks.

There is something to be said for global effect cards, but which ones to play and when to play them is part of what divides good multi-player players from great multi-player players. If you toss out the biggest threat expect to have people try to remove it, even if it means a number of your opponents joining together to do it.

Is this Chris Schoenthal (apologies if I misspelled that)?

Heh, so it is. Who is this?

imrahil327 said:

welcome Chris. Melee is real fun for what it is. It is a crazy environment to try and be 'good' at because of the exact reasons you detail. Generally speaking melee involves someone "going off" for the win on a turn and so the beginning is people trying to setup for that one big turn.

you have nailed the downsides...whether or not you can still have fun is up to you.

Cool, good to see another friendly face I did realize something last night that may help improve my feelings toward it, and that is that since it is so well integrated and supported within the community, it will be much more expected and less of a side thing. For all of the games above that I mentioned, I've been to 'tournaments' for their multiplayer formats, but in many cases people didn't actually prepare for them, instead bringing a single player deck, finding a teammate (in the case of Warlord), and going from there, which leads to less fun when they realize that it is poorly tuned for a multiplayer game and get crushed. But since it's basically half the game in AGOT, it's far less likely that that will happen, which is nice.

Just someone who played a lot of LotR back in the day. Jonathan Benton - not sure if we even played but your screen name rang a bell. Good to see you playing (or thinking about playing) Thrones!

Summer Targ/Stark Alliance deck. Use 3 Lethal Counterattacks and 3 Field of Fires to kill your opponent's characters when they are attacking each other. It will become fun very quickly for you.

longclaw said:

Oh hey, I remember you too! All sorts of familiar faces in here, this is great!

First Warlord, then SWCCG, and now this game.

Wow, I just read the 13 page "GenCon Melee" thread, and it pretty much speaks to all of the points (and counterpoints) that I've gone through about this...if nothing else, I'm glad that I won't be working through these issues alone.

Also, hello for the 3rd game, kremm! One of these times we'll have to actually meet...

Copied from an earlier post

I am well aware that I am in the minority here and going against the grain but Melee is the only game that matters. Joust is some silly simulation of a perfect world where 2 enemies engage in heads up battle until a winner is declared. I have no problem playing certain games like that but thats not the Game of Thrones. (i capitalize for dramatic effect) Game of Thrones is inherently about deals and manipulation, seeing the whole board and making assumptions on the way things are going to shake out. I think the real genius of this game is the ability of the game designers to create an experience that feels much like the books feel. .Melee feels authentic or at least "nedly." While Joust just feels like the Tourney for Joffreys 13th name day. . . .. sad, empty and lacking danger. If you really want to win a game on your merits win a game of melee, because there is no greater win than being able to see the board and where it will go, manipulate alliances and stupidity, anticipate hostility and resentment, point out a false threat to focus your opponents on while you put yourself in position to steal the win. A Champion title should be given only when including the results of melee, Joust takes intelligent deckbuilding and intelligent play, melee takes intelligent deckbuilding, intelligent play, manipulation, strategy and misdirection. No offense to anyone who won a joust title, but melee is the Game of Thrones.

just waxing poetic about my love of Melee. Another point i have is that i have had many a joust games conceded to me, i have never had a melee game conceded to me. It is just too chaotic and unpredictable for the other players at the table to see you at 13 power and know that there is nothing they can do to stop you. Because most times they can stop you, which is why a lot of people play melee by gearing up for a big push, in a way stealing the win by gaing a decent amount of power in one turn. Which makes it more exciting IMO