Even before I told any of my players, here it is !

1. According to the rulebook, page 28 : a Space Marine wearing his armour only (no other gear) is a bit more than 2,10 m (7 feet) high and weights between 500 and 1000 kg.

2. Space Marines are commonly seen 7 feet high and Terminators, 8 feet high.

3. According to the rulebook, page 271 : to have access to a Terminator armour, you must have at least 60 points of Renown.

So for me, the height and weight of a Space Marine is determined by the number of Renown points he has. Wich can make sense if you consider heroes to be greater (taller) than others. So here is my chart folowing this idea (wich perfectly matches the rules !)

Renown (+3 points each line) Height (+1 cm each line) Weight (+14 kg each line)
------------ 0, 1, 2 ----------------------------------- 2, 01 meters -------------------------- 320 kg -----------
------------ 3, 4, 5 ----------------------------------- 2, 02 meters -------------------------- 334 kg -----------
------------ 6, 7, 8 ----------------------------------- 2, 03 meters -------------------------- 348 kg -----------
---------- 9, 10, 11 --------------------------------- 2, 04 meters -------------------------- 362 kg -----------
--------- 12, 13, 14 --------------------------------- 2, 05 meters -------------------------- 376 kg -----------
--------- 15, 16, 17 --------------------------------- 2, 06 meters -------------------------- 390 kg -----------
--------- 18, 19, 20 --------------------------------- 2, 07 meters -------------------------- 404 kg -----------
--------- 21, 22, 23 --------------------------------- 2, 08 meters -------------------------- 418 kg -----------
--------- 24, 25, 26 --------------------------------- 2, 09 meters -------------------------- 432 kg -----------
--------- 27, 28, 29 --------------------------------- 2, 10 meters -------------------------- 446 kg -----------
--------- 30, 31, 32 --------------------------------- 2, 11 meters -------------------------- 460 kg -----------
--------- 33, 34, 35 --------------------------------- 2, 12 meters -------------------------- 474 kg -----------
--------- 36, 37, 38 --------------------------------- 2, 13 meters -------------------------- 488 kg -----------
--------- 39, 40, 41 --------------------------------- 2, 14 meters -------------------------- 502 kg -----------
--------- 42, 43, 44 --------------------------------- 2, 15 meters -------------------------- 516 kg -----------
--------- 45, 46, 47 --------------------------------- 2, 16 meters -------------------------- 530 kg -----------
--------- 48, 49, 50 --------------------------------- 2, 17 meters -------------------------- 544 kg -----------
--------- 51, 52, 53 --------------------------------- 2, 18 meters -------------------------- 558 kg -----------
--------- 54, 55, 56 --------------------------------- 2, 19 meters -------------------------- 572 kg -----------
--------- 57, 58, 59 --------------------------------- 2, 20 meters -------------------------- 586 kg -----------
-------------- 60+ ------------------------------------ 2, 21 meters -------------------------- 600 kg -----------

1. I figured out that a Mk VII armour adds 10 cm to Height : 5 cm sole + 5 cm helmet up it's crest (1 inch crest + 1 inch helmet thickness)

2. A Mk VII armour adds 180 kg to Weight (from Varthion's Helm : 18 kg helmet + 162 kg for the rest of the armour)

3. I figured out that a Terminator armor adds 20 cm to Height : 10 cm sole + 10 cm helmet

4. A Terminator armour adds 400 kg to Weight (from Apothecary's Helm : 30 kg helmet + 370 kg for the rest of the armour)

*** From that chart you can see that a beginning Space Marine in Mk VII armour is 2,11 meters high (a bit more than 7 feet) and weights 500 kg...

*** Same for a Terminator (60 points of renown) : 2, 41 meters (a bit more than 8 feet) and 1000 kg.

*** And you can see that a naked Terminator is bigger (2, 21 meters for 600 kg) than a beginning Space Marine in Mk VII armour (2, 11 meters for 500 kg).

Enjoy !

And if u losse some renown u will shrink ?

I believe the change in height is due to the fact that the armor is thicker and heavier and all that.

boruta666 said:

No but you would not continue to grow up until you get your renown at a higher level than before... Easy to keep track of that with this chart... And, by the way, notice that you stop growing at 60 points of Renown or more too.

Control said:

Yeah, a Mk VII armour has soles of 5 cm, it's helmet is one inch thick (2,5 cm) and above that on this helmet there's a crest giving 2,5 cm more... The total is +10 cm to a Space Marine's Height comparing to when he's naked.

I smell orky heresy in the air....

LockLock said:

Prove me wrong with the Codex-Rulebook or find a better idea if you can...

Well if only 10cm is added, then every model and piece of artwork from both GW and FF is poorly done and scaled incorrectly. They should probably get on top of that.

Control said:

I scaled with a ruler quite a few pictures to come to this conclusion. It's so also for the sake of simplicity you're right but it matches everything perfectly... Besides, the "one inch helmet thickness rule" is canon...

Control said:

Well, with regards to the miniatures, they're not properly proportioned anyway - 40k models are "heroic scale", which means that the head, arms and weapons are exaggerated for emphasis, and no 40k model is correctly scaled against any other 40k model - note, for example, how the Catachan Jungle Fighter models have biceps thicker than a Marine's arm including the armour, or how Space Marines don't stand taller (not by much, but they are only meant to be 7 foot tall in armour, approximately - so says Jes Goodwin, who designed the look of the modern Space Marine, and has done more in the last two decades to define the 40k imagery than almost any other individual) and broader than a normal human model. Arguably the only Space Marine model that's even close to properly proportioned is the Brother-Captain Artemis model for the Inquisitor range (as the model's relative size and proportions were scaled down from the life-size drawing of a Space Marine that exists in the GW Design Studio)

As a lot of the art tends to end up being based on the biased proportions of the miniatures (because they're readily available reference material), there's a lot of art of Space Marines that's scaled incorrectly too...

N0-1_H3r3 said:

To illustrate, it's worth noting that the Inquisitor range of models uses weapons the same size as the standard 28mm mini's.

But the important fluff note here is that Space Marine creation can only be completed ( I believe the Black Carapace is the last thing to be installed ) when a Space Marine is fully grown.

As Control said, it is common that more distinguished SM's have larger armour but it's certainly not linear as I believe it's common for an SM to wear his armour for his entire life (indeed several marines are going to wear each suit). They will be re-painted and gain more decoration and honours though.

Saigneur said:

INNOCENCE PROVES NOTHING!!!111one

Besides, growing in size as you fight wars is a distinctly orkish trait. I'd like a few of your geneseed samples for testing.

What in the Emperor's name.........

Okay, I honestly see NO way a Space Marine will grow like an ork. Nothing in the fluff supports this. Nothing in *common sense* supports this.

Seconded, thirded and fourthdededed. No growing of marines, ever!

If anything, the heights listed in the book are fine but the weights are a bit liberal. We've opted to run on a more realistic option that the lightest of astartes weigh as much as modern day Mr.Universe/Olympian, super heavy weight boxers etc, whilst the heaviest (generally either more squat or taller by a long way) up to twice this.

The book suggesting marines can weigh up to 1000kg on their own? That's nuts. Throw on terminator armour, chainfist, assault cannon and cyclone missile launcher... you soon weigh 2000kg plus... it's stupidly heavy considering the fiction says marines don't just demolish all floors they walk on, and can in no way attempt to use non-astartes vehicles and furniture.

Kasatka said:

The 1000kg seems a bit much aye, but the 500kg for an unarmed Space Marine in Power Armour seems to make sense. With 180kg for the Power Armour itself, that would leave about 320kg for the Marine itself. Considering the size, bulk, extra organs, black carapace and reinforced bones of a Space Marine that seems about right. That would put a Terminator armoured Space Marine armed with a Chainfist, an Assault Cannon and a Cyclone Missile Launcher at ~950kg, which also seems reasonable.

I suppose the 1000kg is the extreme end for a Space Wolve Iron Priest loaded with cybernetic replacement limbs and a beergut.

Redemption NL said:

Well the book doesn't state "in full gear" but seems to suggest that is the base height and weight of a naked astartes, if i recall correctly.

Kasatka said:

No, it states the following:

Whilst wearing their power armour , an unarmed Space Marine typically stands slightly over 2.1 metres tall and weighs between 500–1,000 kg. (Pg 28.)

Apologies then, i am only running from memory. Still, the book is very liberal in the weights they assign. The heights are spot on however, as an astartes should only be standing about a foot taller than a normal human.

Nerdynick said:

I'm not the only one to think Space Marines grow (click on this picture to go to the web page from where it comes) :

And my Space Marines WILL grow because my common sense tells me it's so far the best way to explain that ANY Space Marine can become someday an 8 feet Terminator... Besides it making Hero Space Marines taller than others, wich is in the spirit of 40k's epic setting in my opinion.

Saigneur said:

You mean besides Terminator armour being huge?

Armour size is not a conforting answer... Because there's 1 foot difference between the two ! Mk VII armour adding nothing to size while Terminator armour adds 1 foot is not logic to me. You can always say that Mk VII adds 1 foot while Terminator armour adds 2 for example but, besides being illogical compared to pictures, that'd mean a naked Space Marine is roughly 6 feet tall... So the most satisfying explanation is still growth to me.

A marine's head is not at the top of his terminator armor, the armor goes above his head.

Also, artwork in general tends to show the most heroic figures as being physically larger. It's symbolic. I'm pretty darn sure there have been numerous discussions about the 40k art here.

And really, the Deathwatch rulebooks, codices, etc. go into SUCH great detail about a Space Marine's every abnormality... you'd think they'd list something as outlandish as growing in proportion to their success on the battlefield.

Captain Ventris said:

I know, that why I wrote that a helmet adds 2,5 cm from it's thickness and another 2,5 cm from it's little crest... But if you mean that other parts of the armor tops that, I'm afraid I need to underline that anyone's size is meant from head to toe.

Captain Ventris said:

Then I think our games should follow this artwork's symbolicness... You're free to play that Space Marine's don't really look like what the artwork shows if you want but I won't follow you there...

Captain Ventris said:

Yet "SUCH great detail" don't explain how a Space Marine, that is a bit more than 7 feet in size, becomes an 8 feet Terminator... That's why we try to answer such questions here...

They don't. They become a seven foot Space Marine in an 8 foot suit of armor which has massive foot pads. The thing's got fiber bundles, I seriously doubt you'd actually need to be as big as the armor is for it to transfer your movements.

Captain Ventris said:

You must not have given much though to why I made this rule but... Ok then how tall is your "seven foot Space Marine" naked ? 6 feet ? I can't think he's less than 2 meters tall... And because the Mk VII armour weights 180 kg and the Terminator armour 400 kg, the rulebook implies than the Space Marine's own weight (just without armour) varies between 320 and 600 kg...